I would add that you should feel free to ask for assistance. I think you understand the concerns some of us had, and they do not relate to you personally, or your need or ability to ask for information or assistance here. Tom Veatch is right too...while it is surely unpleasant, if it's the worst mistake you make for the rest of your life, things will be good. And bear this in mind-- as you describe the situation I can see no place where you have done anything worthy of fault. Perhaps you could have been more proactive, but YOU did not engage in any deceptive practice, nor send defective payment to the seller. There is an accounting, and it will not be you doing the accounting for this situation. Take heart.
If you are thinking about buying a gray market tractor
- Thread starter Mech
- Start date
- Views: 15470
Certainly not the worst mistake I've made. Have been married 3 times.
Also should be more than old enough to know that there are people that are less than honest in this world. Unfortunately I have never gotten over being shocked, outraged and disappointed when someone is dishonest with me.
In the end I'm probably lucky in that I did get a tractor, have something that I can fix and have learned another valuable lesson.
-bob
Also should be more than old enough to know that there are people that are less than honest in this world. Unfortunately I have never gotten over being shocked, outraged and disappointed when someone is dishonest with me.
In the end I'm probably lucky in that I did get a tractor, have something that I can fix and have learned another valuable lesson.
-bob
Mech said:
If you ever buy another tractor, it will never cause problems with your old tractor. In fact, keeping your old tractor as well, is widely encouraged here.
If you ever do sell your tractor, no lawyer needed.
I'd say things are already looking better for you.
turnerbend
Silver Member
For some reason I knew you were an engineer from your first post.
You should learn from your mistakes. Never, never buy a 30 year old pig in a poke.
You should learn from your mistakes. Never, never buy a 30 year old pig in a poke.
Jagmandave
Veteran Member
Naw, this is going to turn out OK in the end. Even tho this tractor needs a "little work", when you're done you'll probably have a pretty solid machine that you'll use for years.....................................................or not! 
Good luck with getting it running, and remember to use your good judgement when rebuilding the engine and don't scrimp, spend what you need to to get a good result.
We'll help any way we can............
Good luck with getting it running, and remember to use your good judgement when rebuilding the engine and don't scrimp, spend what you need to to get a good result.
We'll help any way we can............
I know I disappeared from the forum for a while and I just wanted to bring everyone up to date on my experience. The alternator on my 1610D stopped charging and I discovered an oil leak on the right rear wheel so I stopped fixing things and gave up on the idea to overhaul the engine. The dealer and I talked and they suggested that I return the tractor for a refund minus the original shipping to my house. That seemed generous and as good a deal as I could get. In any case I didn’t want to post until I received my money and now I have.
I’m certain that there are many good gray market tractors out there but in my opinion this wasn’t one of them, although I’m sure my dealer disagrees. I obviously didn’t do enough research and take full responsibility for that and consider myself very luck to get out for as little money and labor as I did.
Not wanting to take any more chances, I went out and bought a new John Deere 790 with a box blade, Front End Loader with bucket and blade attachment. The tractor cost just about twice as much as the 1610D but JD was offering 3 year zero interest loans. I’m very happy with it, after all it is a Yanmar. It starts, has lots of power and I got a chance to clear a foot of heavy wet snow in early May and the blade on the FEL worked great. I do miss the power shift and the folding ROPS but this tractor is bigger, stronger, a few more features and has a warrantee with a dealer just down the mountain.
Few pictures attached. I now lurk on the John Deere forum.
I do have a few parts that I purchased for the 1610D that I haven’t yet sold, listed in the classifieds on TBN if anyone is interested. Except for the steering shaft which is the one I replaced, the parts were bought new and have been used for less than 2 months. The steering problem turned out to be a broken lower bearing but I had already bought the shaft, shims, seal and both bearings so I put them in. This is the used shaft and I can’t detect any play in the shaft or the bearing. In any case I will consider any offer on any of the items.
