Dirt Moving How do I grade rocky soil??????

[Don87]

Would something like this work for you?

Gallery - Jakes Implements

 

[Carl Bert]

Would something like this work for you?

Gallery - Jakes Implements

Thanks, interesting implement. I sent for a price request, just out of curiosity. Much less steel then a BB, so I would imagine it would cost less. Only problem is, I don't see how it would help with my rock situation, digging up yes, but not collecting them as I think a BB would. Thanks again

 

[jenkinsph]

Carl,

For the most part stirring up the top layer is easy to do, sorting out the rocks is the larger problem. As I mentioned earlier in this thread I use a rock bucket to sift through the loose top layer to collect the larger rocks. Without a good rockpicker this leaves some hand raking to gather the rocks. I haven't had much success with using a boxblade to sort the rocks out. Small rocks will always be there in the soil and shouldn't be a problem for your lawn.

 

[Carl Bert]

Carl,

For the most part stirring up the top layer is easy to do, sorting out the rocks is the larger problem. As I mentioned earlier in this thread I use a rock bucket to sift through the loose top layer to collect the larger rocks. Without a good rockpicker this leaves some hand raking to gather the rocks. I haven't had much success with using a boxblade to sort the rocks out. Small rocks will always be there in the soil and shouldn't be a problem for your lawn.

I feel like this is a losing battle. Every seemingly small rock peeking through the ground, turns out to be a 2, 3 or 4 foot diameter boulder. I guess I am just goint to have to dig up every square inch with the BH and then attack it with a BB. A lot of work with a 12" bucket, now i wish I had gone with the 18". Oh well, live and learn. Here are some pics to give you an idea.

 

[jenkinsph]

Carl,
That is alot of rock and I doubt the problem will go away either. If you have frost heave pushing new one to the surface each year I suspect this is a losing battle. That said the good thing is that it appears to grow the sapplings and vegetation well in spite of all the rock. So I think I would gather the surface rock and leave the rest of it. Might be better served to add top soil to top dress and smooth where needed.

I worked over a job similar to this in Feb this year where there was so much rock you couldn't get a mower thru it. I pushed and pried as many of the surface rocks out as was reasonable and made a berm with them on the downslope edge of the property. Smoothed the rest up and added a thin layer of topsoil to topdress. Here are some pics from Feb 2011 of the completed seedbed.

 

[Gordon Gould]

We have alot of rock like that and plenty to frigid weather to make frost here in NE Vermont. I find the rocks are constantly being pushed up by the frost on the road or anywhere I plow. But on the lawn where we get snow cover the frost doesn't go so deep and the rocks don't push up. We just got rid of the surface rocks best we could and covered the area over with sump sand (poor man's loam) then planted the grass like jenkinsph suggested. You can see the tops of rocks in places and for a couple I have to lift the mower deck a little as I go over but it stays the same every year. So if you get snow where you are you might be OK.

 

[Carl Bert]

Carl,
That is alot of rock and I doubt the problem will go away either. If you have frost heave pushing new one to the surface each year I suspect this is a losing battle. That said the good thing is that it appears to grow the sapplings and vegetation well in spite of all the rock. So I think I would gather the surface rock and leave the rest of it. Might be better served to add top soil to top dress and smooth where needed.

I worked over a job similar to this in Feb this year where there was so much rock you couldn't get a mower thru it. I pushed and pried as many of the surface rocks out as was reasonable and made a berm with them on the downslope edge of the property. Smoothed the rest up and added a thin layer of topsoil to topdress. Here are some pics from Feb 2011 of the completed seedbed.

Nice job. That JD 110 sure is a beautiful machine, especially with the cab. You must get some very enjoyable seat time with the AC blowing.

As far as the dirt, I figure I will get it as flat and rock free as possible and then put a couple of inches of top soil to finish it off. Any idea how much it would take to cover 1/2 acre? My Dad just paid $45 a yard plus delivery, a total of $540 w/tax and delivery for 10 yds. Luckily I have a friend of a friend who is willing to give it to me for $20 yd delivered. Its not quite as nice as what my Dad got, but at close to 1/3 of the price, it will due just fine.

