Kioti NX Series Tractor - Serious Issues

[Unwiredone]

Bought a 2014 Kioti NX5010 new. Just over 600 hours since new and for the past two seasons have had a dangerous issue with the tractor stalling in different load and power configurations. The tractor will just die and start throwing multiple error codes. Will have to attempt multiple restarts and eventually tractor will restart and operate for anywhere from a few minutes to the rest of the day. Principal use of tractor is mowing grass and hay operations.

Have had the tractor at the dealer several times for this issue and each time am told its fixed and charged for new parts that do not fix the issue. Kioti representatives were made aware of this issue in January this year, yet they were more concerned (seemingly) of updating my engine for an EPA issue than fixing the actual tractor. The lack of dealer support and or troubleshooting is quite troubling. Many have asked me about my experience with the Kioti tractor and although the features of the tractor are great, the quality just isn't apparent. Worse, still, is the lack of knowledge and support in fixing issues - particularly this one since its also quite dangerous in certain situations.

Does anyone know what would be causing the tractor to just stop / stall at various power and load configurations? Does anyone have a contact at Kioti that actually will take an interest in supporting their dealer channel or has a working knowledge of Kioti operating issues on the NX series?

Thank you for any replies or assistance!

P.S. - The other posters here on TBN have been fantastic in sharing experiences and knowledge. Thank you for taking the time to share.

 

[AWSubie]

Please list the error codes and tell us what parts the dealer replaced.

 

[Unwiredone]

Please list the error codes and tell us what parts the dealer replaced.

Error codes 2, 6, 7, 8 on the dash readout are the codes from memory. I believe that these are all indications of power not getting to specific components on the tractor. I will share, that under electrical power load (Air Conditioning operating), the tractor is more suscetiple on dying spontaneously. Yet then again, the air conditioning has been off when the tractor just dies while mowing flat ground.

Thus far, the EMU was the most recent item replaced and athough charged for it, I refused to pay for it. Prior, the dealer thought it may have been a dead cell in the battery which he replaced and charged me for - and I paid for the battery. Shortly after receiving the tractor in 2014, another electronic part caused the tractor to fail and the dealer came to the farm and replaced it. This was with less than 12 hours on the machine. There was no cost to this part. I have personally replaced the ignition switch as I learned via forums that the prior ignition switch had problems. This did not corect the issue. The petentiometer now doesn't appear to be working correctly either, yet this could be a calibration issue.

I've personally checked the fuses and all electrical connections that I can locate to make sure that neither fuses were blown nor any connections were loose.

I have a video of the tractor operating at normal PTO power with a 6' disc mower on level ground when it dies within minutes of the last startup.

I have clean fuel as the fuel is used in all other tractors on the farm (4 Kubota's, 2 Massey Ferguson's, and the Kioti) and all comes from the same tank. No other tractor has any issues.

Again, I appreciate any help or guidance. Thank you!

 

[MichiganIron]

Error codes 2, 6, 7, 8 on the dash readout are the codes from memory. I believe that these are all indications of power not getting to specific components on the tractor. I will share, that under electrical power load (Air Conditioning operating), the tractor is more suscetiple on dying spontaneously. Yet then again, the air conditioning has been off when the tractor just dies while mowing flat ground.

Thus far, the EMU was the most recent item replaced and athough charged for it, I refused to pay for it. Prior, the dealer thought it may have been a dead cell in the battery which he replaced and charged me for - and I paid for the battery. Shortly after receiving the tractor in 2014, another electronic part caused the tractor to fail and the dealer came to the farm and replaced it. This was with less than 12 hours on the machine. There was no cost to this part. I have personally replaced the ignition switch as I learned via forums that the prior ignition switch had problems. This did not corect the issue. The petentiometer now doesn't appear to be working correctly either, yet this could be a calibration issue.

I've personally checked the fuses and all electrical connections that I can locate to make sure that neither fuses were blown nor any connections were loose.

I have a video of the tractor operating at normal PTO power with a 6' disc mower on level ground when it dies within minutes of the last startup.

I have clean fuel as the fuel is used in all other tractors on the farm (4 Kubota's, 2 Massey Ferguson's, and the Kioti) and all comes from the same tank. No other tractor has any issues.

Again, I appreciate any help or guidance. Thank you!

Dash Error codes are most likely caused by a Safety Start function. The error codes for the engine and engine management system can only be read from the OBD2 for the ECU. Safety start circuit faults are shown on the dash. If the safety start system faults, the signal to the ECU is interrupted and the engine will shut down. Simple things first, check the seat safety switch. The tractor may think that you have left the seat. After seat safety switch, check the tail light harnesses for any rubbed wires that could cause a short to ground. This faults the safety start circuit since you need to have the brake pedal depressed to start the tractor, brake lights illuminate. If it is a shuttle tractor, there is also a clutch safety switch, hydro tractors have a neutral safety switch. From what you have described, it sounds like a gremlin lives in your safety start circuit.

