ignition left on, now won't start with key.

[brokenknee]

Thanks for all the replies, it most likely be next weekend before I can look at it again. Although I usually only work eight hours a day, I have a 90 mile commute one way. So I spend a total of about three hours a day commuting.

People think I am nuts (and I may be) but I am living where I want, and working where I need to. Jobs in the area don't pay that well, at least the ones I have looked at.

 

[brokenknee]

Have you tried to place an amp meter in each circuit to trace where the current is going? Is you manual good enough for you to trace out all the voltage paths. If something is drawing current, it should be getting warm. Do you have one of these electronic temp guns with laser pointer that you aim at whatever component you want the temp reading?

The manual I have is only an operator's manual, I have always meant to get a better one, but never had the need for it until now.

I do have a laser temp gun, never thought of using it for this though. Will be getting it out next weekend.

Have not tried to trace with an amp meter, I do not have a clamp one that reads direct current.

 

[777777]

Hi,

If you go here ... Cub no crank start problems -- Cub Cadet , this issue is spoken about with fixes since common problem in Cub.

Manuals are also available for download if you search around there.

Hope it helps.

 

[Transit]

Without a manual, that puts you at an extreme disadvantage. An inferred gun and ammeter will need a lot of interpretation on your part.
The method you are using to locate the cause of such a voltage drop is correct and you have experience using it. Somewhere you will find 12 volts on one terminal of a component and on another terminal 9.2 volts; it is like having a resistor in the circuit where it should not be. Cause, bad contact points in a switch or relay, bad contact points in a connector, bad connection wire to terminal in a connector. Your getting hot, hotter, hotter......

I read through the link that 777777 posted. I made the same mod on my Jinma because of undersized wires inability to carry the large current to energize the solenoid. But first find the cause of the voltage drop then we can come up with a fix.

 

[Soundguy]

you can always use a volt meter and test across each wire / connection and look for voltage DROP.

soundguy

 

[sjb]

While 9V is low, its still a lot more than the 0V that you are measuring on the solenoid coil. If you are truly getting 0V at the small wire of the solenoid, I would resolve that before worrying about 9V on the neutral switch.

I assume that you did the obvious and checked the fuses.

I would trace the wire from the solenoid, check the voltage at each connection. When you measure voltage, that is the place to look for your problem.

 

[J_J]

It would be logical, that if the system uses relays, that the contacts might weld together if voltage is left on for an extended time. You can trace the voltage from the start or end source. If you don't have voltage at the start terminal, back up through the system, o,r follow the 12v until it decreases. If you have any spare relays, just swap them out.

 

[Soundguy]

i think yer thinkin bacwards' the 0v at the solenoid is likely directly related 9v at the NS switch, and both are likely related to a v-drop upstream. just follow the breadcrumb trail.. make one meter probe ground, the other is a sniffer.. follow the volts.. keep checking back one connection at a time till you find good power.. then check out that connection(s) after it.

soundguy

While 9V is low, its still a lot more than the 0V that you are measuring on the solenoid coil. If you are truly getting 0V at the small wire of the solenoid, I would resolve that before worrying about 9V on the neutral switch.

I assume that you did the obvious and checked the fuses.

I would trace the wire from the solenoid, check the voltage at each connection. When you measure voltage, that is the place to look for your problem.

 

[J_J]

Some relays have a simple schematic on them. If you think it is a relay, pull it out and connect 12v and then use meter to see if it is switching like it should.

You have been given a lot of advice here, so if you have the tools, and schematic, you should be able to track the problem down to a component.

I have a neat little device for circuit tracking. It sends a signal down the wire, and you use a small tracer to follow the wire and signal.

 

[brokenknee]

View attachment 7305 Electric System.pdf

I had a little time today. Spent a couple hours trying to trace down the problem. I went to my cub dealer and he had an electrical system diagram he printed out for me.

One of the mechanics happened to walk by and the counter guy asked him his opinion on what might be wrong. First thing he said was make sure your PTO lever is not engaged, he said they get about four or five tractors a year brought in because they won't start because the PTO is engaged.

WELL the very little light went off in my head, that is one thing I had not checked. I still have to find the switch, I missed it when tracing the wires. Got home first thing I did was go to the shed, sure enough the PTO was engaged. Disengaged it and it fired right up.

I know people told me to check everything, I wasn't even aware there was a safety switch on the PTO. Just totally spaced it out.

Now I really feel like a dumb arse, the wife said no one needed to know. I told her that I had posted my problem on the tractor forum and it would be just rude not to let the posters know the out come.

In my defense I only use the PTO for my snow blower and that is not mounted yet. It was my sisters boyfriend that put in gear, but he was doing me a favor by giving me a set of forks from a fork lift so I can not even be mad at him.

Thanks again for all the help.

 

[Soundguy]

yep.. post 6 called out the pto.

look at it like this.

you found it.

now you are good to go.. and wasn't a lot of money or hassle invested.. plus it kept us busy for a few days.

glad you got it.

soundguy

View attachment 183577

I had a little time today. Spent a couple hours trying to trace down the problem. I went to my cub dealer and he had an electrical system diagram he printed out for me.

One of the mechanics happened to walk by and the counter guy asked him his opinion on what might be wrong. First thing he said was make sure your PTO lever is not engaged, he said they get about four or five tractors a year brought in because they won't start because the PTO is engaged.

WELL the very little light went off in my head, that is one thing I had not checked. I still have to find the switch, I missed it when tracing the wires. Got home first thing I did was go to the shed, sure enough the PTO was engaged. Disengaged it and it fired right up.

