newbury
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Was it named in honor of Mothers Day?
I filed for another patent this week
- Thread starter wroughtn_harv
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Was it named in honor of Mothers Day?
buckeyefarmer
Epic Contributor
Looks like a good invention.
bumperm
Veteran Member
As a non-prolific, (one patent) inventor, I'm occasionally approached by aspiring would be inventors for advice. I tell them that an important but often overlooked first step is to conduct a small scale market survey. A working prototype is most helpful for this. Show trusted friends and those who would know and ask if it's something they would find useful or desirable, and how much they would be willing to pay for one.
With my "Grabbit" I had a significant advantage as my alarm technicians and installers loved it, using the tool for some months before I sought a patent . . . I was assured it was a winner going in. I knew all manner of electricians, cable TV, home entertainment, and alarm installers would likey want one. That turned out to be case, with several hundred thousand tools sold during the 18 year term of the patent.
As to pricing, years ago, someone told me a rule of thumb for manufactured goods. They should retail for about 5 times their cost in raw materials and labor to manufacture. Distribution typically wants about 30%. Many retailers of small goods want a 100% mark up from their wholesale cost. Admittedly these numbers may be dated as they are from a time before on-line shopping and also before we let the Chinese decimate much of US manufacturing.
Interesting to note that in the USA, only one in twenty patent applications is granted (just under 5% of patent applications by individuals for 2013). The average going back is somewhat better, but still only 8%.
If that sounds like the odds are stacked against the hapless inventor, the money side is even worse, as most things patentable are not necessarily commercially viable. The number of patents that ever turn a profit is just 3%. So of all those patent applications, only a paltry .15% make money. Better odds than the lottery for sure, though it might be wise to hang on to your day job.
bumper
With my "Grabbit" I had a significant advantage as my alarm technicians and installers loved it, using the tool for some months before I sought a patent . . . I was assured it was a winner going in. I knew all manner of electricians, cable TV, home entertainment, and alarm installers would likey want one. That turned out to be case, with several hundred thousand tools sold during the 18 year term of the patent.
As to pricing, years ago, someone told me a rule of thumb for manufactured goods. They should retail for about 5 times their cost in raw materials and labor to manufacture. Distribution typically wants about 30%. Many retailers of small goods want a 100% mark up from their wholesale cost. Admittedly these numbers may be dated as they are from a time before on-line shopping and also before we let the Chinese decimate much of US manufacturing.
Interesting to note that in the USA, only one in twenty patent applications is granted (just under 5% of patent applications by individuals for 2013). The average going back is somewhat better, but still only 8%.
If that sounds like the odds are stacked against the hapless inventor, the money side is even worse, as most things patentable are not necessarily commercially viable. The number of patents that ever turn a profit is just 3%. So of all those patent applications, only a paltry .15% make money. Better odds than the lottery for sure, though it might be wise to hang on to your day job.
bumper
Cat_Driver
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I agree 100%. Also as an owner of a patent the only one that made money on my patent was the government and the lawyer. Yes it's easy ti invent, east to get a patent, but then the hard work starts. The greatest idea in the world isn't worth the paper it's written on unless someone is buying it. Then once they buy it you have the fear of someone suing you because they decided to shove it down their throat and it's YOU FAULT.
I don't want to burst any ones bubble, but reality bites when it comes yo patents and inventions.
OP
wroughtn_harv
Super Member
It would be interesting to know what you patented.
I have three patents. After the first one I decided that would never happen again. The patent lawyer came out of the yellow pages and was a total flake. Heck, he came to me for funds after his artist blew the drawings like it was my fault.
The next two came about because a client with twenty some plant patents paid for his patent attorney to chase the patent for a percentage. Once again, patent attorney was a flake. Partner walked after his attorney said we would never get a patent. I went with a patent attorney that worked with a friend at a major law firm in Dallas. She made it happen. Well, her efforts and the new attitude at the Patent Office made it happen. The original rejection insisted that we apply for two patents because we had too many claims for one. So that is what we did.
We got the first one. She called me to tell me that something had happened that she had never experienced before. An examiner called her and asked her some questions and then said it would be approved. She said the policy at the Patent Office always before was to reject and then it was up to the attorney to figure out why.
