Is modern tractor repair like modern car repair and super complicated requiring a dealer?

[ljjhouser]

Many issues that come up with smaller tractors (under 100 hp) are pretty straight forward and can be resolved by the owner. Those issues may be separated into those that require splitting the tractor and those that are find and replace parts (safety switches, starter, battery, etc).

The larger tractors (used in farming operations) seem to be an entirely different matter. Many have Proprietary Software and cannot be repaired outside the dealer shop. In that respect, you only rented the software that runs the tractor, and you bought the tractor.

I read an article where a farmer needed an new GPS antenna. Bought one online. Installed it but could not get the software to recognize it. Had to go to the dealer and they installed another one (from their stock) and activated it. They would not simply activate the one he already had. Unfortunately, seems many repairs intentionally cannot be considered "Plug and Play".

Might be the same in the auto industry. When I bought my last truck (2021) I considered buying a proportional brake controller other than the one that could be bought with the truck. However, I was lucky to learn that if you added the controller, then it would not work unless activated by the dealer. (My dealer was willing to do that if I wanted.) Instead, I ordered the tow package and moved on.

There have been lawsuits filed against tractor manufacturers about the legality of preventing owners the ability to repair their own equipment.

 

[jaxs]

Many issues that come up with smaller tractors (under 100 hp) are pretty straight forward and can be resolved by the owner. Those issues may be separated into those that require splitting the tractor and those that are find and replace parts (safety switches, starter, battery, etc).

The larger tractors (used in farming operations) seem to be an entirely different matter. Many have Proprietary Software and cannot be repaired outside the dealer shop. In that respect, you only rented the software that runs the tractor, and you bought the tractor.

I read an article where a farmer needed an new GPS antenna. Bought one online. Installed it but could not get the software to recognize it. Had to go to the dealer and they installed another one (from their stock) and activated it. They would not simply activate the one he already had. Unfortunately, seems many repairs intentionally cannot be considered "Plug and Play".

Might be the same in the auto industry. When I bought my last truck (2021) I considered buying a proportional brake controller other than the one that could be bought with the truck. However, I was lucky to learn that if you added the controller, then it would not work unless activated by the dealer. (My dealer was willing to do that if I wanted.) Instead, I ordered the tow package and moved on.

There have been lawsuits filed against tractor manufacturers about the legality of preventing owners the ability to repair their own equipment.

That problem isn't just with cars and tractors. I recently bought a printer-copier and first time I replaced cartridges the printer wouldn't recognize them. I called retailer where I bought copier and cartridges and told them if I had to buy mfgrs cartridges I was returning the copier. Retailer told me how to bypass it and use anybody's cartridges.

 

[dodge man]

I’ll share a short story. My wife had a 2005 Chrysler 300c. The EGR was going bad I thought. I had it scanned at Autozone and that was what the code reader said. At that time I had a Chrysler shop manual and read the diagnostic section, it seemed like it was 20 pages long and most of the tests I couldn’t or didn’t want to perform. I bought a new EGR valve for about $35 and replaced it in about an hour and fixed it.

My point is the computers can help you fix something, they tell you what is wrong sometimes. You can’t drive your tractor to Autozone and get it scanned though. Most of the smaller machines or older machines can still be worked on by the owners. The big tractors, newer combines are not so simple.

These days YouTube is my shop manual.

 

[Oaktree]

As someone else said, it probably has a lot to do with the tractor. I have a sub compact. As someone that used to tear down and rebuild car engines in my back yard, a long time ago, in the age of carburetors, points and no computers, I find that my tractor is reminiscent of those days. I'm not afraid to do maintenance or diagnose/fix most minor things. Of course what "minor" means will depend on each person's individual skill and that would be hard to explain. However, I would still call the dealer for any serious issues I encounter. While I could likely completely tear down and rebuild my tractor if I really needed to, I no longer have the gumption, or the tools, to do that kind of work.

Yeah, I hear ya. Also, some repairs that a decent shade tree mechanic could perform on a car or truck are more difficult on a tractor, for example a clutch replacement. Easy enough to drop the transmission on a car, but I haven't the slightest idea how I'd split a tractor.

I read an article where a farmer needed an new GPS antenna. Bought one online. Installed it but could not get the software to recognize it. Had to go to the dealer and they installed another one (from their stock) and activated it. They would not simply activate the one he already had. Unfortunately, seems many repairs intentionally cannot be considered "Plug and Play".

Might be the same in the auto industry. When I bought my last truck (2021) I considered buying a proportional brake controller other than the one that could be bought with the truck. However, I was lucky to learn that if you added the controller, then it would not work unless activated by the dealer.

It is the same in the auto industry. A neighbor of mine who's a mechanic made the decision to close up shop due to the number of repairs that couldn't be completed without being activated by the dealer. I've heard (but can't confirm) that on some newer vehicles there are procedures that not even all dealers have the equipment/expertise to perform...most of which involve the self-driving gadgetry.
I even ran into something similar with my 17 year old Jeep. Bought an extra key, but had a helluva time finding someone who'd cut it. Any hardware store, etc. I went to refused to duplicate a key they didn't sell (and they don't sell ones with the RFID circuitry inside). Had to go to a locksmith who charged some ridiculous amount of money to do it. So much for trying to save money by DIY.
The good news was that at least there was a procedure to get the truck to accept the new key.

