Here we go again!!! 4th time

[boogerman2000]

Welp! digging a stump and Poof the left right cylinder on the BH popped it's seal...I don't want the woods 80X any longer....I'm telling them I'll pay the difference for the BH90 kubota hoe...actually for all the trouble I've had they should just eat the cost....If they don't I'm gonna call Kubota because all in all this is really making them look bad...

Is it possible that I'm doing something wrong??? There wasn't even a load on the hoe any of the times the cylinder popped off....

 

[Ductape]

When looking online at the installation manual for my Woods BH6000, i recall a priority valve installed inline to limit the flow to my the backhoe to 5gpm (if my memory serves me correctly). Is there any possibility the dealer left this out of your install (if its required on your hoe) ? It seems foolish that you are having this much trouble........ Woods products are not cheap junk. I know you know this........ but this just shouldn't be happening ! Sorry to hear about another problem.

 

[hayden]

There is something very wrong with your hoe (I'm the master of the obvious). Seals dont' just pop out. I'd guess that they somehow plumbed the hydraulics so there is no relief valve activating and you are getting an over-pressure situation. If this is the case, it's actually quite dangerous. Testing for it is easy, just hook up a gauge and see the pressure.

These are different seals on different cylinders that have gone, right?

 

[hayden]

By the way, if the problem is in how they have the hydraulics hooked up then you will probably blow out a Kubota hoe too. Over-pressure is over-pressure regardless of brand.

How are the hydraulic hoses to/from the hoe routed to the tractor? Where exactly do they hook up? If the BH intercepts the hydraulic flow before the loader valve then that's your problem, I'll bet. On the Grand L 40s the ONLY relief valve is in the loader valve assembly. A BH has to be hooked up after the loader valve, not before it.

 

[Robert_in_NY]

I understand your frustration with the Woods backhoe but why would you complain to Kubota about this and how does a Woods backhoe failing make Kubota look bad?

If you don't feel your local dealer is competent to find what is causing the problem then go to another dealer and ask them about it. Best of luck to you.

 

[hayden]

I just took a look at the manual for a BH80 and it has relief valves built into the spool assembly. However, for them to work properly is assumes there is no back-pressure on the return line.

Your 3PH is downstream of you BH if it's hooked up anything like I think it is.

How is your 3PH configured when the BH is installed? Is it possible that the 3PH is trying to lift but is jambed up against something. For example, are the draw bars still installed and are they trying to lift against the BH mounting frame? If the 3PH is somehow activated (perhaps intermittently) AND the BH is plumbed in upstream of the loader valve then it could create an overpressure situation despite the relief valves in the BH.

 

[Wayne County Hose]

Can you post a pic of the damage? I am curious as to what is popping. Can anyone post a parts breakdown of these cylinders? I would like to see what holds the gland in.
Too bad you weren't closer. I would fix this for you and send the dealer the bill.
If it's the gland popping out of the barrel, it's defective cylinders. If it's too much flow or pressure, the hoses would blow or the cylinder barrel would split.

 

[boogerman2000]

There is something very wrong with your hoe (I'm the master of the obvious). Seals dont' just pop out. I'd guess that they somehow plumbed the hydraulics so there is no relief valve activating and you are getting an over-pressure situation. If this is the case, it's actually quite dangerous. Testing for it is easy, just hook up a gauge and see the pressure.

These are different seals on different cylinders that have gone, right?

The first two were the same cylinder, but today is a different on...The first two were the front dipper cylinder and this the the Left/Right cylinder. As I said in the other post, I had a BX23 and dug out enormous rocks and never, ever had an issue. When the mechanic came out and replaced the dipper cylinder, he stayed to watch me dig the rest of the stump and said that I wasn't even coming close to stressing the hoe. He said the salesman told he to check and see if I was abusing it such as hooking the hoe over the stump and trying to drive forward pulling the stump out...I would never do anything like this. At this rate, I should have kept the BX23, it actually seemed to have more digging power, but that is probably only due to me being skiddish about using the hoe...but for good reason.

 

[boogerman2000]

I understand your frustration with the Woods backhoe but why would you complain to Kubota about this and how does a Woods backhoe failing make Kubota look bad?

If you don't feel your local dealer is competent to find what is causing the problem then go to another dealer and ask them about it. Best of luck to you.

My point about embarrassment is that Kubota trusts the dealer to sell their product and represent it well. If the dealer is putting an aftermarket item on their machines and the item is not performing up to snuff and a customer, me, is getting jaded, I then become leary of both the aftermarket component and the tractor. Think of a car. Ford doesn't put Ford tires on it's vehicles but when the firestone tires they use started to blow and cause accidents, it was a bad reflection on Ford and Firestone. This is obviously just an opinion, keeping in mind I'm extremely frustrated and growing weary by the day.

 

[boogerman2000]

Can you post a pic of the damage? I am curious as to what is popping. Can anyone post a parts breakdown of these cylinders? I would like to see what holds the gland in.
Too bad you weren't closer. I would fix this for you and send the dealer the bill.
If it's the gland popping out of the barrel, it's defective cylinders. If it's too much flow or pressure, the hoses would blow or the cylinder barrel would split.

When they replaced the last cylinder the mechanic show me where the groove that holds the retention ring in was rounded at one point in the machining. the entire black cap with the o-ring seal and the retention ring slides the whole way down the rod. I would post a picture but it is dark here currently. I'll try to post one tomorrow.

 

[boogerman2000]

I just took a look at the manual for a BH80 and it has relief valves built into the spool assembly. However, for them to work properly is assumes there is no back-pressure on the return line.

Your 3PH is downstream of you BH if it's hooked up anything like I think it is.

How is your 3PH configured when the BH is installed? Is it possible that the 3PH is trying to lift but is jambed up against something. For example, are the draw bars still installed and are they trying to lift against the BH mounting frame? If the 3PH is somehow activated (perhaps intermittently) AND the BH is plumbed in upstream of the loader valve then it could create an overpressure situation despite the relief valves in the BH.

The 3pt hitch is not catching. The lower arms are not on and there is plenty of room between the backhoe and the hitch.

 

[B7800mike]

When they replaced the last cylinder the mechanic show me where the groove that holds the retention ring in was rounded at one point in the machining. the entire black cap with the o-ring seal and the retention ring slides the whole way down the rod.

Wondering if this is a bad batch of cylinders? If the new blow out looks the same is the first. Sorry to hear about your problem. I would call the dealer and have them bring all new cylinders for the hoe and there has to be a way to pressure test the hydraulic system.

 

[crazyal]

Can you give a little more information? When you say seal I'm assuming you're not talking about the seal on the piston inside the cylinder that you can't see. Which way was your cylinder moving, extending or retracting? Were the cylinders moving the same direction each time it happened?

It could be a faulty spool valve. They have to let the trapped fluid return to the resivour. If it doesn't I could see the seal as the weakest link, something's got to give.

 

[boogerman2000]

The best way to describe it is that it is sort of the packing at the end of the cylinder that the rod goes in and out through. I was bringing the hoe back to a rest position because I was going to move to the other side of the stump and poof right where the main boom pivots the fluid just started gushing out of the small maybe 12 inch long cylinder and once again the black round cap was popped out of the cylinder and up against the bottom of the boom. I had to shut the machine off because it would not stop puking fluid. This is almost exactly hoe it happened when the dipper cylinder packing, end, cap or whatever you call it popped the last two times.

 

[boogerman2000]

Here is a doctored stock photo pointing out which cylinder caps/packing blew out and where they ended up.

 

[Charlesaf3]

weird. Ive dug a lot of oak stumps with my bh80x - its a good hoe. something is off, no joke

 

[SPYDERLK]

Can you give a little more information? When you say seal I'm assuming you're not talking about the seal on the piston inside the cylinder that you can't see. Which way was your cylinder moving, extending or retracting? Were the cylinders moving the same direction each time it happened?

It could be a faulty spool valve. They have to let the trapped fluid return to the resivour. If it doesn't I could see the seal as the weakest link, something's got to give.

Im with you, but still puzzled that a failure would happen without noticing verry sluggish action. If the returns are getting restricted on the rod side the BH would be slow and weak and pressure on the rod side could routinely see 30# above system pressure. I just wouldnt expect pressure in that range
to blow the rod end. Just the same Id check rod side pressure during extension.
larry

 

[marvindmartien]

Hi Boogerman, I'm a heavy equipment mechanic. First sorry for your frustation, nothing worst then an on going problem. What i wanted to say is that I never saw pressure or flow out of blown seal if no pressure is on the cylinder our the spool valve is at a rest position. It sounds like you have pressure on your return line. It may be caused by crossed lines on the valve and the pressure is not draining to the reservoir. Could you contact the manufacturer and get a hose diagram and at the same time let them know of the problem you are having. The reps are usualy verry good with these things.
Good luck

 

[SPYDERLK]

Post 17

If the returns are getting restricted on the rod side the BH would be slow and weak and pressure on the rod side could routinely see 30[#] above system pressure. I just wouldnt expect pressure in that range
to blow the rod end. Just the same Id check rod side pressure during extension.
larry

I meant 30%.