 

[Carl Bert]

We have alot of rock like that and plenty to frigid weather to make frost here in NE Vermont. I find the rocks are constantly being pushed up by the frost on the road or anywhere I plow. But on the lawn where we get snow cover the frost doesn't go so deep and the rocks don't push up. We just got rid of the surface rocks best we could and covered the area over with sump sand (poor man's loam) then planted the grass like jenkinsph suggested. You can see the tops of rocks in places and for a couple I have to lift the mower deck a little as I go over but it stays the same every year. So if you get snow where you are you might be OK.

I hope your right, because to tell you the truth, I have been digging huge holes to bury a lot of the larger boulders. This is what my neighbor had done to his property about 10 yrs ago, and so far no problems.

 

[jenkinsph]

Carl,
I have dug holes to bury rock and used the displaced dirt to smooth over the yard areas that need it. As for spreading the topsoil I would do this sparingly, only as needed. It would take a tremendous amount of dirt to cover 1/2 acre. The grass will cover over small rock (gravel size 3/4 to 1 1/2) as long as it is pressed down flush with the surface.

I recommend you break this up into some smaller areas to handle one at a time.

 

[Swamp Yankee]

I work it out to be about 65 yards of top soil per inch to cover half an acre. I didn't double check the math, but it sounds about right. Depending on the top soil density, it's probably about 1 ton per yard. That's a few dollars.

My lawn is about 12 years old. There were three rocks just at the surface that have bugged me the whole time. About two weeks ago, I went at 'em with my L35. Well, they were big enough that when I got them out and pinched between the bucket and the boom, I couldn't steer the tractor going forward up the slight (3% or so) grade to my rock pile. I had to drive it in reverse to get enough front tire on the ground to steer. Good times.

One other poster mentioned frost heave, and his experience mirrors mine. The grass and then the snow insulates the ground well enough that frost heave isn't a problem. It does happen on open ground, such as the driveway, but not the lawn. I'm in CT, so our winters are probably similar.

Good luck, and have fun.

 

[JohninCT]

You've got a pretty good supply start on rock walls there. In our area of the Northeast when you dig out the rocks you just line em up along your boarder and make a wall out of them. You could also use some of them to ring some planting areas or build some terraces. Make lemonade outta your lemons so to speak. Use the soil you dig out to fill in or smooth out other areas.

Swamp Yankee has figured it right. 1/2 acre is 2419 sq yds. 2 inches is 0.056 yds. 2419 x 0.056 = 135 cu yds. Even at $20/ cu yd your talking about $2700.

If your not looking for the golf course, using a york rake and box blade to scrape up the larger stuff and sowing some grass seed on the dirt you have can give you a pretty decent result. I'd still get some of that $20 delivered stuff and use it where you really need it.

 

[Carl_NH]

Carl.

I just finished stumping, clearing, and picking rocks on an 1.5 ac here on the rocky ledge on the NH coast over the last two years.

This is a long process and as I look at your pics that's what I am dealing with. I have the B21 so a bit smaller than your b26 but in the same class. Its a workhorse. After the stumping I had tons of branches, rocks, roots all over - so last year I used the bucket to back drag the big stuff into a large pile of rocks and roots, then a york rake to get the rocks up (and more rocks every pass) into windrows of rocks.

I pushed the rocks to the edges of the area (for a future wall) then late last year i took the piles of roots and debris and rocks after they composted down and separated this from the dirt then burned the roots over the winter. The cleanup/leveling process took all last summer - a long haul..

Early this spring our local tree guy (makes mulch too) has tailings leftover from his mulch which is dirt, small stones 3/4-1" and fine wood chips. He delivered 60 yards of this for the cost of trucking which I used as a base to cover the exposed rocks and level the ground. Then I got 60 yards of composted loam delivered at the end of May for $18/yard.