• Prince Control Valve with float (RD522GCGA5A4B1) that was bought new and on the tractor less than a month. Prince Two-Spool Control Valve, Model# RD522GCGA5A4B1 | Valves | Northern Tool + Equipment
• English Yanmar 1610D Owners Manual
• 194190-26860-X COVER, P.T.O. SHAFT 00330
• 194151-57100 HORN
• HL-4420 HOOD LATCH ASSEMBLY
• TC-5504 Fuel cap (metal)
• Used Steering shaft and one bearing
I’m certain that there are many good gray market tractors out there but in my opinion this wasn’t one of them, although I’m sure my dealer disagrees. I obviously didn’t do enough research and take full responsibility for that and consider myself very luck to get out for as little money and labor as I did.
Not wanting to take any more chances, I went out and bought a new John Deere 790 with a box blade, Front End Loader with bucket and blade attachment. The tractor cost just about twice as much as the 1610D but JD was offering 3 year zero interest loans. I’m very happy with it, after all it is a Yanmar. It starts, has lots of power and I got a chance to clear a foot of heavy wet snow in early May and the blade on the FEL worked great. I do miss the power shift and the folding ROPS but this tractor is bigger, stronger, a few more features and has a warrantee with a dealer just down the mountain.
Few pictures attached. I now lurk on the John Deere forum.
I do have a few parts that I purchased for the 1610D that I haven’t yet sold, listed in the classifieds on TBN if anyone is interested. Except for the steering shaft which is the one I replaced, the parts were bought new and have been used for less than 2 months. The steering problem turned out to be a broken lower bearing but I had already bought the shaft, shims, seal and both bearings so I put them in. This is the used shaft and I can’t detect any play in the shaft or the bearing. In any case I will consider any offer on any of the items.
• Prince Control Valve with float (RD522GCGA5A4B1) that was bought new and on the tractor less than a month. Prince Two-Spool Control Valve, Model# RD522GCGA5A4B1 | Valves | Northern Tool + Equipment
• English Yanmar 1610D Owners Manual
• 194190-26860-X COVER, P.T.O. SHAFT 00330
• 194151-57100 HORN
• HL-4420 HOOD LATCH ASSEMBLY
• TC-5504 Fuel cap (metal)
• Used Steering shaft and one bearing
Attachments
I'm glad for you that you feel you came out with as little loss as possible. From my standpoint the unforgiveable grievance that the dealer apparently never addressed was shipping you a tractor other than what you bought. Sending you pictures of a unit that you agree to buy and then shipping a different unit (and I don't think I recall....wasn't it even a different model?) is either incompetence or dishonesty, and in either case the dealer should have made a resolution satisfactory to you many months ago. Given that you have been pretty low key and more than patient, and have apparently documented what happened, and given the "grey eye" this thread gave us all initially (and I fully acknowledge that you had NO such intent....I do realize that) I wish now that you are done with it you would consider naming the seller. Regardless, you made a good choice with the 790, and I hope it serves you long and well.
It wasn't a different model but definitely and admitted by the dealer a different tractor than they sent pictures of and that I sent them money for. If the tractor hadn't had such a series of problems I could have lived with getting a different tractor than I was shown. The dealer said that since I wanted a drawbar they switched to a tractor with one. I have no evidence that that wasn't the case, but it didn't make for a trusting relationship from the beginning.
I have been patient with them because I didn't really have any other option and I wanted my money back and I won't name the dealer because they did the right thing in the end and I only have one sample of their product so it would be vindictive to disclose them and I am not that.
If I buy another used tractor here is a few things that I would do differently.
- If you can go with a dealer that posts here frequently. There are good dealers and the people that try to help Yanmar owners on TBN every day are some of them.
- get good references and not just from web sites but people you can talk to and ask questions of
- fly or drive to see the tractor if you can
- Don't take delivery of a tractor at night and if it isn't what you expected don't take delivery at all
- get the serial number of the tractor on the bill of sale
- and if it was me I wouldn't buy a tractor that has been "reconditioned" and has had the hour meter reset. I know that opens a bag of worms on this forum but it is my personal opinion based on a sample of one.
I'm sure that there is more but that is just a few of the most glaring mistakes that I made.
