Harvey in Haiti

   / Harvey in Haiti #21  
I have a dream. That dream is of an excavator lifting the trash out of the canals and placing it into a large tank. That tank contains a cleaing solution that kills bacteria like ecoli and cholera. Then the trash is rinsed and placed where sorting and processing takes place.

There are some conventional recycling of plastic bottle programs on the island. I've already talked to one about them having processing equipment at this location to pick up the bottles that they want. The really bad stuff like the film and foam plastics will be processed into building blocks for housing. The organic based stuff like paper will be processed into briquettes. Charcoal is the most common cooking fuel here in Haiti.

The big problem for me in this dream is the sanitizing tank. Someone mentioned to me the use of salt water. The ocean is right there. There has to be a salinity level that will kill the bacteria. It would be the most cost effective and natural solution I believe. If you know anyone with the skill set and knowledge to find the answer it would be wonderful.

We want to clean up the plastic trash and provide a way to make the best homes at any price. But we don't want to make Haitians sick doing it.

Just think about a modern septic system. All that is needed to destroy harmful bacteria is to filter the material/sludge through sand. The sand is colonized by various non pathogenic amoeba and bacteria that feed on the pathogens. It can be self sustaining and built above ground. Systems like that are used in many areas that have high water tables. Trouble is getting a set up like that built to scale for a city of two million plus. Pretty soon you are talking about a sewage treatment plant like we have on Deer Island in Boston that cost about a billion bucks. :confused:
 
   / Harvey in Haiti
  • Thread Starter
#22  
Not sure I agree with that. When I was there last year Cite Soleil was openly run by violent gangs and thugs. Urban warlords controlled the place. The local police would not go there at all and the UN security troops would only travel there in heavily armored convoys. We had to have one of our teams extracted by the 82nd Airborne after a dispute over who was calling the shots in a latrine clean up and drainage operation! Maybe things have changed but for a long time Cite Soleil has been a great example of how little authority the Haitian government has even within the capital city and it represented the type of lawless post Armageddon society one usually associates with Mel Gibson's early movies.

Things change. We have three young ladies who work out of here that are better protection at any hour in cite soleil than a convoy of UN troops. I was in cite soleil in a UN car a couple of weeks ago. There was an interesting conversation with some real deal thugs at one point. One of the people with us said the least secure they ever felt in cite soleil was that trip because we were in the UN Toyota Highlander.

There was a God war killing just two days before our visit. One religious charity was having a dispute over a piece of ground with another religious charity. A Haitian head of logistics for one of the charities was gunned down, 14 round statement, in front of witnesses. It seems intentionally or otherwise the gangs became involved and the gang god said his piece.

The Haitians want a hand up and not a hand out for the most part. Ten thousand charities operating before the earthquake have trained Haitians to behave inappropriately by rewarding begging and corruption at all levels. There is now about thirty thousand charities and they have reinforced the concept that bad behavior works.
 
   / Harvey in Haiti
  • Thread Starter
#23  
Just think about a modern septic system. All that is needed to destroy harmful bacteria is to filter the material/sludge through sand. The sand is colonized by various non pathogenic amoeba and bacteria that feed on the pathogens. It can be self sustaining and built above ground. Systems like that are used in many areas that have high water tables. Trouble is getting a set up like that built to scale for a city of two million plus. Pretty soon you are talking about a sewage treatment plant like we have on Deer Island in Boston that cost about a billion bucks. :confused:

Everyone pretty much agrees that our thousand gallons of water to dispose of one gallon of feces is going to go away sooner than later. There isn't enough water on the planet for six billion people to have the sewage facilities of Americans.
 
   / Harvey in Haiti #24  
Harvey around 02 I was running a 400 Komatsu long reach hoe with a basket bucket cleaning up floating debris in the water. After a storm there was alot of tras washed up in a cove on the TN river. THe dirt bucket was about a yard on the original machine but the basket bucket was made from bars stock and about 5 yards. We skimmed several thousands of yards of material in one cove. We had a 5 yard basket clam to but I never got to use it. They also had an elevator pontoon. It was a setr of pontoons with a small duetz on it and it had a frame that looked like an elevator off a paddle wheel scraper but with mill chains. It has small baskets on the paddles that gatherethe materials and dumped them on a big basket on the back. THis was made for weed and polution control pickup. We picked up tons of drift wood and bottles with it.
 
   / Harvey in Haiti
  • Thread Starter
#25  
Harvey around 02 I was running a 400 Komatsu long reach hoe with a basket bucket cleaning up floating debris in the water. After a storm there was alot of tras washed up in a cove on the TN river. THe dirt bucket was about a yard on the original machine but the basket bucket was made from bars stock and about 5 yards. We skimmed several thousands of yards of material in one cove. We had a 5 yard basket clam to but I never got to use it. They also had an elevator pontoon. It was a setr of pontoons with a small duetz on it and it had a frame that looked like an elevator off a paddle wheel scraper but with mill chains. It has small baskets on the paddles that gatherethe materials and dumped them on a big basket on the back. THis was made for weed and polution control pickup. We picked up tons of drift wood and bottles with it.

