hydraulic problem

[J_J]

This is a neat little gadget for detecting water in oil. I could not find what it cost.

Measurement of total water in any form whether dissolved , free or emulsified




Online Water in oil Monitor

 

[Soundguy]

I'm not a chemist.. and didn't stay in a HIE last night.. however.. alcohol is a polar solvent.. water is polar.. the alcohol disolves the water and holds in a soloution.

For a neat trick.. take a test tube of gasolene att 4-5 drips water... they obviously pool to the bottom.. .. take an eye dropper and start dripping in ( preverably 90% ) isopropyl alcohol with a lil agitation.. at some point you will have enough volume of alcohol to solvate the water... then you will have a test tube of seemingly just gas.. with an alcohol and disolved water content.. etc.

soundguy

No, that is not the case. I think that the Sea Foam stuff is added to circulate for a short while and then to drain and replace with new oil.

I am still trying to find out what happens to the alcohol when it has absorbed the water. For instance, does it then mix with with the other fluid, and is there any problem. Supposedly, the isopropyl will vaporize over time, and the naphtha is a degreaser, what happens to the water.

To add isopropyl to hydraulic fluid on a regular basis can't be a good thing. I would like to see the chemical break down or the hydraulic fluid before and after adding the water absorbers or removers. I might not be able to understand all of it, but at least I can compare.

While you do not seem to have a good opinion of Mr. Casey, He has been in the business for quite a while. I am not defending him, but experience counts for quite a lot. If you disagree with what he says, ask him directly and I am sure he will answer back. As for myself, I am just a layman still learning as I go.

 

[J_J]

Soundguy,

What you say is true, and when the correct mixture is achieved, it can be burned in a gas engine.

Alcohol will absorb a certain amount of water, and is also a solvent, which will mix with hydraulic fluid. In this situation, we are just adding solvents to whatever is there. I don't know about your tractor, but my Power-Trac holds 20 gal of motor oil which is used as the hydraulic fluid. I don't think it takes to much to emulsify any water in the system and render it unsafe or unreliable, and will damage things if left there for any length of time. For one thing, the viscosity probably changes, the oxidation of the fluid will increase, and performance will diminish. I was even thinking of using of a non-detergent single grade motor oil in my system because the water will, or should not mix, but settle to the bottom, which can be drained . I live in Florida , and we don't have severe cold like our northmen friends. Multi-grade is used simply to cover the limits of the operating range of the equipment. I am not a chemical engineer either, but I think it would take one to figure out what is acceptable in terms of water in hydraulic fluid. If it's looks milky, I would say to change it as soon as possible.

 

[J_J]

The more I search, the more data I find, as in the Racor hydraulic filters

Racor water-absorbing hydraulic filters feature a specially designed media that traps solid contaminants like dirt and rust, and damaging water. As the element fills with water and plugging occurs, flow slows and the head goes into a bypass mode. Water-absorbing spin-on hydraulic filters are available for virtually any application and are available in a 10 micron rating. To make monitoring easy, Racor offers a range of heads with pressure restriction gauges, including large diameter heads with standard, color coded bar gauges.

http://www.maesco.com/products/racor/racor.html

They also have water detection modules to send a signal to a dash mounted monitor, a light or horn, or both..

 

[Soundguy]

I'm not sure.. but I think we may be agreeing with each other.

I'm -NOT- advocating running water laden oil in the sump.. I'm advocating running good clean oil in the sump. All my posts refer to is dewatering of the sump to facilitate draining and cleaning.. not adding something in to make the water run and leave it there.. etc.

soundguy

Soundguy,

What you say is true, and when the correct mixture is achieved, it can be burned in a gas engine.

Alcohol will absorb a certain amount of water, and is also a solvent, which will mix with hydraulic fluid. In this situation, we are just adding solvents to whatever is there. I don't know about your tractor, but my Power-Trac holds 20 gal of motor oil which is used as the hydraulic fluid. I don't think it takes to much to emulsify any water in the system and render it unsafe or unreliable, and will damage things if left there for any length of time. For one thing, the viscosity probably changes, the oxidation of the fluid will increase, and performance will diminish. I was even thinking of using of a non-detergent single grade motor oil in my system because the water will, or should not mix, but settle to the bottom, which can be drained . I live in Florida , and we don't have severe cold like our northmen friends. Multi-grade is used simply to cover the limits of the operating range of the equipment. I am not a chemical engineer either, but I think it would take one to figure out what is acceptable in terms of water in hydraulic fluid. If it's looks milky, I would say to change it as soon as possible.

 

[john_bud]

Alcohol will absorb a certain amount of water,

.

Gaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!


Sorry, but I couldn't stand seeing that one more time.

Alcohol does not "absorb" water. As Soundguy stated, it is a polar solvent. That mean that it's - on one side and + on the other. Just like a magnet. So is water, so the water sticks to it by Vanderwalls forces. The other side of the alcohol is also stuck to a long chain hydrocarbon. The water is then no longer free, but is bound up. NOT ABSORBED. Small difference, but my chemistry teachers would be proud for pointing it out. When you add alcohol to gasoline, the same thing happens and the water is dragged along into the combustion process with the fuel. That's how it is removed from the tank. If not removed it freezes and bad things happen when it gets cold.

JJ, Your first posts on adding something to allow you to continue using watered hydraulic fluid is, as you found out, not possible. You did post on water absorbing filters. Donaldson also makes them. I use them in my TLB. The filter media has a sandwich of a material that does absorb water, and it can still filter. Pretty neat. Those are often used with a flushing machine. The larger filters can remove about 2 oz of water. The best thing is that they come in standard sizes and cost about the same as a normal filter.

If you want to build a cheap flushing machine, get a 110v pump from some place cheap like Harbor (about 40-60 bucks) and some filter heads (about 25 bucks each), 2 water absorbing filters (20-50 micron filtration on the first and 2-5 micron on the second - about 8-10 bucks each). If you buy one of the 1/4 turn drains that replace the drain plug you can then use soft line to go from the sump to the pump then run a soft line to the tank fill. Run that for an hour or two. You will remove nearly all of the particulates and water from the oil. It will go from milky white (if water contaminated) back to honey color in that time. If you have more than a couple oz of water in the oil, you should change the fluid. The water if left in the oil will form acids that you can't get out. If you can run the equipment while filtering and cycle the cylinders you can pretty much clean out the entire system.


jb