I have been patient with them because I didn't really have any other option and I wanted my money back and I won't name the dealer because they did the right thing in the end and I only have one sample of their product so it would be vindictive to disclose them and I am not that.
If I buy another used tractor here is a few things that I would do differently.
- If you can go with a dealer that posts here frequently. There are good dealers and the people that try to help Yanmar owners on TBN every day are some of them.
- get good references and not just from web sites but people you can talk to and ask questions of
- fly or drive to see the tractor if you can
- Don't take delivery of a tractor at night and if it isn't what you expected don't take delivery at all
- get the serial number of the tractor on the bill of sale
- and if it was me I wouldn't buy a tractor that has been "reconditioned" and has had the hour meter reset. I know that opens a bag of worms on this forum but it is my personal opinion based on a sample of one.
I'm sure that there is more but that is just a few of the most glaring mistakes that I made.
Bob,
I have to state my disagreement with you as I do not think that they did the right thing (which would have included NOT keeping your shipping money) and what they did do took literally months. BTW, it takes two minutes to move a drawbar from one tractor to another....one pin, with an "R" pin through it. It would have been way too easy to move the drawbar (not to mention the proper and ethical thing to do) to the tractor you actually bought. And failing that, they should have called you for approval. I still think they did very little right. I will, however, respect your decision to not disclose the dealer.
You make some very good points, some of which I make all the time. GET REFERENCES. Reading alleged input on a dealer's website is just plain silly, and that's why we don't do that. Your point about serial number is well taken too. Even when a customer picks out a unit on the lot, we show them where the serial # is located, and write it on the invoice. That way there is no question when the unit is delivered. For customers buying "sight unseen" we usually send a package of pictures AND a serial number, so they can confirm they get the correct tractor.
We recently sold a unit to a man in WI who had actually bought a tractor from a recon dealer while out of state on a job. He took extensive pictures, and the dealer apparently did not know that. When the day came to return to WI and he went to get his tractor, guess what? Different unit. Dealer claimed it was the same until confronted with the pictures...according to the customer the pics made it very obvious. Dealer then claimed some mistake was made, and so on, but the customer got his money back very quickly after making it clear he would take legal action. This is why I am skeptical....we get a lot of calls & emails, and this is not the first time I've heard a story like yours. Tends to make me think it is not a completely rare occurence in a certain sector of the market.
In any case, I really think you will be happy with the 790 and I am glad you feel you have extricated yourself from a bad situation. Take care.
I have to state my disagreement with you as I do not think that they did the right thing (which would have included NOT keeping your shipping money) and what they did do took literally months. BTW, it takes two minutes to move a drawbar from one tractor to another....one pin, with an "R" pin through it. It would have been way too easy to move the drawbar (not to mention the proper and ethical thing to do) to the tractor you actually bought. And failing that, they should have called you for approval. I still think they did very little right. I will, however, respect your decision to not disclose the dealer.
You make some very good points, some of which I make all the time. GET REFERENCES. Reading alleged input on a dealer's website is just plain silly, and that's why we don't do that. Your point about serial number is well taken too. Even when a customer picks out a unit on the lot, we show them where the serial # is located, and write it on the invoice. That way there is no question when the unit is delivered. For customers buying "sight unseen" we usually send a package of pictures AND a serial number, so they can confirm they get the correct tractor.
We recently sold a unit to a man in WI who had actually bought a tractor from a recon dealer while out of state on a job. He took extensive pictures, and the dealer apparently did not know that. When the day came to return to WI and he went to get his tractor, guess what? Different unit. Dealer claimed it was the same until confronted with the pictures...according to the customer the pics made it very obvious. Dealer then claimed some mistake was made, and so on, but the customer got his money back very quickly after making it clear he would take legal action. This is why I am skeptical....we get a lot of calls & emails, and this is not the first time I've heard a story like yours. Tends to make me think it is not a completely rare occurence in a certain sector of the market.
In any case, I really think you will be happy with the 790 and I am glad you feel you have extricated yourself from a bad situation. Take care.