It wouldn't surprise me to find myself designing and building the bucket. If I do you can be sure I will lean on you for advice.
 
   / Harvey in Haiti #26  
Harvey,
This is all very interesting to follow what you are doing. So with all those charities down there, I gather there is a lot of corruption.
See safe.
hugs, Brandi
 
   / Harvey in Haiti #27  
Harvey you may be leaning on a blind man there lol. I may dig up my parts books to the thing I know it was shop made but I may have some maintenance drawings. The clam was a factory rig. THe excavator bucker was really a stout frame withthe basket welded inside.
 
   / Harvey in Haiti
  • Thread Starter
#28  
Harvey,
This is all very interesting to follow what you are doing. So with all those charities down there, I gather there is a lot of corruption.
See safe.
hugs, Brandi

What's sad Brandi is most of the charities do more harm long term than good.

One of the nice things about being where I was today in the worst part of Port
Au Prince is I don't have children begging. That's because your average person on a mission to save Haiti won't go where I am going to be working. So the kids haven't been trained by the good hearted but stupid as a stump visitor to beg.

Begging embarrasses the Haitians just like it would embarrass you if your or your neighbor's kids begged when out of towners visited your neighborhood. And the only reason the kids beg is because visitors reward them for doing it.

It has been explained to me over and over that the only way you are going to get Haitians to do anything is to pay them to do it. That is understandable when you consider their unemployment rate is staggering and the poverty can only be described as devastating.

I'm living on two meals a day now because they are provided at no cost to me. Supper was a good example, white rice, limited portion, a drumstick cooked to leather which is a good thing because of the flies etc, and a slice of avocado. Breakfast was spaghetti with some hot dog weenies tossed in. I know there was at least two weenies in there because I got two end slices on my plate and the odds are impossible for me to have that kind of good fortune if only one was cut up for the huge bowl of spaghetti.

I cannot pay anyone to work with me. But two thirty five year old Hatians are on me like paint when I move around outside the compound. It is literally like I have a secret service detail. They've worked with me on making blocks and are convinced that our idea is going to be good for Haiti. And this morning when I was invited to attend a meeting of women in one of the worst parts of Cite Soleil they were there with me.

The reason I wanted to talk to the women was I believe they are the most important voice in Haitian society because Haitians are no different from any other society. But here there is a buffer built in between men like me and Haitian women. NGOs have trained a corps of young men who get things done because they speak all the languages of the visitors and of the Haitians. You can't get anything done without them. I found that when I asked them about how the women felt about houses it was like asking any teenage boy what his mom and sisters expected in a house. They don't think about that stuff, they've got boy stuff to deal with already.

I met a young lady yesterday that taught meditation and breathing exercises to these women as part of a program to help PTSD patients. These women all qualify many times over because of the rapes, the poverty, and the earthquake. Families were destroyed in the earthquake because so many died.

She was going back because they had asked her to visit them again if she could. I was invited along and thought it would be a good idea for purely selfish reasons. My thinking was taking advantage of her relationship by being seen with her. That way when I came back with our Ubuntu-blox they would see me a little better than if I showed up out of the blue.

We waited or two hours in the heat and then they called us to the front of the group to talk about Ubuntu-blox. I was just going to do a brief overview and then get out of there to let them do what they were there to do in the first place. I had my two guys who did the interpreting for me and it went south quickly. It was assumed that I was like everyone else and I was going to give them all a house that would never happen.

Tough audience, stiff questions, harsh replies, I was unprepared for the brutal honesty. It was also heart breaking to realize their reality was based upon good meaning people being the cruelest of cruel and never knowing it.

Then we got across the point that I wasn't there to build them a house. I was there to help them build good houses by using the plastic trash all around them. Haitians were going to build the houses, I was there to help them with the design and methods.

It got personal When was I going to help them? Was I going to be back to build houses? Who got the first house? you get the idea.

Then I got lucky I told them about micro financing in Bangladesh and how the women worked together to make lives better for women. I suggested they do the same thing. They can collect the plastic and we'll come in and help them to build the blocks. They figure out who gets the first house and we will all work together to build that house. We do that over and over again until everyone gets a house than can have one. But it is women helping women and that is the only way it will happen. If this didn't work it wouldn't be the government's fault or any NGOs fault. If it failed it would be their fault.

It got personal again. When was I coming back to help them get started making the blocks?

We start next wednesday.
 
   / Harvey in Haiti #29  
Harvey, who owns the land the houses will be built on? If they do not have title to the land, then will the houses actually be built for the land owners?
 
   / Harvey in Haiti #30  
txdon said:
Harvey, who owns the land the houses will be built on? If they do not have title to the land, then will the houses actually be built for the land owners?

Land titles in Haiti are a nightmare. There are often forged titles competing with real ones, the land courts are either nonexistent or politically controlled. The government is too disorganized and powerless to fix the mess. As a result, squatters rule, especially in the anarchy of Port au Prince.
 

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