Also, the safety start system needs to reset after a fault occurs. You may see the code for 3-5 seconds after the tractor starts, then will go away.

Tough to diagnose electrical without the tractor...especially intermittent problems...drives you nuts.

Hope the above helps...

 

[countrybumpkin]

There have been a few having electrical issues that have been traced down to a lose harness connector. The saftey unit is behind the right side cab panel, you might want to check the connector there also.

 

[Unwiredone]

There have been a few having electrical issues that have been traced down to a lose harness connector. The saftey unit is behind the right side cab panel, you might want to check the connector there also.

Ah, the safety unit is located there! I had a panel cover on that area before I left it at the dealer last time. When the tractor came back, it was missing. So, its evident that was being checked. Good to know.

So far, between what you have shared and Michigan Iron shared, its making some sense as to what the problem "could be". Thank you both for responding!

 

[AWSubie]

Also when you check connectors you must pull them apart first to verify that individual pins are not bent and have not been dislodged from their sockets and pushed back.

 

[Unwiredone]

Also when you check connectors you must pull them apart first to verify that individual pins are not bent and have not been dislodged from their sockets and pushed back.

Very good point!

 

[Unwiredone]

Dash Error codes are most likely caused by a Safety Start function. The error codes for the engine and engine management system can only be read from the OBD2 for the ECU. Safety start circuit faults are shown on the dash. If the safety start system faults, the signal to the ECU is interrupted and the engine will shut down. Simple things first, check the seat safety switch. The tractor may think that you have left the seat. After seat safety switch, check the tail light harnesses for any rubbed wires that could cause a short to ground. This faults the safety start circuit since you need to have the brake pedal depressed to start the tractor, brake lights illuminate. If it is a shuttle tractor, there is also a clutch safety switch, hydro tractors have a neutral safety switch. From what you have described, it sounds like a gremlin lives in your safety start circuit.

Also, the safety start system needs to reset after a fault occurs. You may see the code for 3-5 seconds after the tractor starts, then will go away.

Tough to diagnose electrical without the tractor...especially intermittent problems...drives you nuts.

Hope the above helps...

So far, I have checked all the connections that I could find. I did find one connector that was completely unconnected but it didn't cause the tractor to stall as the tractor would start without it. Fact is, I am unsure what its purpose actually is as its located under the dash and adjacent to the brake pedals. It is not part of the safety switch assembly. The two end connectors are white and appear to come off the main bundle of wiring that comes up through the floor board. I had to take the dash off in order to connect the assembly. I know that the dealer had the dash off at one point as well had taken the hazard and 4-wheel drive switches out. (I know this because whomever took these out had actually broken the retainer clips that hold the switches in place - you shouldn't expect more items to be broken/missing when taking your tractor in for service, but this seems to be the case with my luck. No Quality Assurance practices at my local dealer apparently.)

After checking all the connections, and after the tractor started, I took it out yesterday to do some mowing. In nearly 2 hours of being out, I managed to get a whopping 7/10ths of an hour of work done as the rest of the time I had to attempt constant restarts or wait for something to reset so I could restart. Terribly frustrating to have a less than 3 year old tractor that you can count on when you need it.

 

[AWSubie]

If this were my tractor, I would start bypassing each safety switch (one at a time). I would start with the seat switch and then do either the neutral switch if you have a HST or the clutch switch if you have a shuttle.

 

[countrybumpkin]

I would also do the wiggle test on all the wiring while the tractor is running.

 

[Tigershark]

Have you tried calling the dealer in Louisville ? (502) 933-1724 I bought my Kioti from Chris one of the owners of BlueGrass Lawn and garden and their mechanics have been helpful troubleshooting a couple minor issues over the phone. Might give them a call

 

[DieselBound]

Could you explain a little more about "how" it goes about dying? I think that this might give a little more insight into what is causing the initial issue: many times we're caught by a secondary issue. Keep in mind that error codes and such are only initial troubleshooting guidelines. Many times they can be a byproduct of something that isn't necessarily related to the actual problem. If you can, get a video of this happening: yeah, might be tough, but having a video that can be presented to the dealer (and to the rep) would show that they're not fixing THE problem.

Any time I pull an electrical connector apart I apply some dialectic grease, especially if this is on equipment that spends time outdoors.

I'd be personally looking over the entire tractor for signs of possible wiring damage. Kioti isn't real good at protecting things. Look for stuff that's been rubbing.

