How self sufficient are you ? Honestly ?

[hosspuller]

My answer Depends on how long ... and under what conditions. Cut off from outside ... Usually have 30 days of medications, although if none to be had, it's not life threatening. Food & water , heat, is not a problem for 30 days either.

Conditions... flood if my feet are wet, neighbors are swimming, but have a small boat. Fire ... surrounded by low density of trees & fields so likely to be protected. High winds, snow, hurricane, etc will sustain major damage, but have the tools & will to dig out and survive for 30 days.

Bio-attack ... SOL unless known before infection. Then enough ammo to stay isolated for 30 days.

 

[Rob-D]

I am intrigued at the concept of self sufficiency that you suggest that exists and that bartering is not part of that equation. Total Self Sufficiency does not exist and has never existed. We can get existential on the issue, look at the human need to pro-create outside of blood lines, or the need for basic companionship. Or we can look at the hard truth. Someday you will not have something you need. Someday you will break a leg and can't hunt, or have your crops destroyed by nature. or a million other things you didn't plan for or ran out of. Thinking that you can go it alone as a survivalist is the surest way to your quick death. I don't suggest opening your arms to everyone, but having social skills to barter, trade and know when to defend and when to run will take those people to the top of the food chain, as it always has.

It sounds like you are talking on the individual level. I guess there are people who are alone but alone is a miserable place to live. Man, quite frankly, can not exist without love (to get existential!). I'm certainly not advocating living alone against the world. We have a community here of several good, really trust worthy friends with different skills. Some with animal husbandry and some, like me, who are highly skilled. It's a group, a community, and each one his his or her talents.

And while it's true that you can not prepare for every issue, you can prepare to the point that the group, as a unit, will be well enough off to exist in most scenarios. That's the best you can do. The area we live in is all farmland so bartering is going to be a big plus. I don't know how skilled one has to be at it. It's about fairness and if you live where the people you associate with respect you and you respect them then bartering is a very equitable transaction.
Last spring my neighbor had trouble with the electrics on his tractor, I went down and straightened it out. I didn't get paid, in fact money never came up but the summer came and I needed bedding hay for our garden. He dropped off 30 bales. If you weigh every ounce there may be a winner and a loser, that's no how we think, we believe that in the end things balance themselves out well enough and even if they don't 100% I still feel good about getting my neighbors tractor going and I'll bet he would have brought me that hay even if I didn't fix his tractor.
That's the way I think the world should work and fortunately we live in a place where we have that. Getting over on the next guy doesn't get you very far in the end, too bad that's a minority opinion. I guess greed has to smack you in the head more times than not before you pick up on that!

 

[Rob-D]

Actually there is another good point in that analogy in that the homeless guy will have no qualms about picking through dumpsters or whatever where a Gucci-toting Urbanite would probably lose whatever they ate at their previous meal before eating something out of a dumpster

I draw on my own experience in the USMC for that... we always had 'substandard' housing compared to other branches, particularly the Air Force. If you are used to sleeping in the dirt then spending a night in the dirt doesn't look so bad. But if you used to living in the equivalent of a Hilton Hotel then a night in the dirt is a horrifying prospect.

You're thinking 'city'. We don't scavenge we forage! If the SHTF the cities are going to be like NOLA only much worse. You can not supply the energy, food and life support in an area that is densely populated when the rest of the country is in trouble. Period! Cities need a way to bring goods and services in. Who here thinks that is going to be possible?

As far as what you can live with I remember my military days and the research. What the military found was the bruiser with the big muscles wasn't the toughest. Toughness is a mind issue. It's how you cope, your reserve, your ability to handle different situations. The guy who takes orders without thinking isn't the guy who wins out, it's they guy who thinks for himself who doesn't fit the mold, and who improvises that lasts.

We're talking about resiliency but how many of you know how to live without medication? In fact, how many here over 60 take no medication? I'll bet very few hands go up. So if you're not taking care of yourself now you won't take care of yourself when things get worse. Does that make sense? If you're 25 lbs. over weight now you aren't taking care of yourself. Geeze! People crack me up!
I know this guy, he smokes, is on all kinds of meds but he has a gun by his side at all times. What? He's killing himself with his life style but he wants to stop people from harming him?... I get it, he wants to do it all by himself!

 

[3930dave]

Good discussion. Thanks to all for the book references. With Winter settling in, some of those will get added to my reading list.

I regard self-sufficiency as a general health issue too. Many/most of us are at higher risk from various background daily life issues, rather than the apocalypse scenarios that make for typical movie or novel plots.

