quicksandfarmer
Elite Member
That's easy: assets which represent a claim on a future stream of income. Like stocks, bonds and real estate.
Is it too soon to talk about Crypto yet?
- Thread starter MinnesotaEric
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That's easy: assets which represent a claim on a future stream of income. Like stocks, bonds and real estate.
OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
Loose fiscal policy killed bond yields for years by the time the yield and M2 money supply were factored in because Treasuries around the world issued more debt and then ran off and bought other currencies as a way to try to bolster the value of their own currency.
This gets back to my earlier statement about money supply getting confused with real tangible growth when it really was just devaluing buying power and inflating prices.
I'm suddenly reminded of Hayek talking about the "hair of the dog" when Keynes wakes up with a hangover from spending too much in the econ rap battle video from years ago.
OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
Edit: Apparently when posting from an iPhone, the forum software thinks numbers are emojis. Fixing that issue from my desktop.
Interpretive Letter 1183 from the Comptroller allows banks to custody crypto.
AltcoinDaily explains what this means.
Also, Altcoin doesn’t understand that crypto prices are back to getting knocked down again because the new administration isn’t immediately buying crypto and sentiment is negative as a result and so pricing is following the futures markets.
With negative pressure building up over the weekend, Mr. Market woke up wanting to sell everything and risking off after finally noticing the recession everybody else knows we've been in for over a year because our GovCo "fudged" employment records and increased government spending to hide the private sector spending contraction that came about from increased interest rates. Good job, Keynesians!
We'll never need money again... (again).
Interpretive Letter 1183 from the Comptroller allows banks to custody crypto.
AltcoinDaily explains what this means.
Also, Altcoin doesn’t understand that crypto prices are back to getting knocked down again because the new administration isn’t immediately buying crypto and sentiment is negative as a result and so pricing is following the futures markets.
With negative pressure building up over the weekend, Mr. Market woke up wanting to sell everything and risking off after finally noticing the recession everybody else knows we've been in for over a year because our GovCo "fudged" employment records and increased government spending to hide the private sector spending contraction that came about from increased interest rates. Good job, Keynesians!
We'll never need money again... (again).
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A trader thinks that the prices of eggs are going to increase, and so he contacts his broker and asks him to buy 1,000,000 egg futures at $1.70
Sure enough, a week later, the price of egg futures is $2.50, and the trader, happy to ride his winners, places an order for 3,000,000 more egg futures
Next month, at $4.30 a piece, he pats himself on the back and restructures his liquid investments to buy another 10,000,000 egg futures
At the end of the quarter, egg futures are trading at $7, and the trader finally calls up his broker and tells him to sell them all
The broker replies: “To who? You’re the egg man!”
Sure enough, a week later, the price of egg futures is $2.50, and the trader, happy to ride his winners, places an order for 3,000,000 more egg futures
Next month, at $4.30 a piece, he pats himself on the back and restructures his liquid investments to buy another 10,000,000 egg futures
At the end of the quarter, egg futures are trading at $7, and the trader finally calls up his broker and tells him to sell them all
The broker replies: “To who? You’re the egg man!”
OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
The egg man, Heh! Sounds like a Beatles song.
Crypto-wise, there isn't as much leverage in the system as there once was just a few years ago but with every nation pledging spending, money supply is going to expand.
That said, a limit order of mine for Bitcoin tripped today below $78K. I have no fear of catching a knife (or sitting on a cornflake) as I've got a long-term view and if I liked $BTC at $100K, I like it even more right now!
That said, margin call-talk and forced liquidation talk certainly looks to be on the rise over on X!
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OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
Meanwhile, toward the end of yesterday, there was talk that our newest President was purposely crashing the market in order to give a reason for the Federal Reserve to lower interest rates and the market opened slightly up, but that turned into a dead cat an hour into today's session only to reverse again when US Congressman Nick Begich announced to introduce a Strategic Bitcoin Reserve bill with 6 other Congressmen co-sponsoring the bill.
Also, since it has been a minute since I last posted an update, let's revisit the State Legislation map.
