juvenile boot camps

[Golfgar4]

You know, I just thought of something else that I should have mentioned before.

If you and your husband are like most parents, you both have asked yourselves what it is that you're doing wrong in raising Jake. Well I can tell you right now that you're not doing anything wrong - so let that go RIGHT NOW!

I don't know how many times my wife and I have asked ourselves that very same question. It's taken a long time for us to realize that we weren't to blame for how Tom turned out. After all, we raised his older sister and she turned out pretty darn good (Bachelor of science degree, 2 master's degrees, working on her PhD, two childrens books published, etc.). We used the same philosophies and techniques with Tom that we did with her.

So why the difference? Who knows for sure. It's a different generation that seems to be much more materialistic and "me" oriented. Maybe it's TV, or the music they listen to, or who know what else. But almost all of our peers are going through the same thing with their kids. And we all can't be lousy parents, right? /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif

Based on how you describe things and your relationship with Jake, I would be willing to bet that the problem definitely is not on your end. So quit beating yourself up over it. Of course you need to be concerned and you need to do whatever you can to help straighten him out. But you can't hold yourself responsible for his poor decisions and attitudes.

You've got the right attitude about this. At some point, Jake will get it too!

 

[Boone]

Hi Cindi,
I've dealt to much with parents that have helped their child when they probably should not have, with the results being tramatic. I'm not being judgemental and only trying to help. You can experience this for yourself by going to a large prison/jail at visiting time and listening to the stories of the parents in the waiting room.

I've found when we deal with a teen that is out of control, a action we say we will take (your threat of boot camp,) as a result of misbehaviour must be taken when the line has been crossed to be effective. Bootcamp is not a place to send him, Cindi bootcamp sounds much better.

 

[Mrwurm]

Great comments and wisdom from Golfgar. I agree with the point that the troubles you are experiencing are not your falult. My kids, aged 5, 9, 14, have various problems and I get really tired of the people with 'perfect kids' wondering and theorizing about what WE must be doing wrong. My fourteen year old will not accept advice on any topic. I don't remember teaching her that.

 

[dmccarty]

Cindi,

I had some state mandated training on juveniles a few
months back. Unfortunately, the class did not have anything
to read just a lecture. If I don't read something its hard for
me to keep numbers and such in my head. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif So I can't
throw out the "hard" data.

The one thing that jumped out to everyone was that once
a kid has made contact with The System and has been sent
off to one of the state institutions for juveniles they are
almost certainly going to be back for another visit. This is
where I can't remember the percentage of juveniles who make
a return visit but if you bet money on someone returning to
the system you would almost certainly win. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif What was
ironic/strange/whatever was the city kids where more likely
to revist the system than rural kids. This is likely for a couple
of reasons. One its just some much easier to get into
trouble in the city than in the country. A kid in a city is more
likely to get sent to a state institution since the facilities are
more accessible than in the rural areas. The rural kid is more
likely to be sent home with family than sent a juvenile facility.

My gut feeling is that FUD, Fear Uncertainty and Doubt are
big deterents for crime. Once someone gets over the FUD
that deterent is gone. Especially for kids since they are
slapped on the wrist for non violent crimes so they get over
the FUD quick. Plus in the city often the FUD is not there
since many family members are already in the system.

My two cents would be to stay away from the state boot
camps. If you could get the Marines to take him that would
be another mater. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Later,
Dan

 

[BubbaJr]