I know people told me to check everything, I wasn't even aware there was a safety switch on the PTO. Just totally spaced it out.

Now I really feel like a dumb arse, the wife said no one needed to know. I told her that I had posted my problem on the tractor forum and it would be just rude not to let the posters know the out come.

In my defense I only use the PTO for my snow blower and that is not mounted yet. It was my sisters boyfriend that put in gear, but he was doing me a favor by giving me a set of forks from a fork lift so I can not even be mad at him.

Thanks again for all the help.

 

[czechsonofagun]

View attachment 183577
Now I really feel like a dumb arse, the wife said no one needed to know. I told her that I had posted my problem on the tractor forum and it would be just rude not to let the posters know the out come.

In my defense I only use the PTO for my snow blower and that is not mounted yet. It was my sisters boyfriend that put in gear, but he was doing me a favor by giving me a set of forks from a fork lift so I can not even be mad at him.

Thanks again for all the help.

Join the club, we have t-shirts I had many of these moments over the time. Like taking a compressor for busted for good - and it was just the overheating protection. Did not use my compressor for a year or so.

 

[Ford tractor]

PTO switch interlock on>?

OMG! You're the first one in the history of tractors to ever make that mistake.


(not!:laughing


In fact, I use the mid-pto switch on some machines to prevent un-authorized use as it's a hard one to see.


The PTO switch is one that bites many of us on occasion.

 

[brokenknee]

Yep, after the mechanic said it I remembered it had already been said here. I just plain forgot to look for it after the post. I think from now on when (not if) I have a problem I will have to print out the replies and bring them with me to the shed.

Thanks for all the help, this is a great forum. One that is not to heavily regulated by the mods. There is another forum I used to visit more often (not a tractor forum) but when ever there would be disagreement between two members that would go on for more than a couple of post they would kill the thread.

 

[J_J]

This kind of situation is an example where a good electrical schematic would come in handy, and a VOM.

Durning my Navy days as an electronics technician, I remember is electronics school, the instructors would put troubles in the radios and navigation units. Like cutting a wire and sliding the insulation over the cut, adding in the wrong resistor, cold solder joint, a faulty switch, etc.

Without a schematic we would be almost totally lost.

With the tractor scenario.
The little beeper I mentioned above, would have found the problem, because the signal would have stopped at the PTO switch.

In an unrelated electrical problem. I had a Toyota Camry, lost all power to dash, electric door locks, windows motors, Kept blowing fuses. Sure I could trace wires. Getting to the wire bundles was a big problem. Gave up for a while, and one day I thought to search the Internet for Toyota electrical problems, Read some interesting problems and fixes, and one of those was to check the wire bundle by the trunk hinge for abrasion. Sure enough, I could see the copper wire that was causing all the problem. Secured it down to the sidewall, and everything was good.

 

[brokenknee]

This kind of situation is an example where a good electrical schematic would come in handy, and a VOM.

Durning my Navy days as an electronics technician, I remember is electronics school, the instructors would put troubles in the radios and navigation units. Like cutting a wire and sliding the insulation over the cut, adding in the wrong resistor, cold solder joint, a faulty switch, etc.

Without a schematic we would be almost totally lost.

With the tractor scenario.
The little beeper I mentioned above, would have found the problem, because the signal would have stopped at the PTO switch.

In an unrelated electrical problem. I had a Toyota Camry, lost all power to dash, electric door locks, windows motors, Kept blowing fuses. Sure I could trace wires. Getting to the wire bundles was a big problem. Gave up for a while, and one day I thought to search the Internet for Toyota electrical problems, Read some interesting problems and fixes, and one of those was to check the wire bundle by the trunk hinge for abrasion. Sure enough, I could see the copper wire that was causing all the problem. Secured it down to the sidewall, and everything was good.

I will definitely have to get a good manual for the tractor.

What type/brand of tracer do you have?

 

[J_J]

I will try and locate it and provide more data.

 

[J_J]

This is the signal/wire tracer that I have and can be found at Home Depot. I have used it quite a bit. Small and compact, Easy to hook up and trace.

Disconnect the vehicle battery while testing.

Gardner Bender Lan Tracker Wire Tracer, Gardner Bender - GET-4220K at The Home Depot

Here is a similar tester.

http://www.hardwareandtools.com/Gar...-Tracker-Lan-Tracker-Wire-Tracer-6787691.html

 

[brokenknee]

This is the signal/wire tracer that I have and can be found at Home Depot. I have used it quite a bit. Small and compact, Easy to hook up and trace.

Disconnect the vehicle battery while testing.

Gardner Bender Lan Tracker Wire Tracer, Gardner Bender - GET-4220K at The Home Depot

Here is a similar tester.

Gardner Bender ET64220 Wire Tracker Lan Tracker Wire Tracer #6787691 at HardwareAndTools.com

Thanks, I do see that the tracer got a bad review from the only one that took time to review it.

It sounds like you have had pretty good success with it though.

I have some Home Depot gift certificates that I have had for awhile, maybe this would be something I should get.

 

[J_J]

You could purchase it and do some test, and check out wiring from different things. like cars, tractors,house wiring. I did a wiring on an F-150 from front to back, and it worked like they said. It is simply using the wire as a transmitter antenna. A good test would be to get a friend and an 8 wire cable and have him select a wire to put the transmitter on, and you at the other end find out which wire is the one he selected.

I have several different tracers. A sprinkler system tracer, a circuit breaker tracer, and the little red tracer I use for auto/tractor work.