Help choosing a welder

   / Help choosing a welder #91  
here is a really good pdf file from Lincoln that talks about the various electrode types, some of their uses, and also what amp range to run them in.

I prefer Miller machines myself, but do have a Lincoln TIG.
 
   / Help choosing a welder #92  
OK you guys, I owe you an apology. I re-read this thread just now, and after reading it today, I have no idea how I read what thought I read yesterday. What I read (or misread) somehow in my mind got taken totally out of context. So again, I apologize for my comments. Today I see that they were totally out of line with what was posted.:( I don't know what else to say.

Let's move on, OK?

Or, beat me more if you must...



The difference in welding with AC and DC is not such a fine distinction as to not be noticed by an observant person. The characteristics ARE NOT THE SAME.
Exactly what I said earlier. The arc characteristics are different, but overall, the end results are similar. I did not say exactly the same, but similar.

Lets conduct a little poll and maybe learn something... Do we have any technically trained professional welders here? If not, do we have folks with access to same?
Yes, my father is a professionally trained welder. He taught me how to weld many many moons ago. I still frequently ask him for advice on making two pieces of metal stick together.

Given the availability of a welding machine that can provide either AC or DC, when and how often do they select AC over DC and why?
With the SMAW (stick) process, AC is almost never selected over DC when welding if DC is available. One exception is when stick welding Aluminum. That must be done with AC. Another time when AC would be selected over DC is when an output higher than the DC capability of the welding machine is required, as I stated in a previous post. Another time when AC is selected over DC is when arc blow is encountered while welding with DC current. Susceptibility to arc blow is a distinct disadvantage to welding with DC current. If you're not familiar with arc blow, I can explain it for you...

Why grind on this issue? Someone asked for help/advice. If DC is as I suspect, better in most instances than AC, then good advice would be to go the extra expense and get a buzz box that also supplies DC. If in certain instances AC is to be preferred then the guy will be prepared as the welder will offer both AC and DC. This is not to say that AC doesn't weld OK but what if DC is better enough of the time to warrant the extra cost? Then it is better to advise the guy to go AC/DC.
Let me dig out and quote from "Welding Essentials, Questions and Answers, Expanded First Edition". It says it all better than I can...
"In general, which is better to weld with, AC or DC power?

DC almost always provides the most stable arc, and more even metal transfer than AC. Once struck, the DC arc remains continuous. When welding with AC, the arc extinguishes and restrikes 120 times per second as the current and voltage reverses direction. A DC arc has good wetting action of the molten weld metal and uniform weld bead size at low welding currents. For this reason it is excellent for welding thin sections. DC is preferred to AC on overhead and vertical welding jobs because of its shorter arc. Sometimes arc blow is a serious problem, and the only solution may be to switch to AC. Most combination electrodes which are designed for AC or DC operation work better on DC."

"Are there any advantages in SMAW to using an AC arc over a DC arc?

There are no particular advantages to using AC over DC in the SMAW process, except the lower cost of an AC welding power supply and a possible way to get around arc blow. Equipment cost aside, AC has no great advantages."
That's what the book says. I'd liken it to an economy car vs. a luxury car. Both will get you to where you are going, but one is nicer to drive than the other. AC will get the job done, but DC gets it done better. I hate to state it like that, because it really makes AC sound worse than it really is. AC isn't that bad at all. DC is just better. Is DC that much better to pay nearly double the price for an AC/DC machine vs. a straight AC machine? It depends on who's buying the machine. I decided it was, and bought an AC/DC machine. My Dad says that if the money is coming out of his wallet, it isn't. He's the professional welder. He says you can still do anything with AC that you can do with DC... DC is just nicer to weld with... more of a "luxury", not a necessity. And, he says that he doesn't weld enough away from work to justify the added expense of AC/DC when AC alone will get the job done.

Food for thought... If DC isn't needed or useful then why supply buzz boxes that are AC/DC? Why would folks pay more to get a feature that is inferior to the AC only machine which is cheaper? So is there a conspiracy among all the major manufacturers of buzz boxes to hoodwink the public into buying "bogus" extra cost features that perform worse than the cheap version? Probably not. Most likely DC offers utility worth the difference or the units wouldn't sell.

See above... Chevy vs. Cadillac basically. DC isn't inferior to AC... but it's an expensive option...
 
   / Help choosing a welder #93  
patrick_g said:
I think I want a Nomex balaclava.

When I really get into welding mode, especially using stick rather than MIG, I wear leathers that cover my shoulders, arms, and chest/lower neck. I discovered via an arc burn on my lower throat while wearing everything I thought was needed that the little leather flaps you can attach to the bottom of your helmet will protect your neck from arc burn.Pat


I agree. i should have added that I usually wear the shoe chaps even when I have boots on, plus a leather apron. I also us ethe strap on neck piece that goes over the jacket / under the helmet to prevent that neck arcburn you mention. A also wear a beani capwith brim under the helmet.. ( but not the full head/ear one like you mention.. ).. On the flip side though.. i wear ear plugs to get away from the crackle and sizzle o f the welder.. and the chipping hammer pings.. and the grinder sound..

Moving to the leather full jacket, shoe chaps, apron, and neck protector from what i used to wear.. which was just a denim jacket and gloves .. well.. it was an entire world of an upgrade...

havn't had an arcburn since..

soundguy
 
   / Help choosing a welder #94  
Soundguy, EAR PLUGS???? I like to be able to hear the sound of the arc and think it is yet another source of feedback (maybe I need all the help I can get.) I do have to mess with my ear protection more though, swappiing back and forth.

I have the shoe covers but don't usually use them. I did learn to wear pull-on boots instead of lace-ups, especially Wally World lace up sneakers.

Funny (well, wasn't funny then) but the worst foot burn I ever got was not from welding but was soldering. I was repairing some guys stereo, sitting at a table barefoot except for flip-flops I had a big ball of solder on my Weller two speed gun and as I moved to shake it off into an ash tray it fell off prematurely and went between the two smallest toes, lodged there, and cooked me a bit. The guy waiting for his stereo says, "do you smell something cooking?" I reached down with my needle nose pliers and pulled out the solder ball and said, "yes!"

It has taken me a while but I am slowly getting around to the idea that it is better to put on the protective gear, even for just a little welding as to do otherwise is just playing Russian Roulette and not being burned every time doesn't mean it is safe. Keep doing it and you will regret it.

Pat
 
   / Help choosing a welder #95  
BTDT on the soldering.. I have a triangle shaped scar on the back of my right hand.. been there 20 years from a huge glop of solder that fell of a gun.. come to think of it.. think it was a weller as well.

I wear the ear plugs because I have really-really good hearing.. I'm one of those people that can hear a ceiling fan in another room running.. or faint noises outside will wake me up.. etc.. plus I have to make a living off my ears... Thus.. when shooting, weldiong.. hammering / grinding or running my tractor.. I have muffs or plugs in..

I work with too many people that are practically deaf due to not protecting their hearing.. to not protect my own. A little more feedback onthe welder wouldn't be too bad.. but at my (low) level of skill.. i doubt it would help much. :rolleyes: ;)

soundguy
 
   / Help choosing a welder #96  
Soundguy, I am definitely PRO hearing protection and am jealously guarding what I have left. The sound of the arc is not THAT loud.

I used to hear a bit over 21,500 in one ear and about 20K in the other but no more. I used to be able to hear the bats echo locating bugs and I could hear the ultrasonic burglar alarm systems. Too much unprotected noise exposure and many years later I have a lot of hi freq loss and tinnitus.

Pat
 
   / Help choosing a welder #97  
True the arc isn't that loud.. but when I burn rods.. I also do lots of grinding and chipping... I generally don't like to take the time to flip my helmet up, slip on the safety glasses, and then take my gloves off, put my ear plugs in, put the gloves back on, and then chip and grind.

I just flip up the green glass chip and grind.. then flip the green glas down and get back to burning rods. Saves all that time of ear plugs in and out and in and out. Chipping and other 'ping' style sounds deffinately will stay with me for minutes afterwards if i don't wear hearing protection.. My hearing is good and sensitive.. so i baby it... being a deaf sound engineer won't get me real far...

soundguy
 
   / Help choosing a welder #98  
Soundguy, I understand all that. I use an auto darkening helmet. It will trigger on the sparks of a grinder which makes for a bit of a "light show" flashing back and forth between shade 9 and shade 11-14. So I have to raise the helmet anyway to grind (I wear glasses) and with the muffs handy or sometimes I use the ear plugs on a curved plastic yoke, it isn't all that much of a fuss although it would be simpler to do it your way.

If the helmet had a tilt up feature for the auto darkening screen that would be cool but I get by.

Pat
 
   / Help choosing a welder #99  
When I went to NASA soldering class they would not let us wear sandals so I dont have any good burn stories to tell. :(

Although I do have some neat stories about trying to do precision wiring on a ship that is taking 20 to 30 degree rolls.
 
   / Help choosing a welder #100  
Soundguy said:
...
I wear the ear plugs because I have really-really good hearing.. I'm one of those people that can hear a ceiling fan in another room running.. or faint noises outside will wake me up.. etc.. plus I have to make a living off my ears... Thus.. when shooting, weldiong.. hammering / grinding or running my tractor.. I have muffs or plugs in..

I work with too many people that are practically deaf due to not protecting their hearing.. to not protect my own. A little more feedback onthe welder wouldn't be too bad.. but at my (low) level of skill.. i doubt it would help much. :rolleyes: ;)

soundguy

Good hearing??...HA! I can hear the birth of bacteria on a table top.!!:D
 

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