HST Filter

[tomplum]

While offering no opinion on your situation, this Deere propaganda I've found interesting: PMB Product:

 

[s219]

I happened to cut open both filters today.
I have concluded that the filter media in the Baldwin filter is superior to the same filter branded Kubota

Post some pictures -- this would be really helpful to see.

 

[ovrszd]

Can you provide any evidence that other UTD fluid of a different manufacture doesn't meet kubota specs ?


''And in case you have not noticed Kubota has been spending a lot of money on smart label technology to keep counterfeits out of the supply chain and that means something also that if they do put importance in their quality checks why put expensive labels with seals on the packages?''

The above statement is no proof that kubota has an engineer on site at the Baldwin filter plant to ensure every filter off the line is of the same quality.

You keep mentioning wix filters. Wix has nothing to do with Baldwin filters. Baldwin makes the kubota filter. Not wix
Can you provide proof Baldwin filters are inferior to the kubota filters they make ?

I happened to cut open both filters today.
I have concluded that the filter media in the Baldwin filter is superior to the same filter branded Kubota

Can you post pics of the filters you opened?

 

[kenmac]

out of town a few days. Will get some pics when I return and get them posted

 

[kenmac]

Well, here's an update...The holidays are over and I got back in town today.
I went out to the garage to take pics of the 2 filters I had cut open to show Kubota branded Baldwin filter vs non kubota branded Baldwin filter.

I could not find these two filters. Upon further investigation, I find out that my son visited to do some work on his vehicle and in his words ''was doing me a favor cleaning up my shop and threw those old filters away''

I'm as sorry as I can be about this....What else can I say ? I truly apologize ...We'll do it next change for sure

 

[robertm]

I can't figure why using OEM filters for the average guy is such a big deal to save a few bucks with the potential downsides. Filter intervals are squat unless you run equipment for a living. Most of us put in a few hundred a year, at best. If you depend on the equipment to pay your bills, why risk it? To save $3 to $5 a filter? If you use it as a homeowner, is that few dollars savings on $15k to $40k tractor that big of a deal? Are larger tractor oil filters $100 and you can save $25?
I'm all for saving my equipment, but if you are really interested in keeping your equipment running longer, then you'd better look at the lubricant, too. So many people I see today get a change for their car at the next EZ Lube they pass. One brand to the next, which I was taught from a grasshopper (maybe old school now) to not switch back and forth in brands of lubricant.
This kind of reminds me of the discussions on the RV boards where guys get worked up over dumping a $2 gallon of RV antifreeze each spring when they flush out, and consider converting to cheap vodka to save to use year to year.

 

[crashz]

I agree with robert above and have the following to add:

A) I've found some dealers pricing on filters and oil to be very reasonable. Usually in the range of box store pricing. Been very surprised.
B) Quality always seems to be good and sometimes its the actual best for the application ie: SUDT, Motorcraft Mercon V, Honda ATF, Motorcraft filters, etc.
C) Best opportunity to go home with the right parts that fit. And most updated.
D) Here in the northeast, the dealerships are generally close by. It makes it pretty convenient for good parts, that fit.

That being said, there are some superior after market products for many applications. But for most, dealer parts are not a compromise on quality and can be convenient.

 

[rScotty]

I agree with robert above and have the following to add:

A) I've found some dealers pricing on filters and oil to be very reasonable. Usually in the range of box store pricing. Been very surprised.
B) Quality always seems to be good and sometimes its the actual best for the application ie: SUDT, Motorcraft Mercon V, Honda ATF, Motorcraft filters, etc.
C) Best opportunity to go home with the right parts that fit. And most updated.
D) Here in the northeast, the dealerships are generally close by. It makes it pretty convenient for good parts, that fit.

That being said, there are some superior after market products for many applications. But for most, dealer parts are not a compromise on quality and can be convenient.

I agree with that basic idea. And I'd add the arguement that it looks more and more like only OEM manufacturers have the resources to go after counterfeits in order to protect their own name brand products quality as well as their own market.

Copycats didn't use to be a problem. But unfortunately poor quality knock-off products and unknown quality counterfeits are part of the world today. So unless I want to test every single thing for myself, buying OEM products seem to be my best choice.

I wish it weren't so, because it seems to me that the world marketplace would benefit if small businesses could compete with big ones by making specialty high quality innovative products. On the surface, having more choices seems good for everyone. But then how does the consumer know what he is getting? The OEM manufacturer simply has more "skin in the game".

