Comparison Kubota L3301 vs L3800

[s219]

That's my concern about DPF -- the regens. Normally on auto mode it should do it while you're working, but there are cases where that might not always happen, especially if you are not using the tractor regularly or for long enough. Sometimes I work my tractor hard for 4-5 days in a row. And then weeks might go by where I only use it 1-2 times a week for a few minutes each time. For example, I may only use my L3200 once a week to take trash dumpster to the curb and retrieve it the next day. Or bring firewood up to the house. They are 10 minute jobs tops, and I usually squeeze them in between more important chores/duties. If the tractor decided it needed a 30 minute regen during one of those situations, I'd be mighty annoyed.

 

[Tractordawg]

I would get the L3800. More HP and a simpler proven engine. One thing to consider is the new engine (L3301) has no long term history? Kubota makes good stuff but we do not know how the new design will hold up.

 

[k0ua]

I would get the L3800. More HP and a simpler proven engine. One thing to consider is the new engine (L3301) has no long term history? Kubota makes good stuff but we do not know how the new design will hold up.

What you say is true as far as history in the field, but I bet Kubota has tested this engine for a "while" in the lab.

 

[Bluegill2]

I wouldn't worry about the 'new' stuff being dependable, it will be. That said, I sure am glad I got a L3800DT and love it!

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

They are 10 minute jobs tops, and I usually squeeze them in between more important chores/duties. If the tractor decided it needed a 30 minute regen during one of those situations, I'd be mighty annoyed.

simple. you don't put the tractor in auto mode.. that way it won't regen during a short job. When your out for an hour or more you turn it to auto. It is kinda annoying, but if you think about what your doing when you hop on the tractor its not a big deal.

 

[Aussie Merv]

Word even spread to Australia although we are about 12 months away from receiving Tier4 tractors I am told. When I purchased my L3800 in Dec 2014 the first comments from the dealer in Melbourne was that I was a lucky guy as Tier4 meant more complexity and being a realist I often equate that with 'more things to go wrong'. And I am happy to say the L3800 has been the perfect tool for me and better than a swiss army knife by far. I do have a laugh at some of those one eyed youtube tractor comparisons made in North America though ......

 

[Garandman]

// I do have a laugh at some of those one eyed youtube tractor comparisons made in North America though ......

??...

 

[hockeylover86]

IMO, I would not own a tractor that has a DPF and does not use DEF. I know too many people who own trucks and by far the ones that use DEF work much better. Without the DEF the engine has to use more fuel etc. to regenerate the DPF. ALL of the truck makers have finally figured this out and now ALL of them use a DPF in conjunction with a DEF system.

The DEF lowers the temp that it requires to burn out the carbon in the DPF.

The DEF has nothing to do with the DPF/soot regen or burn-off. It is only for NOX emission reduction due to tighter emission standards.

Believe me, DEF would not be on there if EPA did not mandate the lower NOX standards.

The newer DPF systems work better on trucks work better because of the addition of an extra fuel injector in the exhaust. When the DPF systems first came out, the manufacturers tried to take the cheap route and just over-fuel the existing injectors for burn-off. That was not ideal or as effective so they added the extra injector in most cases.

 

[Scott65]

Hockeylover hit it on the head. There are 3 typical, and completely independent systems in most emissions compliant truck exhaust systems now, that I'm sure is also in big truck and equipment industries, such as our tractors. I'm just not as familiar with the various models as I am with trucks. These 3 systems work separately, not relying on each other, unless you consider the heat transmitted from one to the next. But this would be produced separately if needed anyway, so still not dependent.
The DOC, diesel oxidation catalyst, is pretty much the catalytic converter you see on gasoline vehicles. I'm no engineer, I'm sure someone more familiar with the internal compounds used to make these would argue the similarities, but for all intents and purposes, same idea.
The DPF, diesel particulate filter, most are familiar with and have come to hate. It is a honeycomb filter that forces the exhaust through from one set of channels into another, trapping the soot in the process. This is where the extra fuel is needed to be burned to create enough heat to burn this matter out like a self cleaning oven. There is a life expectancy here as each time this regeneration occurs, a small amount of ash is left behind.
SCR, selective catalyst reduction, this is where the DEF is used. This is similar to the DOC or a catalytic converter in that it has a reaction with certain components internally to reduce or convert them into others (why you see water coming out of a car's tailpipe). However, the reaction inside this chamber requires more than just the catalyst material, obviously this is the DEF, specifically urea. NOx is created from the DPF system and the heat of cleaning it, the SCR is for removing this NOx, but not to reduce the heat itself.