The first reason for denying the second patent application was "Chin teaches". That's patentnese for "someone already had patented that". Well Chin is out of Taiwan and his patent was on the mechanism that makes those soccer mom folding chairs fit into the fabric tubes. Mine was on a mechanism for building with pipe and purlins. I saw that as saying we couldn't patent pecans as nuts because someone had a patent on mountain oysters. Well, the last chance to appeal came up and the final word on it was "Chin teaches".
I grabbed the paper copy of the application and then pulled up Chin's patent online. What I saw blew me away. It was like my attorneys had plagiarized Chin's attorney. Completely different concepts, same words and phrases. I sat down and explained to the patent attorney why we were different from Chin and six weeks later we got the patent issued. Two teams of attorneys and it took a high school dropout to wade in and get it straightened out.
I haven't made any money off of the previous patents. The first one is still being manufactured and marketed by a friend and for that's fine. He doesn't make much and he is a good friend so that's okay. The last two I'm having trouble marketing. But this year I will pay a grand for maintenance to keep the last one current, it was a grand late last year for the first of the pair. I still believe it's a great concept and will some day make money.
I happen to believe that the DeMudder is the second best idea I've ever had. The best idea I made open source. That's Ubuntublox. What I've discovered there is that philanthropy attracts the kind of people who are preachers or want to be preachers. It's all about the show. Motion without movement is the best way I've heard it described. We designed it for the masses and the original machines ended up being used for fund raising and only fund raising. My intention was to get it out into the communities to create jobs and homes and instead it is like those ads you see on tv late at night where they get you with the pictures of the orphans. I have designed a machine now that can do the block making easier and faster and it can be made with dismantled wood pallets. Others are now in charge of Ubuntublox and I'm a technical consultant.
The odds are against the inventor for sure. And that might be fair when you think about it. It wouldn't be right if someone experienced the high of inventing and also experienced great wealth. We invent because we can, think of sky diving. My inventions always have involved making work easier. I'm proud of that.
bumperm
Veteran Member
I agree, Harv. Most of my inventions have also been about making work easier, and a few have been about "improving things". As I mentioned in previous posts, the only thing I bothered to patent was the "Grabbit", and that made a lot of money. A number of my other unpatented inventions are profitable as well, they enjoy a small niche market and are protected only by virtue of the fact that I keep the somewhat complex manufacturing process secret, that and I doubt anyone would bother copying them anyway :c).
No question inventors tend to be most passionate and proud of their "toys". Guilty as charged, I've often made something small, then "fondled" it while watching TV in the evening . . . silly, I know, but that's just how we are. Part of the joy of inventing something, of which you speak, is in sharing it with others and knowing that they appreciate the fruits of your inventiveness and labor. You can see a similar thing here on TBN as people go to considerable effort to document their projects and post them here for others. Not a penny to be made, but certainly the appreciation of all those who benefit from your work. I know I have learned a lot from many of the inventive people who post here - - thank you all!
bumper
Sodo
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Good job learning the patent process. I like to make stuff too, and have studied patents a lot, but never really move forward. Your first experience was "school", which allowed you the knowledge to get to the second. Good thing you marched on!
I suppose it sits on the ground, and you whack (or scrape) the shovel on it? Production welding costs too much and it doesn't ship/pack well?I'd bolt it. But that's just my 2cents if you are interested. Best of luck!
OP
wroughtn_harv
Super Member
Yes, it is "smacked" and inertia is our friend.
I'm giving them out on loan to friends who have crews working in the clay. What is fascinating is the warmth of the reception of the idea is related to one's involvement in digging in the clay. Those who do the work embrace it whole heartedly and those who only point others to dig don't seem to get it.
My logic is to get it out into the hands of the laborers. Here in Texas they are predominately Hispanic. And contrary to the popular opinion of the majority here the Hispanic population is very connected. If some laborers find this device worthwhile they will be discussing it all around the metroplex (Dallas-FtWorth) and that will create a demand advertising can't.
Sodo
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Yes do that step to study the functionality of the in-use part. But for sales, it has to appeal to the one who buys eqpt. And this has to be an eqpt buyer who gets in the hole sometimes, or he won't see the value.
With laborers it depends on how they get paid, by the job or by the hour. The hourly guys could look at it like another crazy scheme to reduce their hours, this is that they will discuss about it! By all means get all the info you can.