I know it sounds a bit cynical, and in fact I had a hard time believing that counterfeits were such a problem myself until I got taken advantage of. It turns out that we even have to watch out even when buying at the dealership. Ten years ago I got burnt for a couple hundred dollars of counterfeit SUDT oil at a Kubota dealership. I guess I'm only half smart because I still buy Kubota filters, but I certainly won't ever buy any of their oil again - and advise others the same.
rScotty

 

[kenmac]

To each their own. But, If / when I need the dealer , I buy from dealer. Other than that, I usually go straight to the source. The sources are the oil companies, and OEM's .OEM's are the people that make actual parts for LS, Kubota, Mahindra, GM, dodge, etc,.

 

[Grateful11]

Someone said no photos. Here's the difference between a Napa/Wix and Kubota High Pressure side hydraulic filter for an L3940 and many other models.

NAPA 7616. I think it's fairly obvious that Wix took an existing filter and machined an adapter and screwed onto a filter for something else. The NAPA only has four unobstructed holes in it. The Kubota has 6 unobstructed slots. My son can get the NAPA filter for about half the price of the Kubota but will not buy another one. He gets a very generous Fleet discount on filters. BTW: The low pressure side filter, a Kubota HHTA0-37710, the recess in the NAPA will not accept the magnet from a Kubota filter, the recess is the wrong size. The NAPA filter 7098 doesn't come with a magnet.

NAPA 7616

Kubota HHTA0-59900

 

[s219]

Someone said no photos. Here's the difference between a Napa/Wix and Kubota High Pressure side hydraulic filter for an L3940 and many other models.

NAPA 7616. I think it's fairly obvious that Wix took an existing filter and machined an adapter and screwed onto a filter for something else. The NAPA only has four unobstructed holes in it. The Kubota has 6 unobstructed slots. My son can get the NAPA filter for about half the price of the Kubota but will not buy another one. He gets a very generous Fleet discount on filters. BTW: The low pressure side filter, a Kubota HHTA0-37710, the recess in the NAPA will not accept the magnet from a Kubota filter, the recess is the wrong size. The NAPA filter 7098 doesn't come with a magnet.

That's quite a significant difference. I have heard about the magnet issue several times before, but I'd say the difference in flow area is a pretty big deal. Looks like less than 50% the flow area of the Kubota filter, plus it's unevenly distributed.

 

[rScotty]

That's quite a significant difference. I have heard about the magnet issue several times before, but I'd say the difference in flow area is a pretty big deal. Looks like less than 50% the flow area of the Kubota filter, plus it's unevenly distributed.

The filter is fed by oil under pressure. As long as the filter openings are greater than the pipe feeding the filter, wouldn't the resistance of the filter media itself make substantially more of a difference in flow?? And anyway, isn't it filtration we are concerned with more than flow?
rScotty

 

[s219]

The filter is fed by oil under pressure. As long as the filter openings are greater than the pipe feeding the filter, wouldn't the resistance of the filter media itself make substantially more of a difference in flow?? And anyway, isn't it filtration we are concerned with more than flow?
rScotty

It all depends on where the restrictions and losses are. Keep in mind that flow losses scale up with velocity and surface area, and also increase the more orifices you have. Many small holes will be a lot lossier (higher velocity, more surface area, more edges) than fewer larger holes even if the area is the same. Anything that creates a pressure drop is bad and pressure drops are additive. I'd assume the filter media is already a pretty large pressure drop, so I wouldn't want to add more restrictions in the system.

Now on the other hand if the filter media creates such a huge pressure drop that everything else is peanuts in comparison, it may not matter. But that's not something we can answer without more data and some calculations. Me, when I look at the NAPA filter, I am not liking the reduction in open area of those orifices, nor the non-uniform spacing and distribution. And when I eyeball the area of the small orifices (normally the inflow) and compare to the outflow (normally the center hole) the orifices clearly have less area.

 

[Fallon]

The filter is fed by oil under pressure. As long as the filter openings are greater than the pipe feeding the filter, wouldn't the resistance of the filter media itself make substantially more of a difference in flow?? And anyway, isn't it filtration we are concerned with more than flow?
rScotty

Restricted oil supply will cause cavitation & destroy a pump faster than contaminated oil. Hence why hydraulic filters are usually on the return line, not suction. HSTs are even more sensitive soi believe their filters are after the charge pump, before the HST. Hence needing to be a stronger filter & canister to deal with charge pump pressures.

 

[David_Kb7uns]

Just like the horrible 50 micron filter screen WIX/NAPA spec for the BX in place of a paper element water blocking diesel fuel filter, they will spec anything to make a sale with little regard to what happens to the machine afterwards.

Would not use a WIX filter on a YUGO!

WILL FIT IS NOT AN OPTION use a filter designed for the application!

David