Also, since it has been a minute since I last posted an update, let's revisit the State Legislation map.
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OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
I tend to agree with you but the introduction of a zillion meme sh*tcoins using Pump.Fun on Solana and the rug-pulls that followed also halted alt-season through dilution and bad experiences.
That said, the memes are still fun!
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Fuddyduddy1952
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- john deere
$83,272.68 USD
+$4,521.21 (5.74%)today
Some people made a lot today.
I have no idea the buying/selling commission is.
+$4,521.21 (5.74%)today
Some people made a lot today.
I have no idea the buying/selling commission is.
OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
Some coins are up much, much more. $DOGE, for example, was up over 15% from its bottom once the second rally settled in by early afternoon. Meanwhile, the broader equities market, while still down, has cut its losses in half as Ontario's Ford and the Commerce Secretary, Lutnick, have started talking to work out an agreement.
The funny thing is Mr. Market believes everything every day falling for the same things time and time again as money managers dump, cover, or buy to preserve gains or establish positions to make gains.
That said commissions are nothing compared to the spread between the actual spot price and the price the brokerage fills orders. We call that spread, "slippage."
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MinnesotaEric
Super Member
Yesterday Michael Saylor presented a Keynote Speech at the Bitcoin Conference explaining what it means for The USA to become a "Bitcoin Superpower" through a Bitcoin Reserve by the year 2045, the implications on cyber security, global trade, banking, AI, sovereign debt, the dollar remaining the world's reserve currency, and more.
Today, Bill Bar pointed out that with global M2 supply increasing because of debt, what is likely to happen in a couple of posts on X
You may have started noticing that Crypto people lean more toward the Austrian economic view than the Keynesian view...
Today, Bill Bar pointed out that with global M2 supply increasing because of debt, what is likely to happen in a couple of posts on X
You may have started noticing that Crypto people lean more toward the Austrian economic view than the Keynesian view...
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OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
Fun things from today while we spin our wheels. First, the SEC clarified the Reserve Statement. And we're all laughing because Solana breaks when under pressure and we're all giggling about it being used to secure voting. Oh my.
Second thing, we're now at 3% global Bitcoin adaption. Keep in mind that Bitcoin adaption has been faster than internet adoption, but 3% in 2025 places us with online banking in 1996, Social media in 2005, and the internet in 1990 (You have mail!).
Nation state reserves, sovereign wealth and pension fund adoption aside, with banks now being able to custody crypto, the next BIG leg into Bitcoin exposure are big bank money managers that have trillions under management. We know they will allocate assets to Bitcoin because Bitcoin has emerged as an asset class.
Second thing, we're now at 3% global Bitcoin adaption. Keep in mind that Bitcoin adaption has been faster than internet adoption, but 3% in 2025 places us with online banking in 1996, Social media in 2005, and the internet in 1990 (You have mail!).
Nation state reserves, sovereign wealth and pension fund adoption aside, with banks now being able to custody crypto, the next BIG leg into Bitcoin exposure are big bank money managers that have trillions under management. We know they will allocate assets to Bitcoin because Bitcoin has emerged as an asset class.
OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
Goldman Sachs who has reportedly been buying crypto with both hands mentioned crypto for the first time in its Annual Shareholder Letter today.
The letter states that the rise of crypto products offered by competitors may put the firm at a disadvantage. In street parlance this means the bulge bracket firm is moving into the crypto space.
The letter states that the rise of crypto products offered by competitors may put the firm at a disadvantage. In street parlance this means the bulge bracket firm is moving into the crypto space.
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OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
Bitcoin adaption will happen slowly at first, then all at once. It has been a few days since the last bitcoin legislation map. Here is the update. Hyperbitcoinization is coming and by now, you should all be starting to see a pattern.
OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
While the market has been risking off (selling) over fears of M2 money supply expansion in order to service ballooning sovereign debt, we know that the risk of holding Bitcoin has been largely stripped away:
1) Because Wall Street is embracing it.
2) Because our Federal government is embracing it through encouraging legislation.
3) Because our Treasury is going embracing it.
4) Because our domestic banks are buying it.
This effectively puts a floor under Bitcoin's price, but more importantly, with the USA embracing it, every other nation is going to need to embrace it so the value of their own fiat currency doesn't fall against the value of the US Dollar.
In other news, the SEC dropped its appeal against Ripple, and by proxy, all crypto and crypto investors and companies.
Moreover, Bitcoin maxis (slang forepeople who only believe in Bitcoin and no other crypto currencies) are starting to understand the Cardano link in making Bitcoin, not just a store of value, but an operating system for a digital future.
The USA wants more....
1) Because Wall Street is embracing it.
2) Because our Federal government is embracing it through encouraging legislation.
3) Because our Treasury is going embracing it.
4) Because our domestic banks are buying it.
This effectively puts a floor under Bitcoin's price, but more importantly, with the USA embracing it, every other nation is going to need to embrace it so the value of their own fiat currency doesn't fall against the value of the US Dollar.
In other news, the SEC dropped its appeal against Ripple, and by proxy, all crypto and crypto investors and companies.
Moreover, Bitcoin maxis (slang forepeople who only believe in Bitcoin and no other crypto currencies) are starting to understand the Cardano link in making Bitcoin, not just a store of value, but an operating system for a digital future.
The USA wants more....
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OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
No links for this but some in the Bitcoin community are talking about the US Treasury offering lower interest convertible Bonds backed by Bitcoin as a way to manage interest payments on our national debt as well as offer investors Bitcoin exposure. From companies offering convertible bonds like this there is a huge amount of buying interest from investors, and in fact, I'm wondering if our own municipality can buy them under Minnesota State Statutes through our 4M program.
Considering US Treasuries are sold in 1-month, 2-month, 3-month, 4-month, 6-month , 1-year, 2-year, 3-year, 5-year, 7-year, 10-year, 20-year, and 30-year maturity intervals, I'm thinking the 10-year Treasury would be a good option for this.
In addition, a project has been initiated to integrate Mastercard with Cardano. Mastercard's integration marks Cardano's first proper handshake protocol with legacy finance.
Considering US Treasuries are sold in 1-month, 2-month, 3-month, 4-month, 6-month , 1-year, 2-year, 3-year, 5-year, 7-year, 10-year, 20-year, and 30-year maturity intervals, I'm thinking the 10-year Treasury would be a good option for this.
In addition, a project has been initiated to integrate Mastercard with Cardano. Mastercard's integration marks Cardano's first proper handshake protocol with legacy finance.
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OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
Meanwhile, over on X...
A framed copy of the original Bitcoin white paper now hangs in the Whitehouse (although I don't get Laura's gushing).
Again, I don't think you guys understand what a big deal Bitcoin is going to become in all of our lives and here all of us all have an opportunity right now to front run it all and buy Bitcoin before Nation States start buying in earnest ushering in the hyperbitcoinization of the world. I mean they are literally telling us what they are going to do.
A framed copy of the original Bitcoin white paper now hangs in the Whitehouse (although I don't get Laura's gushing).
Again, I don't think you guys understand what a big deal Bitcoin is going to become in all of our lives and here all of us all have an opportunity right now to front run it all and buy Bitcoin before Nation States start buying in earnest ushering in the hyperbitcoinization of the world. I mean they are literally telling us what they are going to do.
Fuddyduddy1952
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Okay...I have a bitcoin question:
You can search "bitcoin price live stream" and watch the price changing every second.
Suppose I want to buy (1) one bitcoin.
Explain in simple terms how this works...in other words where and how do I buy? Assume the second I decide it's $84,024.33 for (1) one bitcoin...but price changes every second. When I "press the buy button"(?) do I get it for $84,024.33?
There must be a sales commission (?) so if I debit that coin from my bank account, how much will the debit be???
Now assume I keep it a month. I'm watching the price and it's about $90,000. How does that work? Again when I "press the sell button" it's $89,999.45. When I get my bank statement what would the credit be?
Last question is assume a car dealership accepts bitcoin. The "out there door" car I want price is $90,000. Could I give the dealer my one bitcoin and 55 cents cash?
Please explain in simple terms!
Thanks!
You can search "bitcoin price live stream" and watch the price changing every second.
Suppose I want to buy (1) one bitcoin.
Explain in simple terms how this works...in other words where and how do I buy? Assume the second I decide it's $84,024.33 for (1) one bitcoin...but price changes every second. When I "press the buy button"(?) do I get it for $84,024.33?
There must be a sales commission (?) so if I debit that coin from my bank account, how much will the debit be???
Now assume I keep it a month. I'm watching the price and it's about $90,000. How does that work? Again when I "press the sell button" it's $89,999.45. When I get my bank statement what would the credit be?
Last question is assume a car dealership accepts bitcoin. The "out there door" car I want price is $90,000. Could I give the dealer my one bitcoin and 55 cents cash?
Please explain in simple terms!
Thanks!
The beautiful part of that is that you never really know because it's dependent on current demand, how fast you want the transaction to complete, etc..
A relatively simple and unbiased explanation here: How Bitcoin Fees Work | River Learn - Bitcoin Basics
Fees are quite a bit higher than that... Also transaction times can vary from minutes.. if you pay high fees to hours if you don't.. to sometimes days if the network is really busy. Remember native bitcoin can do somewhere between 3.3 and 7 transactions per second .. globally... (think about that as long as you want..), there are other crypto products that are marginally faster. None have transaction rates useful for actual commerce.
Having bought bitcoin you now of course have the problem that if you want to move it back to real dollars you need to find a buyer.. and then the easiest way is through an exchange.. which.. even the "better" ones are known for frequently saying "lol no.. you can't have your money today" (because if they let people cash out the game would be up... there's no organic demand.. it's effectively all wash trading to artificially increase the price - https://www.fastcompany.com/9130319...for-3-2-trillion-of-artificial-crypto-trading). Technically you can trade directly from a cold wallet but that's even harder..
Luckily you don't have to buy bitcoin to place a bet on it because there are derivative markets using traditional technology that actually WORKS that provide.. well not bitcoins.. but more like a commodities market around bitcoin. That does nothing for someone actually wanting to use it of course (which is lucky.. because it's useless for that).
OP
MinnesotaEric
Super Member
First, before doing anything, take some time, as much time as you need to take and learn until you have reached a level of familiarity that you're comfortable with. Don't do anything until you have learned.
That said, If you go onto an exchange where you can buy Bitcoin (example: Fidelity in some states, Coinbase, Robinhood, Binance, et el) set up or have an account with funds and say I want to buy $1.00 of Bitcoin. You can do that because each Bitcoin is made up of 100,000,000 satoshis. So a spot price of Bitcoin being $83,800ish as I type this would get you 0.00001193 of a Bitcoin.
Since whole Bitcoins are rather expensive, people refer to buying Bitcoin as "stacking satoshis," or "stacking sats," for short.
Commission wise, (and you'll sense a bit of my frustration in the following explanation) the exchanges may charge a flat commission or not. Using Robinhood as an example, I have a limit order set at $72,500. Conditionally, if the spot price drops below $72,500, my order SHOULD be filled. But the way Robinhood works, the spot price needs to drop WELL BELOW $72,500 before executing my limit buy order somewhere just below $72,500. In this case the "zero commission fee company" just bagged a profit of the difference between whatever the actual spot price was when they purchased (or pulled the Bitcoin from their inventory) and the price my limit order executed.
Alternatively, if you already own some type of crypto, you can swap it for another type through some (but not all) exchanges and wallets (a wallet is where crypto can be stored).
Anyway, crypto generally follows market and limit buy and sell procedures just like a regular securities, options, or bond markets. Here is a page explaining the different kinds of buy and sell orders in Crypto.
What Are the Different Crypto Order Types?
Master the dynamics of crypto trades with insights into common order types – from swift market orders to strategic limit and stop orders.
tokentax.co
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