Hydro or Gear?

[rScotty]

What are you doing with your loader that requires that much precision? Inserting coins on vending machines or something? :laughing:

Hah, I wish I did! Imagine pulling up to the vending machine with a loader!

As for what I do these days....I do a lot of rock work and some grading... Building rock walls and setting stones into the ground as pathways. Pavillions and Patios....All ornamental landscape stuff - and often it ends up being done very close to buildings or along steep places. That's why I'm a bug on precision and carefully inching into position right now.

I've done some constuction in the past and will again, but not at the moment. And before that, general farm labor.

I've been lucky with manual clutches on my machines, and always seem to have on that works very well. But I've used others that were grabby and no good for anything more than go/nogo. Same with torque converters - but there I haven't been so lucky. Mine have always been a bit grabby. Like in the 310.

I haven't tried that new type of transmission that Yanmar has out - the "Vario" Integrated Hydro Mechanical Transmission (i-HMT), but am looking forward to trying it and hearing more about it. Yanmar has a history of being innovative & bringing out new drive systems that later become popular.
There's a good picture of it at: Drive Like a king with the Unique “Vario” Transmission on the New YT3 tractors｜PRODUCT｜Y MEDIA｜About YANMAR｜YANMAR

rScotty

 

[Fallon]

What are you doing with your loader that requires that much precision? Inserting coins on vending machines or something? :laughing:

Lastnight I was pulling the toneau cover off & putting a truck box in. Used the forks to save may back. Thought nothing of getting forks within inches of the truck while on a hill. No way I'd have done that with a geared machine & I do that all the time loading & unloading junk. I've driven crashboxes, GST & PowerShift. They all have their strengths but the HST is the easiest to use for anybody skilled or not & the most precise.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

Lastnight I was pulling the toneau cover off & putting a truck box in. Used the forks to save may back. Thought nothing of getting forks within inches of the truck while on a hill. No way I'd have done that with a geared machine & I do that all the time loading & unloading junk.

That kind of thing happens all the time around here, with gear drive loader tractors, NO "loader" dents in my pickups, so don't assume you need a whiner tranny to avoid "operator error"...

SR

 

[ptsg]

Lastnight I was pulling the toneau cover off & putting a truck box in. Used the forks to save may back. Thought nothing of getting forks within inches of the truck while on a hill. No way I'd have done that with a geared machine & I do that all the time loading & unloading junk. I've driven crashboxes, GST & PowerShift. They all have their strengths but the HST is the easiest to use for anybody skilled or not & the most precise.

Some people can handle clutches, other just can't at all... Now that a geared tractor can't be as precise is simply not true...

 

[k0ua]

Some people can handle clutches, other just can't at all... Now that a geared tractor can't be as precise is simply not true...

Did you watch my video? Tell me a gear tractor can move that slowly

 

[k0ua]

It is hilarious isn't it how people come on here and ask questions like "gear or hydro", start a discussion that goes on for years and they have long disappeared into the sunset to never be heard from again. Are they here as a part of this "discussion"? Nope. They got disgusted with the back and forth a long time ago and left. There is NO consensus on "gear vs. hydro". or "which tire is best?" or which orange brand is best And everyone knows that green/yellow paint is not only the best but the most expensive. too!. Ah, isn't it fun?.

 

[ptsg]

Did you watch my video? Tell me a gear tractor can move that slowly

Where is the video so I can watch it.

 

[Threepoint]

Where is the video so I can watch it.

See k0ua's post #24 in this thread for the link.

 

[ptsg]

Thanks Threepoint :thumbsup:

I can feather the clutch easily for a foot or two, which is the most that me or anyone else will need to get close to something. Yes I can do it for more that a foot but I really doubt there is a need for that.

But lets be real here, is there really a need for that speed? I seriously doubt it. Yes you can do it for a video, but you won't really do it everyday. Most likely you'll just coast slowly.

The only real advantage on a HST over a Geared tractor is just the speed you change between forward and reverse and vice versa.

 

[4570Man]

Thanks Threepoint

I can feather the clutch easily for a foot or two, which is the most that me or anyone else will need to get close to something. Yes I can do it for more that a foot but I really doubt there is a need for that.

But lets be real here, is there really a need for that speed? I seriously doubt it. Yes you can do it for a video, but you won't really do it everyday. Most likely you'll just coast slowly.

The only real advantage on a HST over a Geared tractor is just the speed you change between forward and reverse and vice versa.

Going that slow isn’t much of an advantage but the precision of the HST is a huge advantage for most compact tractor work. Being able to easily change the speed to any speed is another nice advantage. What advantage does gear offer in a compact tractor? Yea it’s been well established they’re more efficient for field work but compact tractors on this side of the pond don’t do field work.

 

[Fallon]

Thanks Threepoint

I can feather the clutch easily for a foot or two, which is the most that me or anyone else will need to get close to something. Yes I can do it for more that a foot but I really doubt there is a need for that.

But lets be real here, is there really a need for that speed? I seriously doubt it. Yes you can do it for a video, but you won't really do it everyday. Most likely you'll just coast slowly.

The only real advantage on a HST over a Geared tractor is just the speed you change between forward and reverse and vice versa.

I have a 3pt trencher. It requires going a steady couple feet per minute. Takes a gentile foot with a HST, impossible with a gear machine (unless it's got a SUPER low gearbox like a ditch witch).

It's also super nice for positioning my post hole digger on steep hills (or positioning anything precisely anywhere for that matter). Doable with a lot of effort on a gear machine most of the time, but takes a lot if effort & clutch life.

 

[pmsmechanic]

The only real advantage on a HST over a Geared tractor is just the speed you change between forward and reverse and vice versa.

Or when you are inching up to something to hook up to the three point,
or when you are snow blowing and want to go slow when the drifts are high and fast when there is only a light layer of snow,
or when your lawn has thicker and thinner areas that can use different speeds,
or when you are shaving off a layer of dirt with your front end loader and transporting it somewhere else,
or when you are using the loader to lift rafters onto building walls and you need to maneuver slowly and carefully,
or anywhere you want to move slowly and carefully without being on the clutch for an extended length of time,
or...... I'm sure I've missed a bunch yet but I hope you get the picture.

Yes these jobs can all be done with other transmissions but an HST is easier. If the "whine" bothers you that much then by all means don't buy an HST.

 

[ptsg]

Or when you are inching up to something to hook up to the three point,
or when you are snow blowing and want to go slow when the drifts are high and fast when there is only a light layer of snow,
or when your lawn has thicker and thinner areas that can use different speeds,
or when you are shaving off a layer of dirt with your front end loader and transporting it somewhere else,
or when you are using the loader to lift rafters onto building walls and you need to maneuver slowly and carefully,
or anywhere you want to move slowly and carefully without being on the clutch for an extended length of time,
or...... I'm sure I've missed a bunch yet but I hope you get the picture.

Yes these jobs can all be done with other transmissions but an HST is easier. If the "whine" bothers you that much then by all means don't buy an HST.

As I pointed out before, I have nothing against HST and wouldn't mind at all trying one. It's not me complaining about the whining. I don't mind it and some gear tractors will also whine a bit.

CUTs here are used hard in farming, land clearing, pulling huge loads of logs and much more, therefore HST just ain't gonna cut it and it's not available here. Maybe by a special order but that's a very remote option.

It's very common for a 40 or 50 HP tractor to pull a 16" Bottom plow full depth in hard clay in Medium range and probably 2nd or 3rd gear. Can a HST tractor do it? Yes, but most likely in low range and in a very slow pace with lots of noise, if that's a problem.

It's just that some people put HST on such an high pedestal, leaving a feeling for the distracted readers that there is an huge difference on what one transmission can do versus the other. When in reality that is not true.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

Did you watch my video? Tell me a gear tractor can move that slowly

A gear tractor can move that slowly. There, I told you...

YES, at idle my gear tractor will go that slow in the lowest creep gear and I have THREE tractors with creep trans...

SR

 

[txdon]

I had a Kubota HST and would highly recommend it, now that I'm using a JD HST I think gear would be nicer. The JD has a lot louder whine and only 2 gears instead of 3 like the Kubota had. So to answer your question: It depends on the specific tractor. One thing to keep in mind also is if you ever have a knee injury the HST will keep you on your tractor.

 

[tderrick]

I haven't read anything about longevity in this thread. Which system is more durable over time?

 

[RickB]

I haven't read anything about longevity in this thread. Which system is more durable over time?

There is no blanket answer. Use patterns and maintenance of the individual machines will provide different results.
I have seen hydrostatic transmissions destroyed in 600 hours because they had the original filter and were run hot.
I have seen gear drive tractors delivered on Friday and winched on the truck Monday with the clutch torn out because of ignorance.
I have seen many examples of both types give thousands of hours of great service.

 

[RalphVa]

Ok Folks i have an old Ford Hydro Subcompact but looking at upgrading to a new Kubota L2501. Just can't decide on the trans. What do you think? Leaning towards teh Hydro but I like to old style Gear also. Thanks!

Definitely HST. Nothing else is as safe, particularly on hills and uneven surfaces where you need instant movement change without possibility of killing the engine.

Only buy gear unless you're doing LOTS of plowing or long runs with an implement. Even on those long runs, it would be better to have HST in event of a problem requiring quick speed change. Think only for plowing. Who plows any more? No till is the thing.

Ralph

 

[Storm56]

Definitely HST. Nothing else is as safe, particularly on hills and uneven surfaces where you need instant movement change without possibility of killing the engine.

Only buy gear unless you're doing LOTS of plowing or long runs with an implement. Even on those long runs, it would be better to have HST in event of a problem requiring quick speed change. Think only for plowing. Who plows any more? No till is the thing.

Ralph

What???? Guess I must really live on the edge, only been driving gear tractors for 55 years without mishap. Have 5 tractors, 4 gear drive and one hydro, that sums up my opinion.

 

[LouNY]

I much prefer geared tractors over hydros.
I have been using a clutch for 60 years and just don't care for a hydro.
I load sand into a sander in the bed of a pickup during the winter,
that involves getting quite close to the side of the bed, so far no dents in the bed from the tractor.
Depending on whats going on I may be backing up to hitch up a wagon more then a dozen times a day,
and with implement draw bars only a half inch or less to work with. Unless it has an adjustable tongue.
I see absolutely no safety advantage for hydro over gear, actually a conventional full gear tractor which can be parked in low gear
on a hill is safer then relying on a parking brake or pawl on the service brakes.