Corporate level agri-business has created a number of the threats. Like most people, I don't eat enough fresh fruit and vegs - even there, vigilance is needed, as various crops have been contaminated with E coli and sundry chemical threats. Teenagers today still test positive for DDT, and how long ago was that banned ?

I like most forms of meat at least as much as the next guy. After reading this book, I went off meat for over a year, probably closer to 2.

Dying for a Hamburger..... Waldman and Lamb

Dying for a Hamburger: Modern Meat Processing and the Epidemic of Alzheimer's Disease: Murray Waldman, Marjorie Lamb: 9780715207659: Amazon.com: Books

Left in their natural state, many forms of food are healthy to consume in reasonable quantities. Optimizing corporate profits has created various problems, some horrendous and fatal.

The above book is worth reading, if for nothing else to learn how mad-cow disease was created.

Creating and sustaining my own food supply is my greatest deficiency.... this thread has done a good job of reminding me of this.

Rgds, D.

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

The point I was trying to make and find responses to is the fact that MOST people have NO IDEA how to even survive for days let alone weeks or months ,and the further OUT you are the better , as far as protecting your resources all you have to do is be far enough away from town to not have to deal with the inept majority ! Most would die waiting for help and the rest may be more adept at self preservation but still not be able to gather what they need to make it !

 

[madmax12]

Lots of good thoughts in here. Still shaping my ready plan.

If you are the type of person that is an asset to the world right now, a positive member of society, a contributing member of a community, a hard worker, a leader/get-stuff-done-person, ...a friend... Then chances are, you will find yourself not just surviving, but helping others.

Maybe not everyone on TBN would be that way, but from my reading... Most here would make the ending world a better place... Just as they strive to help others everyday...now.

 

[Rod in Forfar]

When we had the ice storm in 98, it was ridiculous how helpless MOST people were.

My dad always insisted that the box stove in the house was his insurance policy, but when the Ice Storm hit in '98 it was the 5 KW generator my electrician friend brought to the farm which enabled my parents to stay in their home for the ten day emergency. From that time on my dad ignored the wood stove, but treasured his "Honda."

Last year I bought and installed a privy on the property. The hand pump on the well is set up to work in cold weather. The shops (automotive and woodworking) are insulated, with wood stoves. I have several cords of wood ahead. Root vegetables are in the cellar. Fish in the freezer. Gas stove for cooking. Generator for heat and light, as long as the gasoline holds out. Several large tanks of propane, and one of diesel.

But if the Internet goes out I'll go bonkers in a week.

 

[Pharm]

The point I was trying to make and find responses to is the fact that MOST people have NO IDEA how to even survive for days let alone weeks or months ,and the further OUT you are the better , as far as protecting your resources all you have to do is be far enough away from town to not have to deal with the inept majority ! Most would die waiting for help and the rest may be more adept at self preservation but still not be able to gather what they need to make it !

True, but cities can only function through a high degree of coordination and management. Could we even have cities with more than 50,000 to 100,000 people without roads, fuel, and modern transportation? A city of one million people has to have the food imported in and it takes a lot of tools to make that happen. It's really a intricate and delicate balance when you think about it ... but it's a long way from our hunter-gatherer roots. The person who may be crucial for maintaining that balance may be totally inept when it comes to the skill set required for basic survival.

 

[Grumpy Old Man]

Your all talking like the power will be off for two weeks not being self sufficient ! You really think your neighbors are going to be your allies ? and if you live close to town or close to the neighbor your just the next victim of the unprepared , bob the guy next door will only go hungry till you go to sleep and then your done ! you would not be sitting next to the fire singing Kumbaya ? and sharing the last Ramen noodles , you would be trading ANYTHING IN YOUR POSESSION TO STAY FED , don't think so ... shut down your power /water and communications and see how long you last before your trading the wife for a burger !

 

[tungularafishcamp]

Your all talking like the power will be off for two weeks not being self sufficient ! You really think your neighbors are going to be your allies ? and if you live close to town or close to the neighbor your just the next victim of the unprepared , bob the guy next door will only go hungry till you go to sleep and then your done ! you would not be sitting next to the fire singing Kumbaya ? and sharing the last Ramen noodles , you would be trading ANYTHING IN YOUR POSESSION TO STAY FED , don't think so ... shut down your power /water and communications and see how long you last before your trading the wife for a burger !

NO Way, I love my wife!!
I would at least hold out for prime rib:laughing: