Hydraulic fluid fill location

[andy1dr]

Have a Feng Shou 184 with the 2 cylinder J285T diesel engine. Based on this document ( https://pruefberichte.dlg.org/filestorage/JIANGXI-FENG_SHOU_180_Standard-Nr1333-1991-englisch.pdf ) it looks like the transmission and hydraulic lift use the same oil. there is a canister on the right side (as you are sitting on the tractor) that has pipes running through it. Is that where the SAE 90 hydraulic fluid is added? The 3 point hitch works, but will drop slowly( without moving the lift/lower handle). I am assuming that this means it needs hydraulic fluid added.

Any info on this would be great. As a side note, does anyone have a service and or operator manual for this tractor?

Thanks in Advance,

 

[piper184]

The document you have seems to indicate that the transmission and hydraulic system use the same oil, but that does not mean they use the same sump. That is something you will need to sort out by looking and following the lines.

SAE 90 seems a little heavy for hydraulic fluid, best to find out what is in there before adding anything. You might want to just do a complete change so you know for sure what you are dealing with. The specification is a little vague but some tractors use a "hy-trans" fluid for both systems, although that is usually a hydrostatic transmission, not a straight geared one.

Most three point lifts have a tendency to creep down on their own. This is not an indication of low fluid. You should be able to find a mark or other reference to figure out when the sump has the correct amount of fluid. If it won't lift all the way, then that could indicate low fluid level.

Please post some photos of your tractor and specifically the canister and pipes you are talking about so we can better see what you are dealing with.

 

[Bob Rooks]

There is no SAE 90 hydraulic oil.

 

[piper184]

There is no SAE 90 hydraulic oil.

Yup, only gear oil gets that designation, which makes it pretty darned heavy for hydraulic oil but is the right choice for the transmission and rear ends.

I suspect something got lost in the translation somewhere. Although the Chinese spec of 15 mm (squared) @ 100 C is pretty close to the cSt @ 100 C listed in the chart attached. I don't remember the Centistoke setups exactly but maybe that is supposed to be 15 mm (cubed) which is the same as 15 ml.

In any case I suspect this tractor is pretty close to the Jinma 184 which I am pretty sure has separate hydraulic fluid and it shouldn't have anything approaching SAE 90 in it. If it were mine I would want to sump the transmission and differential/s just to make sure there is no crud or water in them and that way I could see what was in each chamber. Then find and identify the hydraulic tank/sump and do the same thing. If concerned about any of them, I would drain and refill with new, known quality fluid.

Fluid is cheap compared to overhauls. I know that sometimes I send perfectly good fluids to the furnace but better safe than sorry and usually less expensive then a proper lab test.

 

[andy1dr]

The document you have seems to indicate that the transmission and hydraulic system use the same oil, but that does not mean they use the same sump. That is something you will need to sort out by looking and following the lines.

SAE 90 seems a little heavy for hydraulic fluid, best to find out what is in there before adding anything. You might want to just do a complete change so you know for sure what you are dealing with. The specification is a little vague but some tractors use a "hy-trans" fluid for both systems, although that is usually a hydrostatic transmission, not a straight geared one.

Most three point lifts have a tendency to creep down on their own. This is not an indication of low fluid. You should be able to find a mark or other reference to figure out when the sump has the correct amount of fluid. If it won't lift all the way, then that could indicate low fluid level.

Please post some photos of your tractor and specifically the canister and pipes you are talking about so we can better see what you are dealing with.

Hope to get some photos this evening.

 

[andy1dr]

The first image shows the pipes/lines that goe to the 3point hitch (small line) and the canister (big line) the second picture is the canister. The big line goes to the bottom of the canister. They both go to the front of the tractor to what i am assuming is the hydraulic pump.

 

[Bob Rooks]

The "canister" is the suction side filter for the pump. It may have a paper element, a screen, or wire mesh inside. A good source for air leaks. Make sure it is clean, and the cap is sealed securely.
Note: "VG" stands for Viscosity Grade.

 

[piper184]

Yup, that's a filter, not the sump. I suspect the sump is the section of cast iron below the seat and above the rear axle housing. This is typical for this size import tractor. There should be a fill plug on the back side behind the seat. You may have to move the seat forward to get good access. There very well may be a dip stick in the plug.

If the above is correct, the hydraulics is separate from the gear boxes.

90w or 80w-90 gear lube for the differential and transmission but hydraulic fluid for the hydraulics. It probably only holds a couple of gallons.

Once you find the fill plug you can check the level and use some small tube or pipe to get a small sample of the fluid to check it's condition at least visually. There should also be a drain plug either on the left side or more likely the back of the sump near where the top link is attached.

Most hydraulic fluids are compatible with each other, even across viscosity ranges. If in doubt, drain, clean the filter and refill with a known good fluid. If you are in a warm climate ISO 68 is probably best, if you are in a cold one, look for ISO 22. ISO 46 is a good compromise if you have seasonal temp changes that go from 100+ to -30. I run ISO 22 year round because most of my loader work is done in the dead of winter.

 

[andy1dr]

The "canister" is the suction side filter for the pump. It may have a paper element, a screen, or wire mesh inside. A good source for air leaks. Make sure it is clean, and the cap is sealed securely.
Note: "VG" stands for Viscosity Grade.

Is there another location to add fluid? I really don't see any other obvious location to add hydraulic fluid if it needs it.

Yup, that's a filter, not the sump. I suspect the sump is the section of cast iron below the seat and above the rear axle housing. This is typical for this size import tractor. There should be a fill plug on the back side behind the seat. You may have to move the seat forward to get good access. There very well may be a dip stick in the plug.

If the above is correct, the hydraulics is separate from the gear boxes.

90w or 80w-90 gear lube for the differential and transmission but hydraulic fluid for the hydraulics. It probably only holds a couple of gallons.

Once you find the fill plug you can check the level and use some small tube or pipe to get a small sample of the fluid to check it's condition at least visually. There should also be a drain plug either on the left side or more likely the back of the sump near where the top link is attached.

Most hydraulic fluids are compatible with each other, even across viscosity ranges. If in doubt, drain, clean the filter and refill with a known good fluid. If you are in a warm climate ISO 68 is probably best, if you are in a cold one, look for ISO 22. ISO 46 is a good compromise if you have seasonal temp changes that go from 100+ to -30. I run ISO 22 year round because most of my loader work is done in the dead of winter.

Thanks Piper! That is really useful information!. I will check it out. The seat flips up on hinges, so that may make it easier to check out.

 

[Bob Rooks]

As an aside to Piper's #8 post, I use a multi-viscosity (multi-vis) hydraulic oil. ISO AW 32/46/68. Works well in all my equipment for year 'round use. Getting some wild temperature swings lately here in the PNW.

 

[TTTTTT]

Just to add, my DF (Dong Feng) has a common sump for gear and hydraulics. I've used TDH since new (2008). Works perfect. Hydraulics a little slow until warmed up in winter at -20C. But not bad all.

 

[andy1dr]

After closer inspection, i think that the transmission and 3 point do share the same oil. The sump is connected directly to the side of the transmission. I alolso checked under the seat and therr is no obvious fill location. First image is under the seat. Second image is the sump from below. Third image is under the front mart of the seat. Last image is what i am assuming is a filter that the large line that goes to the sump is connected to.

 

[Bob Rooks]

What I previously thought was a suction filter/strainer is likely the fill point (pic #3), since it's bolted directly to the case. Pic #4 would be the suction filter. Good pictures are worth a thousand words.

 

[piper184]

Well that sheds some new light on this one.
The round casting that the seat is bolted to is most likely the 3 point cylinder casting. (on my Jinma, that is inside the hydraulic tank so it looks considerably different)
With the seat flipped forward, it appears that there is a breather tube between the springs. What breaths through this tube is still unclear.
The sump that is bolted to the side of the transmission is what we first thought was a filter housing, but you have a spin on filter hanging under the starter so the first part must really be a sump.

Have you unscrewed the cap to see what is inside? When looking inside you should be able to tell if it is a stand alone container or if it has a hole to let fluid into the transmission.

Does this tractor have power steering?

There is a brass fitting with splines on it just under the front edge of the seat. Undoubtedly there was once a plastic knob molded onto this fitting. That is the knob that controls how fast the 3 point lowers. If you turn that knob which is actually a needle valve all the way down, it will prevent the 3point from lowering at all. Assuming no leaks internally.

The transmission and hydraulics may indeed share the same fluid, but I am not yet convinced of that.

The picture from underneath suggests that the sump is much smaller than I originally thought so it may just be a fill point.

Please pull the cap off of the sump and show us a picture of what is inside. If full of fluid you could take a piece of wire and bend about an inch at 90 degrees. Then used that to feel around inside to see if you can find an opening into the transmission.


Keep digging, you will figure it out.

 

[andy1dr]

It does have power steering. Is also a 4wd

 

[Bob Rooks]

I zoomed in on that second pic with the U-turn vent, and I think I see a shadow of a plug right next to it. Maybe a pic from the other side will confirm.

 

[andy1dr]

It does have power steering. Is also a 4wd

Oh and that hook under the seat is a solid hook. No

I zoomed in on that second pic with the U-turn vent, and I think I see a shadow of a plug right next to it. Maybe a pic from the other side will confirm.

View attachment 810298

It is indeed a vent pipe. Not sure for what. I took it out (it's threaded in). When i took it out, it looked like it was just a plate below it

 

[piper184]

The vent is usually placed over a baffle to keep oil from sloshing out the vent. crude but effective.

It looks like that tractor used to be blue. It might be worth it to try removing the paint from the canister/sump to see if there are any decals or other marks on it to indicate fill level. They might be on the inside too.