JD 650 will not start

[Rock knocker]

I replaced the battery ends and cables... what else could be preventing it from starting? it fires right up once jumper cables are applied...

Well if it fires up right away you know:
1) The neutral safety is OK
2) The ignition switch is operating
3) The starter motor and solenoid is alright.

Did it start up fine with a new battery? Those Deere's ( at least our 950 ) had some bad alternators which not only did not charge, but also had a short to frame inside the alternator chassis which would drain the battery when the key was on. We went years jump starting our tractor.

But if it starts with a jump, you either have a dead battery, or you need to effectively double the amperage of your battery by jumpering one into parallel. So your issue is one of two things
1) You have no effective battery, and need to deal with your charging system
2) Your cable system is corroded internally, or at one of it's four terminal connections.

 

[trusteve]

Well if it fires up right away you know:
1) The neutral safety is OK
2) The ignition switch is operating
3) The starter motor and solenoid is alright.

Did it start up fine with a new battery? Those Deere's ( at least our 950 ) had some bad alternators which not only did not charge, but also had a short to frame inside the alternator chassis which would drain the battery when the key was on. We went years jump starting our tractor.

But if it starts with a jump, you either have a dead battery, or you need to effectively double the amperage of your battery by jumpering one into parallel. So your issue is one of two things
1) You have no effective battery, and need to deal with your charging system
2) Your cable system is corroded internally, or at one of it's four terminal connections.

Yeah after replacing the cable and cable ends I went and purchased a brand new battery... with the brand new battery installed it did something it hasn't done in several months... It turned over.. and clicked... but still not enough to start it! But once jumper cables applied starts right off and the cables dont even have to be on there good.

Do you know how to test the alternator on the John Deere 650?

 

[Rock knocker]

Your alternator won't affect starting. Dollars to doughnuts the cables or the connections at the frame or starter are bad.

 

[Rock knocker]

Do you know how to test the alternator on the John Deere 650?

Take it to NAPA

 

[megaboz]

I'm in agreement that you still have a ground issue or something is draining the battery before you start it.

Are you jump starting it from a vehicle or just another battery?

Also just like in cars, I would imagine there I'd another ground strap. You might try taking your jumper cable and attaching it to the frame and the engine.

One other issue is that maybe the starter is going and it is taking more juice than what a single battery could put out.

 

[jd110]

This is a fairly common problem on 50 series deeres. It is caused by low voltage to the starter solenoid. These tractors were not equipped with starter relays. As these tractors get older, the wiring gets a little corrosion here and there at connections on the key switch, safety switches and other connections. The starter on these seem to be more sensitive to this voltage drop than some others. If you have a voltmeter, check for voltage at starter energizing wire while it is connected and you turn the key to crank. You will probably see somewhere around 8 or 9 volts. These starters need at least 10.5 volts to this terminal to start reliably. It is easily fixed by installing a relay in the circuit to energize the solenoid. I have used john deere part # RE44536 to do this repair. It is intended for older deere farm tractors, but it is easily adaptable to 650, 750, 850, 950, and 1050 tractors. The wiring needs a little modification to fit and the instructions for mounting the relay will not apply to compact tractor. I usually mount it on the valve cover. You can also pick up a starter relay at any automotive supply store and fabricate your own wiring.

 

[trusteve]

Well to update... with a brand new battery installed it fired right up.... but this is the third battery in 2 years.

 

[trusteve]

This is a fairly common problem on 50 series deeres. It is caused by low voltage to the starter solenoid. These tractors were not equipped with starter relays. As these tractors get older, the wiring gets a little corrosion here and there at connections on the key switch, safety switches and other connections. The starter on these seem to be more sensitive to this voltage drop than some others. If you have a voltmeter, check for voltage at starter energizing wire while it is connected and you turn the key to crank. You will probably see somewhere around 8 or 9 volts. These starters need at least 10.5 volts to this terminal to start reliably. It is easily fixed by installing a relay in the circuit to energize the solenoid. I have used john deere part # RE44536 to do this repair. It is intended for older deere farm tractors, but it is easily adaptable to 650, 750, 850, 950, and 1050 tractors. The wiring needs a little modification to fit and the instructions for mounting the relay will not apply to compact tractor. I usually mount it on the valve cover. You can also pick up a starter relay at any automotive supply store and fabricate your own wiring.

This very well might be the problem... I will search for the part you listed... I hope the modifications you mentioned aren't above my pay grade.

 

[burnieman]

Recheck your cable connections. Tighten the piss out of them. I had the same problem. Redo the connections.

 

[Rock knocker]

Well to update... with a brand new battery installed it fired right up.... but this is the third battery in 2 years.

I would guess that your alternator is either not charging, or worse yet, has an internal short. Between that and the voltage regulator, is hammering the battery to death.

But we did for years was charged the battery and turn the key on to start. We then turned off the key. This saves the battery and protects it from abuse. The potentially very serious downside is you now no longer have warning lights for oil pressure and temperature. In retrospect, I would not recommend this course of action.

If the problem continues I would recommend removing the alternator and having a good shop take a look at it. They can spin it and how it is operating. Auto Zone et al can also do the same thing, but they are not usually savvy enough to use and understand a volt-ohm meter and internal shorts