Help me choose a ~30hp CUT please...

[the_sandman_454]

Hi. I recently aquired a new home on 20 acres. The land is roughly 70% wooded, with a pond occupying some, and the rest occupied by lawn and areas that haven't been kept up very well. I am going to buy a tractor with a loader and probably a finish mower. Not long afterwards I see myself aquiring a brush hog, and a box blade as there are some fairly uneven areas, which I'd like to smooth out.

I was at a few local dealerships (one Kubota, one JD, and one Case). I need to stop back into the Case dealer since I was in a bit of a hurry at the time, and didn’t feel like waiting for the sales staff to become available.

I checked out a few different models. The JD dealership had a couple of used machines both on turf tires, a 4200 hydrostatic (I think this one had about 200 hours) with 420 loader and 72” belly mower for $16,700, a 3320 hydrostatic (~158 hours) with 72” belly mower and can add a 300CX loader for $21,500. They quoted $21575 on a brand new 3120 with a 72” 3 pt. finish mower and 300CX. Of those, I test drove the 4200, and 3320, and I think I like the 3320. I definitely like the HST pedals on the JD better than the Kubota.

At the Kubota dealer, I also looked around a bit but didn’t ask for an opportunity to play on any of these. Just sitting on the Kubotas, I didn’t really like the HST treadle thing, and I think I preferred the fender mounted loader joystick of the JD also. This dealer quoted a L3130DT with LA513 and R4 tires for $16,913, and an additional $1540 for a 3 PT finish mower. Also quoted was an L3400 HST with LA463 loader and R4 tires at $16774. L3400DT was quoted at $15662 for the same loader and tires.

Primary tasks for the short term will be mowing the lawn (will use a push mower and brush cutter in the tighter spaces), leveling a few areas, using the loader to help remove debris from a fair amount of trees I plan to remove, and removal of a few older outbuildings that are in less than optimal condition.

I didn’t try operating a gear tractor in any of the brands as yet, but I think I may not want to. For myself I am comfortable with using manual transmissions, but I suspect a handful of people will operate the machine from time to time (parents have 10 acres, and a couple of friends also with 10 ac who I can see borrowing whatever machine I happen to get at some point or another)… HST definitely seems like it would make loader work quicker though.

I guess what I’m asking in all of this is do any of the offers sound unreasonable, or anything like that. Will ~22-25PTO HP be sufficient to run a 5’ or 6’ brush hog? Sales guys didn’t seem to think it would be much of a problem, but I figured I’d better ask. Another thing, is the standard bucket sufficient on these, or should I go with the heavy duty one? I intend to get a tooth bar for whatever one I go with.

I’m in the Coleman, MI area (Central lower peninsula MI, in the Midland, Clare, Saginaw, Mt Pleasant area), if anybody has a suggestion on nearby dealers for brands I haven’t mentioned, or experience with the local dealers, I would appreciate a word about that as well.

I should also add that I'll probably call back a couple of the dealers to get quotes that reflect more closely some of the stuff I'm leaning towards (HST, etc)...

 

[RoyJackson]

"Will ~22-25 PTO HP be sufficient to run a 5’ or 6’ brush hog? "

I run a 5' rotary cutter with 24 PTO HP easily. I could probably run a 6' unit (especially a pull type) through lighter brush but the 3PH lift capacity would be borderline for a 6' 3PH cutter (pull type cutters don't get lifted, just towed). FYI, the 3320 has 25.5 PTO HP.

That 3320 is a nice machine. You might also want to try a power-reverser model, if one is available used or you buy new.

 

[jbrumberg]

If you plan do do a lot of FEL or mowing work go HST. I have had no problems running a medium duty 60" RC through some pretty nasty stuff with 23+ PTO HP . Jay

 

[ToddW]

"Will ~22-25 PTO HP be sufficient to run a 5’ or 6’ brush hog? "

I have no problem running a 5' Woods mower behind my L2800 HST (22.5 PTO HP), have run it through some very rough stuff and never bogged it down, have broken a few shear pins on some 3" trees though

/Todd

 

[Kahuna]

I checked out the Kubota and JD 3320 last fall when I was buying a new tractor. I had the same experience you did, I cannot tolerate that treadle on the Kubota.