Dumb question, but why does a tractor need a GPS? Will it run without it?

 

[ericm979]

Large fancy modern farm tractors have a ton of electronics, like super precise GPS systems to make accurate rows and computer controlled everything. Deere are known for locking down the software and requiring the dealer tool for a lot of things.

Compact tractors under 75hp like most people here have are a lot simpler. The only computer is an EFI controller. Some don't even have that. I have yet to read here of someone with a problem with their EFI controller. The EFI problems have been on the mechanical end- the injectors or pump. Even that is rare. It's a mature technology.

 

[RandyT]

Yeah, I hear ya. Also, some repairs that a decent shade tree mechanic could perform on a car or truck are more difficult on a tractor, for example a clutch replacement. Easy enough to drop the transmission on a car, but I haven't the slightest idea how I'd split a tractor.

It is the same in the auto industry. A neighbor of mine who's a mechanic made the decision to close up shop due to the number of repairs that couldn't be completed without being activated by the dealer. I've heard (but can't confirm) that on some newer vehicles there are procedures that not even all dealers have the equipment/expertise to perform...most of which involve the self-driving gadgetry.
I even ran into something similar with my 17 year old Jeep. Bought an extra key, but had a helluva time finding someone who'd cut it. Any hardware store, etc. I went to refused to duplicate a key they didn't sell (and they don't sell ones with the RFID circuitry inside). Had to go to a locksmith who charged some ridiculous amount of money to do it. So much for trying to save money by DIY.
The good news was that at least there was a procedure to get the truck to accept the new key.

Dumb question, but why does a tractor need a GPS? Will it run without it?

Primarily auto steer, but is also tied into planting straight rows, but also variable rating on seed, and fertilizer rates, and individual row shut offs on the planter, to variable rating on the sprayer and individual tip shut offs on the boom to prevent overlap. And then can be uploaded to the combine which can then follow the same planting pattern and follow the rows by using the same guidance lines.

And on a side note. The tech is not limited to just cars and tractors. Some of the newer Husqvarna and Stihl saws require the software ie 500i to diagnose the trouble codes, but also is required to replace certain components due to needing to flash the components. So items like carbs and ignition modules require you to input the old part serial number and the new serial number to make the item work correctly without the software flash the saw will either not start or not run properly.

 

[5030]

Only time my vehicles go to the dealer is a recall. Same wit the tractors and side by side which brings me to a point and that is our Kubota side by side has had 4 recalls on it, latest is the steering.

 

[ericm979]

Emissions legislation requires that manufacturers support a standard protocol and a common set of fault codes.This why you can go to an AutoZone and get them to read the codes from the OBD2 port or buy a code reader and do it yourself. It's been incredibly useful to me as a home mechanic. Unfortunately the emissions regs do not require standardized interfaces and codes for other machines like chainsaws or tractors.

 

[RandyT]

Emissions legislation requires that manufacturers support a standard protocol and a common set of fault codes.This why you can go to an AutoZone and get them to read the codes from the OBD2 port or buy a code reader and do it yourself. It's been incredibly useful to me as a home mechanic. Unfortunately the emissions regs do not require standardized interfaces and codes for other machines like chainsaws or tractors.

The EFI codes for lawnmower engines are OBD generic codes but the software and the interface connector isn't standard OBD nor are they standard between brands. MTD/Briggs/Honda/Kohler/Kawasaki all use different diag connections and software. there is a software program that comes with the adaptors for the delphi system codes for MTD, Kohler, Briggs and the Hisun SxS systems.

 

[rScotty]

I read that used to farmers had to know how to repair their equipment or at least they had a good shot at being able to do it. Otoh, I heard that about cars too. But, cars are pretty hard to work on lots of times now because of computers. Is tractor repair like modern cars? Pretty hard to do, not like the older tractors?

There are several parts to answer your question. First of all - YES, the newer tractors are becoming more difficult to repair. And yes, making them difficult is a deliberate policy of all the manufacturers. It isn't just tractors, it includes cars, appliances and anything mechanical. In some cases - like emissions & safety - manufacturing has even gotten laws passed that favor non-repairability.

It doesn't take a degree in economics to figure out why making something non-repairable is good for manufacturers and several other industries - like the financial ones. The real question is, "Why did it take them so long to figure that out?"

Unfortunately for the world, this decline in repairability comes at a time when repair skills are becoming much less common for everything. Easy to see how that leads to there being more new manufacturing of things not designed to be repaired.

But here is the last part of your answer & it is the promising part: So, for yourself individually.... What do you care? This move to non-repairability works in the young mechanic's favor.

Right now there are a ton of older used pre-computer & pre-emissions tractors on the market and they all are for sale really cheap because they need some work. Stay roughly in the 1970 to 2005 year range.
My generation is getting old. We can't fix them all. So there are plenty out there for you.
As you look around you'll see there are cars, tractors, appliances, tools - and even houses that you can buy from the era when things were made to be repaired. And thanks to the internet there is still a decent source and supply of spare parts.

So grab some tools - might as well get used tools cheaply from a used tool store - and then take a look at what older tractors meet your needs. Don't buy the first one; you can be as picky as you want because nobody else wants them. Same for implements, but more so.
And although the old ones don't have the new plastic Bling!, any tractor post 1970 does pretty much exactly the same things as the new ones. Maybe even better.

Enjoy!
rScotty