I spread this and leveled everything out nice.. all told if you have a half acre I think 32 yards (two 16 yd loads) should cover you if you have most of the rocks removed..

$45 a yard for loam is way out of line - it should be no more than $20-25 a yard delivered. Also would suggest a stockpile of loam for "projects" - we compost our leaves every year and make about 8 yards of compost and mix this with the loam each fall.

Good luck and post some pics of your project when complete.

 

[My Hoe]

Carl,

I believe (IIRC) that I live in your same "rocky" county.

Isn't this the PERFECT Excus--'er, JUSTIFICATION, to purchase a HYDRAULIC THUMB for your backhoe?

If it were me, I would "rototill" the 1/2 acre with the backhoe. As it might take a while, this might also be the perfect time to buy a SUNSHADE for your machine (if you do not already have one, or a cab--not sure what machine you have).

Then, you can hoe/pick/swing and drop, for later round-up with the FEL. Or, as others have mentioned, use a "stone boat." I think a sturdy car hood, from the '50's, could serve as a good, large stone boat, and you could drag them to a storage area, for a future rock wall, reflecting pool, etc....

The money saved in rentals and extra yards of dirt not purchased should more than cover a hydraulic thumb and rear remote, no?

Just a thought. I tend to see problems as an opportunity to buy a new toy--'er, tool, especially if it will pay for itself in avoiding rentals and other purchases.

I've never used a BB, but that does seem like a sweet tool, after the boulders are gone. Perhaps a BB can be rented/borrowed, once the car-sized boulders are removed?

Again, just a thought--others here have waaay more experience with this stuff than me. I just like the idea of a hydraulic thumb, as you can tell.

Good luck with your project!

My Hoe

 

[Carl Bert]

Carl,

I believe (IIRC) that I live in your same "rocky" county.

Isn't this the PERFECT Excus--'er, JUSTIFICATION, to purchase a HYDRAULIC THUMB for your backhoe?

If it were me, I would "rototill" the 1/2 acre with the backhoe. As it might take a while, this might also be the perfect time to buy a SUNSHADE for your machine (if you do not already have one, or a cab--not sure what machine you have).

Then, you can hoe/pick/swing and drop, for later round-up with the FEL. Or, as others have mentioned, use a "stone boat." I think a sturdy car hood, from the '50's, could serve as a good, large stone boat, and you could drag them to a storage area, for a future rock wall, reflecting pool, etc....

The money saved in rentals and extra yards of dirt not purchased should more than cover a hydraulic thumb and rear remote, no?

Just a thought. I tend to see problems as an opportunity to buy a new toy--'er, tool, especially if it will pay for itself in avoiding rentals and other purchases.

I've never used a BB, but that does seem like a sweet tool, after the boulders are gone. Perhaps a BB can be rented/borrowed, once the car-sized boulders are removed?

Again, just a thought--others here have waaay more experience with this stuff than me. I just like the idea of a hydraulic thumb, as you can tell.

Good luck with your project!

My Hoe

Hello fellow Rocklander. I'm in Stony Point, in a developement called "The Cliffs". There are actually three developements that were built on this mountain. One being the Cliffs, the second is "Cedar pond estates" and the third is Indian something. My house sits where they all meet. Anyway its one big mountain of rock and I hate it. I have a B26 with the hyd thumb and its doing a great job for its size, but it seems never ending.

I have been looking for a used BB, but no luck so far. I would much rather rent one, since after I finish clearing this piece of property, I will have no other use for it, but I can't find a rental yard who carries one. Do you know of one?

I just started, doing what you had mentioned, turning the entire lot with the backhoe. I got a small section done, but with all the rock that I dig up and have to pick out and move, it just takes forever.

After turning and removing the larger rock, I plan on using a BB to grade off and remove the smaller stones. Hopefully I can find a BB by then.