 

[Unwiredone]

Hi Dieselbound!

Not sure why I didn't get notifications that you had responded. I may need to check my spam folders.

Actually I do have video's of the tractor dying during operations. If they were shorter in length, I'd post them here.

Update to the situation at present - my dealer has had my tractor since November 3rd. We are approaching a month and I only received a phone call at the beginning of the month sharing that they haven't been able to replicate the problem. What is pretty funny about this claim is that after actually driving it to the dealership and shutting it down, I decided I would leave it in another part of his yard and when trying to start it, the tractor wouldn't start.

As for Kioti reps...I had exchanges with a rep earlier this year. He was more interested in me getting my engine update installed so as not to violate the EPA then helping me to fix my tractor.

Being that my residence is along a pretty majorly traveled State highway and I have plenty of road frontage, I think what I might do when I get the tractor back (hopefully this year) is park the tractor next to the highway with a sign on it that says "Don't buy a Kioti tractor - they won't last past their warranty."

 

[Unwiredone]

Thank you for the help. I may just have to do this since my dealer can't seem to figure anything out.

 

[NC419N]

My bet would be in the wiring being rubbed or frayed. The underside is very exposed and very open to the elements. I have posted several times about the lack of guards and that's the first thing that I would advise a Purchaser of Kioti Tractor's to do. It will take a patient mechanic to inspect all the wiring to find the issue but that's where I would start.
Maybe the "other" brands don't have the same issues I haven't looked into that but for Kioti THEY NEED GUARDS
I have been very fortunate that my local dealer has been able to locate and repair the wires that I have broken, pulled apart, grounded out and destroyed. Maybe it's a result of all the new and exciting options that we enjoy on today's tractors that we have to thank my old 3000 Ford don't seem to have all these issues

 

[cphilip]

Sounds like classic symptoms of a bad or lose ground wire to me...

 

[Unwiredone]

My bet would be in the wiring being rubbed or frayed. The underside is very exposed and very open to the elements. I have posted several times about the lack of guards and that's the first thing that I would advise a Purchaser of Kioti Tractor's to do. It will take a patient mechanic to inspect all the wiring to find the issue but that's where I would start.
Maybe the "other" brands don't have the same issues I haven't looked into that but for Kioti THEY NEED GUARDS
I have been very fortunate that my local dealer has been able to locate and repair the wires that I have broken, pulled apart, grounded out and destroyed. Maybe it's a result of all the new and exciting options that we enjoy on today's tractors that we have to thank my old 3000 Ford don't seem to have all these issues

Received an email from the area manager from Kioti this morning acknowledging an email I sent last night. He shared that he has spoken with my dealer and that the dealer has information for me, yet I need to call my dealer. Strange, the dealer clearly has my contact information, yet I need to call in?

 

[fried1765]

Hi Dieselbound!

Not sure why I didn't get notifications that you had responded. I may need to check my spam folders.

Actually I do have video's of the tractor dying during operations. If they were shorter in length, I'd post them here.

Update to the situation at present - my dealer has had my tractor since November 3rd. We are approaching a month and I only received a phone call at the beginning of the month sharing that they haven't been able to replicate the problem. What is pretty funny about this claim is that after actually driving it to the dealership and shutting it down, I decided I would leave it in another part of his yard and when trying to start it, the tractor wouldn't start.

As for Kioti reps...I had exchanges with a rep earlier this year. He was more interested in me getting my engine update installed so as not to violate the EPA then helping me to fix my tractor.

Being that my residence is along a pretty majorly traveled State highway and I have plenty of road frontage, I think what I might do when I get the tractor back (hopefully this year) is park the tractor next to the highway with a sign on it that says "Don't buy a Kioti tractor - they won't last past their warranty."

I threatened to do something similar to that with a high end SS Frigidaire refrigerator.
I was going to strap it on to my small trailer, and park it (with a lemon sign) each day in a major super market lot.
I would have done it, but apparently they believed me, and the end result was a lasting repair.

 

[Unwiredone]

To everyone on here, thank you for your advice! Sorry for the lengthy delay in responding, yet I am happy to report that the dealer was able to locate and fix the issue. Apparently the main ground from the battery terminal to the ECU was bad / broken. He bypassed the ground in lieu of replacing the whole harness assembly. So far so good that I haven't had any other issues with the tractor suddenly dying as it had before. The real test, of course, will come in the spring and summer, but I'm fealing pretty positve about it. Further, the dealer spent a wealth of time going over the tractor with a fine tooth comb and I figure he made about $5 / hour in the process which is pretty awesome on his part. Again, thank you for everyone's advice and ideas!