I bought the 3320 after looking them both over pretty close. I also looked at the New Holland. The 3320 fit me so much better, it had a more comfortable work space and was a lot more user friendly. I thought it also had much better features than the Kubota. The price between the two was less than a $1000, money well spent.

I would definitely go with the heavy duty bucket. It is not that much more and worth the price. There is a lot more reinforcements on the heavy duty bucket.

The 3320 will handle a 5 foot mower with no problems. I have a 5 foot finish mower and a 6 foot MX6 John Deere cutter (bush hog). Something you may want to consider about the mid mount mower is that it will cut your usability in mowing ditches or dealing with uneven ground. The mower sits low and can get hung up when crossing or mowing a ditch. It is easier to operate than a finish mower but is is more difficult to mount and remove also. If you have only flat ground to mow, the mid mount would work good but if your constantly changing from mowing to loader work to something else you may want to seriously consider a 3 point hitch system. I have the I-match and it works very well.

 

[Z-Michigan]

Greetings - I'm only about two hours away, and also have 20 acres. I have had my Deere 5105 for about 6 weeks now. Let me first say that it is a wonderful tractor that is extremely capable. Let me also say that it seemed like the right choice at the time, and now I'm having second thoughts based on finding out what I'm actually doing with the tractor. I think the size range you're looking at is very reasonable and I would strongly recommend HST, which you already seem to be leaning towards. I'm a bit too far away to recommend specific dealers, with one exception that I will PM you. I would suggest you add Kioti to your list, as there is a dealer in Mt. Pleasant and the Kioti tractors are, I think, in the same league as the other brands you're looking at (and again, I'm a Deere owner). I would also browse over to the Power-Trac forums and website before you decide on a conventional tractor - they are an innovative design and are at least worth a look.

I would also seriously consider a cab. I didn't put any serious consideration into it and after doing some brushhogging on the one 80 degree day we had a few weeks ago, and doing miscellaneous tasks in our more recent 30 degree weather, the cab would be really, really nice to have. I think a Kubota B3030 with HST, cab and FEL would come in somewhere around 20k and might be worth a look. I wouldn't go bigger than a 5' brush mower on that model though. The 3320 is also available with a cab, I believe, but is a bit bigger and will be a bit pricier.

As to the 6' mower, I have an LX6 brushcutter and a Deere 5105 tractor with 47 PTO hp - I am massively overpowered for the 6' mower. That's not a problem (the gearbox is rated for 60, I think) but I don't *need* nearly as much power as I have for this size mower. I don't doubt the posters who report 25 is enough for a 5'. If you look at the 3120/3320 or similar size tractors I would consider a 5' mower - you may have PTO power for a 6', but the 5' may be significantly easier to maneuver and in the end not take significantly longer than the 6' would.

I think you're already planning on 4wd, but if not, definitely do get 4wd. It is invaluable for both loader work and snow work. As for tires, I have R1 ags and they have amazing traction. For my uses they are probably the right choice. Since you haven't listed any significant ground-engaging work (plowing, etc.) you may do just as well with R4 industrial tires - and that's good since R4s are by far the most common for the size of tractor you're looking at.

 

[john_bud]

Hi,

You have gotten some excellent advice so far. Especially from "Z", he just bought a tractor and has similar size property (but more fields if memory serves). For your task, 25 PTO hp is about the minimum you would want. 35 is probably the maximum. You can squeak by with 22 1/2 hp PTO, but that will impact your ability to use a 5' finish mower. Finish mowers take more power than brush hogs as they have lots of lift in the blades to swirl the grass up and shoot it out. Especially to mulch the cuttings. I would say plan on 6 hp per foot of finish mower - but I like to have a touch of reserve power. Take my bias into view here...

On the HST peddles, personal preference is a BIG deal. While I am more productive on the kubota, that by no means is an indication of it being the best. Just best for me. JD makes a great unit. The NH tractors are, in my opinion, a step down from JD or K. Not a big step, but a step. Check resale values and form your own opinion. The others (kioti, Montana, Mahindra, etc) are a step down too. The size of the step has been drastically dropping, but again my opinion is that they are a lesser unit than the JD or K. Still, you can save some bucks with one!

On cab vs no cab: If you can afford the cab - it's a good thing. If you can't afford it .... well then you are buying an open tractor like me! Expect to sweat and get covered with dust and clippings in the summer and in the winter you will shiver. You can buy a lot of cold water and warm sweaters for the price of a cab. And it will be so comfortable you may never get to operate it again - with the list of people who may "borrow" it.

(personal opinion here - I DON'T loan out my tractors. I WILL do things for people, but it is my butt in the bucket. It's like loaning money to relatives. Do it and expect to get disappointed.)

jb

 

[BigBrother44]

Love my Massey 1533 (33 engine horse, 27? PTO) with a manual trans. Love that to, simple, easy to operate and great for what I've mostly done with it for the last 60 hours (scraping, leveling, spreading gravel, moving BFR's (big freaking rocks) etc) until the other day. I spent about 1 1/2 hours cleaning a drain between my road and the mountain rising straight up beyond that with the front loader, turning around, dumping it over the cliff on the other side, over and over and over, back and forth, back and forth...

Working the clutch that much, even having to ride it way more than I like while scooping out the ditch and taking as much of a bite as I possibly could without spinning 4 R4 tires on the pavement, took me back about 2 years to when I had surgery on that knee...man it was sore! GO WITH THE HST IF YOU PLAN ON DOING ANY REPETITIVE WORK OF ANY SORT AT ALL!

Just my 2 cents...

 

[dynasim]

New Holland(Same tractor, different color as case) has a 30 hp "economical" tractor based on an old design that green and orange owners like to compare their tractors to. It is actually kind of amusing, as it is the same as comparing a Honda Civic to a VW bug made in Mexico. It, the TC30, is a good tractor, but it is an old design.

NH's main line is as good or better(depending on the model) than the green and orange competition. If I were you, I would look at the Case DX 34 and Case DX 35. They have a significant difference in size, but about the HP that your are looking at. I have a TC45D(DX45), which is the same physical size as the 35, and I love it. If you have a NH dealer around, I would look on their lot as well, as the NH tractors have the option of having "SuperSteer", which I find useful(particularly with an HST). Also note the pedal configurations, as the 34 and 35 are different.

Have a good hunt. You will like your tractor!
Chris

 

[daTeacha]

I spent about 10 years living in Michigan, got my post grad degree at CMU, so am a bit familiar with the terrain, soil, and vegetation you will be dealing with.

I went through a similar process a while ago and decided on a Case DX29. I live on hills, which you probably have very little of. Prior to the Case, I had a Kubota B7100 gear. I went with HST on the Case since I do a lot delicate maneuvering in the sheep barn.

I'm still not thoroughly convinced its any better in other areas. Driving a gear tractor is not like driving a stickshift car or truck. With the tractor, especially the typical compact, you basically pick a gear and drive. You don't shift on the fly except on rare occasions, and then you need to be pretty good since very few have synchronized tranny's. The gear models offer a foot throttle, which is often handy. The HSTs more or less run at a constant engine speed and you vary your ground speed with the pedals.

The gear models offer the easy use of differential braking, allowing you to readily brake one rear wheel to facilitate turning. Most of the compacts have a very tight turning radius anyways, but this might be important, depending on how sharply you will need to turn. You do NOT want to be pivoting on a stationary wheel while mowing your lawn, but it comes in handy when plowing out the driveway in winter and you want to do q quick U turn on the road.

I finally made my choice based on dealer, seat comfort, ergonomics of the controls, and price. Case/NH had an advantage there since I am eligible for A-plan pricing from Ford, but price was not the deciding factor. Thinking about it, the quality of the dealer experience led to either Case or Kubota, and then the seat and ergonomics took me to Case. I felt like the 'bota was trying to throw me off the seat even when the thing was standing still.