 

[junkyardwarrior]

I've run both. The 3200 and L3301, and the L3800 and the L3901 so I can compare them.

The 01's have more power and it's obvious once you load the engine. The 01's governor is electronic. When bush hogging, I was watching the PTO speed...no load cutter turned off, engine was at 2560 RPM. Turn the bush hog on and RPM drops initially to around 2500, then recovers and holds 2550-2560. Loaded, it stays right around 2560 RPM until the load overcomes the available engine torque, which honestly is pretty tough especially on the 3901. The engine is quieter than the 00 series. The engine itself is simpler...no governor inside the engine and one less camshaft. Only one now instead of two. The L01's are not just 3200 and 3800 engines with electronic injection-they are almost altogether different. Common rail electronic injection, injector placement is way different, cylinder head different, pistons different, etc. It is superior to the L00's in that sense. The tractor itself has a more curved hood, and you get a little better visibility if you're using the loader. Speaking of loader-the LA525 does have a slightly higher lift capacity than the LA524 that came on the L3200/3800. Splitting hairs there.

The complexity is something that owners are all concerned about and as a technician that deals with them, I am concerned on behalf of the owners. Thus far, there have been some issues with crank sensors and errors between the sensor and ECU, but we "think" Kubota has those issues ironed out. There will most likely be a campaign to fix the early ones.

The L01 3 point hitch is very slightly different in reference to the position control valve, but it's still almost the same as the L00's were. Just minor difference and smooths the lift a little. The jerky lifts on the 3800's were usually due to (1) it was a "cheap" tractor (lacked the shock control that the Grand L series had) and (2) some of them had a misadjusted position control valve. Or (3) the combination of the 2.

What I didn't like about the L01 series is the cheap plastic seat. It flexes and if you turn around to the right, the seat flexes just enough to lift the OPC switch and kill the engine. Easy fix but aggravating to have to deal with it. DPF is here to stay from here on out. Lot of people went out and bought the last of the 3200/3800's and that's all fine, but what happens when the 3200 they just bought is no longer supported by Kubota due to age and/or government intervention? Which we are already seeing (government intervention...) Might as well get used to the DPF. Or keep buying used tractors.

THe L2501 is also out...and gets rave reviews. It's an L3200 that turns less RPM. Does not have CRS and DPF, it is an L3200 with minor changes in the transmission to accomodate the reduced engine speed. Been popular here. Is it possible to make an L2501 in to an L3200? Absolutely-but there are a lot of parts to change and a lot of work to do it. Governor arm/fork, pump, springs, stoppers, then gearing inside of the transmsission, etc. More work than it's worth.

Absolutely nothing wrong at all with the L01's now that the issues with the early ones have been addressed.

Using the DPF is really nothing to it. If you're not wanting to regen, hit the button (DPF inhibit). If you've got the motor at 2200+ RPM and under a load, say mowing or bush hogging, it regen's on it's own and you never know it. Other than the light in the dash comes on to let you know it's doing what it's supposed to. That's it. Nothing to it. You get more HP, more torque, better engine response to load changes, uses less fuel on average (does use more during regen). Downside-complexity. Time will tell how well the systems work but thus far, nary a problem. DPF will need to be cleaned at some point and as of right now it's not cheap-but as more and more tractors get them and they get pulled/cleaned more, the prices will come down. Maintenance of the engine is identical to the L3200 as far as oil changes, but you'll have to be sure to use the correct oil (they call for 5W40 CJ-4 rating). Use of other oil may cause faster DPF clogging and perhaps even more frequent regen and extreme cases, a DPF replacement. Trucks have had these systems for a few years and they're pretty well maintainance free for most people. Even though maintenance is about the same, you cant just neglect them like you can a 3200 and expect it to be as trouble free. It don't work that way. Exactly like comparing the old 7.3 Power-less-stroke engine to the 6.0. The 6.0 is a better engine by far in a lot of ways, but people with 6.0's found out that you just can't change oil every 5000 miles and run the pee out of it and expect it to last as long as the old T444E's. At least that's been our experience with them-and the same so far with the L01 series Kubota's.

Kubota didn't want to do the DPF, but they had to. Same story for all of the manufacturers. The DPF system has been in use and tested for a few years, since roughly 2008, on prototypes. Everyone knew it was coming. Everyone was able to buy credits to allow them to run Tier 3 and Interim Tier 4 engines but once those credits ran out they had no choice. So really it's not a new engine or new systems.