A long, long time ago when I was a teen, I had a lot of issues caused by my insecurities, stubbornness and the divorce of my parents. But luckily I worked for a very wise man that explained to me what was happening to me.
It seems that at the age of 12 the hormones start dividing and growing at an alarming rate. By the time the boy reaches 13, they are on the verge of exploding. Since the laws of physics dictate that a given area will only hold so much, these raging hormones have to go somewhere. His theory was that the hormones left the scrotum, and migrated to the spine, where they traveled the length of the spine and entered the brain stem. Once there they dispersed to different areas of the brain. Once in these areas they would start to eat brain cells and certain functions would begin to decay. One of the first functions lost is respect for oneself and anyone that ever uttered the word no. This progression of dead brain cells usually will erode most social skills and good judgement by the time the boy reaches about 19. Then the production of these hormones starts to decline. It takes many years for the body to replicate all these dead brain cells, but by the time most men reach 27, they usually have returned to the same state of social skills they had when they were 12. It is then up to the wife to gradually introduce new skills until the man has been taught all the necessary functions to exist in today's world. Most women don't understand the evolution of this natural occurring process and give up on the man much too soon, and kick him out. This leaves the man partially trained and the next woman in his life has to evaluate the condition of the man and make the appropriate corrections to his demeanor. Then what usually happens is the second wife winds up with the perfect husband and the first wife can't figure out what happened to him.
So the bottom line is patience, if he is halfway normal he will eventually outgrow his attitude and become a partially productive human all on his own. But if he has a good woman in his life, the process will go much faster. But you have to remember that the proper training won't start to take effect until he reaches the mid 20's. By then he will be someone else's problem. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
GOOD LUCK

 

[Gary_in_Indiana]

First, let me say I've been very, very lucky with each of my kids. They have made it through college (one now has a great job with GE and the other is a year from completing law school) virtually trouble- and problem-free. I'd love to tell you it was the result of outstanding genes and stellar parenting. I'd love to but I can't. I don't believe that for a minute.

I think a lot of it is just pure, dumb luck and we got lucky. Sure, I'm sure we did a lot of the right things along the way. Mom was a wonderful Mom. She had the neighborhool 'Kool-Aid house' (where all the kids gathered). She never had to wonder where our kids were because they were usually at home with every other kid in the neighborhood (she had the grocery bills to prove it, too). /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

For my part, I never missed a single school event, play, musical, presentation, parent teacher conference or anything like that. I coached the teams, drove kids to the events, etc., but more because I wanted to than any belief it would be a determining factor in how our kids turned out. I will admit that I did like the fact that all the kids knew me and that I knew them.

I'm sure the problems with which you're faced now are no more the result of anything you're doing or have done than our luck was anything more than that. I know it's easy to beat yourselves up over something like this and don't want to see you do that.

As to boot camp or military school, I'm reminded of something I was told a long time ago by a dog trainer about a dog I had. Without going into details, the dog was a problem from day one. We tried everything we knew to do to no avail and sought the help of a professional. In talking with him he told us, "I can train your dog to heel, sit, stay... whatever you want. That's not going to solve your problem though. The problem is the dog's personality and it's too late to do anything about that."

I think that's going to be the key issue here...Whether or not it's too late to change who he is. Boot camp can certainly change what he does. Whether things like that are any good beyond that is still open for debate, so far as I know.

You have my sincere best wishes. There's likely nothing else you'll do more important than this.

 

[Egon]

boot camps the onlyway to go. Apply some military intelligence and a frontal lobotomy and your all set.

Egon

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Another thing that worries me about juvenile boot camp is that some day he may want to join the military and I don't want to sour him on the idea. I think I will just try to get more creative with the threats. Smile. Someone also suggested a very good idea about keeping a journal of indiscretions and I am starting that today, to sit down and discuss with him at calm times and explain why it was wrong and so on. That's something I NEVER would have thought of.

 

[r0GuE]

I'm not up to reading all these responses, but I'm glad I'm seeing some sentiment toward avoiding the drug using completely screwed up kids that your son would LIVE with at these camps.
I am no expert on raising kids, but it hasn't been that long since I was one. RELAX and wait him out. You'll be ok. the ONLY thing I worry about with raising kids is keeping them away from drugs, un-pregnant and alive. If you can pull that off they will learn the rest.
You will RUIN you son if you send him to camp... no doubt about it.
Suck it up (I don't mean that disrespectfully, but I do mean it).

 

[Anonymous Poster]

I understand, and no offense taken. I got a phone call from a man that buys a lot of our weaner pigs, wanting to know if Jake could go hog hunting with him tonight. He said, Jake and Jake only, said, tell Jake not to ask any freinds along. That made me feel good. Apparently Jake saves his good respectful behavior for other folks. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif