Hand Tools

ERNIEB · Aug 15, 2001

OK, all those high dollar power tools are fine and dandy, but sooner or later you have to pick up a wrench or a socket and rachet.
Ever since I was a teenager, I've heard Snap on is the best. I see they are on the web now, Yeow! talk about sticker shock. No wonder mechanics charge so much, they have to pay for their tools/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif
Matco and SK are two others I know of that are sold off trucks, don't know much about them except they seem a bit more resonable.
Most of my stuff is Craftsmen. Resonable, lifetime warrenty, seemed good to me, and for the most part they have been. I do have a 3/8 rachet that has started sliping, and I intended to take it back(it's about 2 years old). I haven't checked yet, but someone told me Sears no longer offers lifetime on it's tools. I know they now sell a Sears brand tool that is made in Tiawan, and is inferior. I have a few other brands too.
So what are some of you buying? Which brand is the best buy? Anybody have any tools from harbor frieght or Northern?

Ernie

AndyR · Aug 15, 2001

My 3/8" Craftsmen ratchet started slipping last year. I took it into the local Sears and they just threw it in one bin and had me take my pick from another. no hassles. I'll admit that the newer Sears tools are not the quality of the old but I haven't heard anything about discontinuing the warranty for "Craftsmen" series.

Andy in NH

mlmartin · Aug 15, 2001

I recently purchased the 241 piece tool set at Sears. It was a customer return marked down to $184 from their MSRP of $229. They had a manager's special on their clearance items, so I got another 20% off. Clearly marked on the box and on all of their displays was their lifetime warranty. Break it, bring in the remains and get it replaced.

If it hadn't been so cheap, I wouild probably just have bought the 1/2 inch breaker bar and 7/8 in that I went in their for/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Matthew

Bird · Aug 15, 2001

Ernie, I guess Snap-on was the first of the tool trucks calling on the garages with a portable showroom. They had quality tools, high prices, and built a good reputation; now I think they're just trying to live on that reputation instead of keeping up. Then along came the others (Mac and Matco which used to be together, then split to two separate companies), Cornwell, and even Craftsman trucks calling on the garages. I've repaired enough air tools from all of them in the last 3 years, and my brother, as a Matco distributor, took enough Snap-on trade-ins in tool boxes and other tools for me to have what I'd consider some pretty well informed opinions. Snap-on is no better and no worse than Mac and Matco in most things. Each of them occasionally puts out an item that doesn't turn out too well, but overall they're all good; kind of like whether Kubota, New Holland, or John Deere is the best tractor. For me at least, Snap-on parts are too expensive, so I wouldn't buy one (John Deere of the tool world/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif). Craftsman isn't quite up to par with Snap-on, Mac, and Matco, but certainly not bad for the price, and more than adequate for most do-it-yourselfers. And yes, I even have some tools from Harbor Freight (if you ever need a part, you can't get it anywhere else, and you'll be lucky if they still have it, but often their tools are cheap enough to be disposables anyway) and Northern Tool (they have some very cheap junk and they have some name brand, good stuff). I guess like most things, if you know specifically what you need and what you want to do with it, any of them can be right for you. Incidentally, I'm not trying to sell any of them. My brother recently got out of the business and I sold the air tool repair business.

Incidentally, buying tools off the tool trucks is not, in my opinion, the best way to go unless you're a professional mechanic working in a garage. It's expensive to operate that truck, and the main reason they do so well is that the mechanics most often do not pay cash or credit card. They make weekly payments (with no interest in most cases), the truck comes around once a week, so if they need warranty on anything they don't have to ship it back, they just give it to the driver when he comes by, they don't have to spend time going shopping, etc. But for most things the rest of us can go shopping and get what we need cheaper.

BirdEdited by Bird on 08/15/01 10:04 PM (server time).

ERNIEB · Aug 16, 2001

Glad to hear craftsman still has the lifetime waranty.
Matthew, I just bought a 1/2 breaker bar myself, except I got mine at Home Depot and its a Husky. They are also marked lifetime warranty. They didn't have any deals like you ran across/w3tcompact/icons/wink.gifI have a very old Husky 1/2 drive that came from my Dad. Rusty and no chrome, but it still works.

Ernie

ERNIEB · Aug 16, 2001

Bird, I guess the steel that goes into the tool is what is important. In the cheaper tools the steel is softer, or something. For example, I've had some boxed end wrenches that round out. I had a Sears 3/8 rachet that I was using on some rusty bolts and it busted to pieces. I should have used a breaker bar, but I didn't want to go get one, and I didn't think the thing would break that easy.
Cheap tools are a waste. So are the "gimmick" tools.

Ernie

bgott · Aug 16, 2001

The biggest problem I had with Craftsman is that the store is always out of stock of the tool you broke. I hated breaking a 1/2" or a 13MM socket, for example. I'd get off work, maybe remember that I'd broke the tool and bring it with me, drive 15 miles to the Sears store just to find that they were out of stock. I found it easier to search the pawnshops for a rack of Snap-on or Mac sockets and when I broke one hop on the truck when it showed up once a week and be done with it. I never had any problem with their end wrenches. I've doubled up wrenches countless times and not broken one. I bought a set of their "Professional" end wrenches just to get the extra length. The professional line looks and feels like a Snap- on for about $300. a set less. That gave me more money to spend on scanners and DSOs.

Boondox · Aug 16, 2001

Ernie -- My 3/8 Craftsman ratchet just crapped out and they replaced it no questions asked with one from their "rebuilt" bin. I was expecting a new tool, but the rebuilt works just fine.

Pete

www.GatewayToVermont.com

mlmartin · Aug 16, 2001

Do you know the difference between a $200 five year warranty water heater and a $270 seven year warranty water heater?

$70/w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Lifetime warranties like Sear's aren't really a guarantee of quality. They price the tools to cover the actuarially computed cost of replacement. I wouldn't normally buy tools from Sears, but at the price I paid, they cost no more than "limited warrantee" tools and the Sears store is only two miles from my house. Getting warranty service will be a snap.

I've had Husky tools. I can't remember breaking any, so I have no experience with using their warranty. I once found a broken Craftsman 3/8 ratchet on the side of the road and Sears "replaced" it, no questions asked.

Matthew (who is wonder what to do with all those 1/4 inck drive sockets)

Youare · Aug 16, 2001

In this area of New Hampshire where I live there is a brand of hand tools under the Blackhawk name which are life time replacement quality tools, there not inexpensive. Just down the road in Greenfield, Ma. is a hand tool manufacturing plant that makes tools for several different brand names, I believe Matco is one of them. A few years back there was a company which marketed a line of tools under the Easco name, they were reported to be the supplier for the Craftsman line of hand tools. I have a set of 1/4" drive sockets made by them I really like, and a 1/2" breaker bar.

Many hand tools are made by the same manufacturer but marketed under different brand names. The quality of the steel and heat treat process is the key to a lasting tool. Most of the time you get what you pay for, but with some brands you pay for the name too. I have found a good quality tool is less expensive in the long run, especially if I break that socket or wrench while trying to fix something when all the stores are closed.

Bird · Aug 16, 2001

Many hand tools are made by the same manufacturer but marketed under different brand names

Hand tools and power tools, too. I don't know for sure about Snap-on, but I know that the only thing Matco actually makes themselves, owns the factory, etc. is their toolboxes. And I'm pretty sure Mac is the same, and of course Sears doesn't make Craftsman themselves either. I suspect the others do the same as Matco. When a supplier makes, or proposes, a new item for them, they have their own testing facility, which I've visited, to see what it takes to break it./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

Hand ratchets are so easily broken, or worn out, and so easily repaired, that some of the tool trucks carry the new parts and the distributor just fixes them on the spot.

Bird

bpence · Aug 16, 2001

I have a tool box full of Craftsman hand tools - wrenches, sockets, ratchets, screwdrivers, other stuff - and really have no complaints. I've broken a few wrenches through the years and Sears has always just handed me a new one when I took the broken one into a store. I also have a set of 1/2" drive SK sockets that my Dad bought in the 50's. These are great. The ratchet has been rebuilt twice - takes a licking and keeps on ticking.

Bob Pence

ERNIEB · Aug 16, 2001

Bob, I have a couple of SK sockets. I don't remember where I got them from, but they seem to be pretty good. I'd like to look at some of their stuff, but have no idea who might be selling it.

Ernie

Bird · Aug 16, 2001

Ernie, try http://www.autobodysupply.net/SKhandtools/skhandtools.htm

Bird

ERNIEB · Aug 16, 2001

All kinds of neat stuff on that site Bird. Have you ordered anything from them?

Ernie

Bird · Aug 16, 2001

No, Ernie, I don't know anything about them; just found their web site is all.

Bird

bgott · Aug 17, 2001

If I could get by with only using 1/4" drive sockets, I would. I have 1/4" sockets up to 5/8" and 15 mm. If you get to working on todays rinky-dink little FWD cars you need all the clearance you can get. The small stuff is a lot lighter, too.

PBMAX · Aug 17, 2001

hey I keep a few cheapies around for the wife.She tends to leave them out side on occasion and as you could imagine this keeps my eyes from bulging when she does it.She isn't big enough(patete)(sp?) to break them any way.5'4" and 100lbs wet...I tend to buy craftsmen my self.Had good use and luck over the yrs.Even changed a flat tire on a pontiac with a sparkplug socket and ratchet using a pipe bender for leverage.Off and on no sweat...have broken a few cheapies,sockets mostly.Always kept a cheap set in the trunk when I was in the NAV...Theft was often high in the areas around base and didn't want some but head to get my good set along with a stereo...

Laziness is the Father of invention.../w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif
Lil' Paul
Proud owner of TC21D

Anonymous Poster · Aug 30, 2001

Much of Snap-On sales is credit sales to mechanics where the dealer carries the note. The price is way high so that the dealer still makes a profit even if the mechanic skips town, and a whole bunch of them do.

I have a lot of Snap-On, and I also think they are way over priced. The chemical company I work for buyes a snap on screwdriver for less than $2.00 through a contract. The local truck driver dealer sells the same screwdriver for almost $8. Go figure.

Good brands include, in order of my perceived quality, :
Snap-On, Armstrong, Mac, Matco, Proto, Cornwell, Craftsman.
SK is OK.
All tools made by Cooper group companies are well made.

The Chinese are making inexpensive junk right now, but you can buy a complete 3/4" set for what Snap-On askes for one socket. If you use them for a hobby they usually will get the nut off.

I shop for tools at some pawn shops. Just don't go to a pawn shop looking for a 19mm Snap-On deep impact socket.

ebay also has a lot of tools.

pokey