Buying Advice Kubota New Models

[waystick]

Good day,

Long time lurker, first time poster.

I’m wondering if anyone is aware of anticipated updates to the Grand line. I’m wondering mostly about a DPF free engine, like the new MF’s.

Thanks in advance for any information!

 

[SDT]

Good day,

Long time lurker, first time poster.

I’m wondering if anyone is aware of anticipated updates to the Grand line. I’m wondering mostly about a DPF free engine, like the new MF’s.

Thanks in advance for any information!

Nothing on the horizon.

SDT

 

[Thomas]

:welcome: to TBN...enjoy.

 

[TheMadOne]

Good day,

Long time lurker, first time poster.

I’m wondering if anyone is aware of anticipated updates to the Grand line. I’m wondering mostly about a DPF free engine, like the new MF’s.

Thanks in advance for any information!

Other than the B3350 there's no widespread issues with Kubota DPF. I don't see them investing a huge amount of money on a replacement until the current lineup is ready for a full refresh. The LXX60s have outlived most other Grand L lines, but there's been nothing reported about a refresh. So a minimum of another year, probably more until we see Grand LXX80s.(Or whatever), and there's no guarantee that they won't use the same engines with updated electronics and new cabs anyway.

 

[SDT]

Other than the B3350 there's no widespread issues with Kubota DPF. I don't see them investing a huge amount of money on a replacement until the current lineup is ready for a full refresh. The LXX60s have outlived most other Grand L lines, but there's been nothing reported about a refresh. So a minimum of another year, probably more until we see Grand LXX80s.(Or whatever), and there's no guarantee that they won't use the same engines with updated electronics and new cabs anyway.

Most likely will.

A replacement engine for use in the B3350 (or it's replacement) is currently in development. The current B3350 engine is mechanically injected, whereas most (all?) other Kubota tractor engines are common rail designs, which are much more easily controlled electronically. Expect it to have DPF as do other Kubota engines above 30 HP.

AGCO/MF is living on borrowed time and will eventually conform to the norm, baring unexpected regulation changes.

SDT

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

any tractors advertised with 'DPF free' engines are using a DOC. Its 90% the same as a DPF but rather than running though a cycle the DOC is always burning. Using emissions as a selling feature is kinda silly.

 

[ericm979]

What they're selling is the lack of regens. While the fear of regens are overblown, probably due to early models not being understood by the operators, there are some practical reasons to want to avoid them. For instance if the regen starts right before you want to shut the tractor off.
Maybe not a huge consideration, but not nothing.

Of course it's marketing's job to tout any actual or perceived advantage.

 

[Fallon]

Other than the B3350 there's no widespread issues with Kubota DPF. I don't see them investing a huge amount of money on a replacement until the current lineup is ready for a full refresh. The LXX60s have outlived most other Grand L lines, but there's been nothing reported about a refresh. So a minimum of another year, probably more until we see Grand LXX80s.(Or whatever), and there's no guarantee that they won't use the same engines with updated electronics and new cabs anyway.

There really wasnt much changes fro the 40 series to the 60 series other than emissions. I doubt they would have made the leap to a new model for a while if it hadn't been for tier 4 emissions requirements.

 

[Bigpuddie]

I will take a DOC tractor over a DPF one that regens any day if the week. No high heat burn offs, no wasted fuel, no filter maintenance, and you can run the tractor the way you want. A DOC is like a catalytic converter.

 

[TheMadOne]

DOCs require higher heat at all times to work properly. Unlike a gas engine, where heat is made thorough "leaning out" the engine, diesels actually use excess air to help cooling, which means you need to burn more fuel to raise heat. I'd be curious about actual fuel consumption of a similarly rated DOC and DPF engine working with the same load at rated speeds.

 

[Bigpuddie]

DOCs require higher heat at all times to work properly. Unlike a gas engine, where heat is made thorough "leaning out" the engine, diesels actually use excess air to help cooling, which means you need to burn more fuel to raise heat. I'd be curious about actual fuel consumption of a similarly rated DOC and DPF engine working with the same load at rated speeds.

They do not require high heat. They are a pass through canister that involves a chemical reaction with the exhaust rather than a screen type filter. They can never plug up. Now, a DPF requires high heat or it will be in regen alot. A DPF tractor should idle as little as possible and run at 1500 plus rpm all the time. The beauty of a DOC tractor is that high rpm operation is not necessary. Now, there are hybrid versions of a DPF that Case/ NH were using for a while, which reduced regens, but ultimahwent to a DOC.

 

[TheMadOne]

They do not require high heat. They are a pass through canister that involves a chemical reaction with the exhaust. They can never plug up. Now, a DPF requires high heat or it will be in regen alot. A DPF tractor should idle as little as possible and run at 1500 plus rpm all the time. The beauty of a DOC tractor is that high rpm operation is not necessary. Now, there are hybrid versions of a DPF that Case/ NH were using for a while, which reduced regens, but ultimahwent to a DOC.

Higher heat. Not high. The catalyst material has an ideal working temp that's higher than what a non-emissions unit would have produced without tweaked fuel mapping.

 

[Bigpuddie]

Higher heat. Not high. The catalyst material has an ideal working temp that's higher than what a non-emissions unit would have produced without tweaked fuel mapping.

They may produce lesser emissions at higher heat, but it is not necessary to run them at high rpm. The DOC simply cannot plug up and requires no maintenance. You will never be put in limp mode with a DOC and it never needs cleaned or replaced .

 

[TheMadOne]

They may produce lesser emissions at higher heat, but it is not necessary to run them at high rpm. The DOC simply cannot plug up and requires no maintenance. You will never be put in limp mode with a DOC and it never needs cleaned or replaced .

The company still changed the fuel mapping at every RPM to increase burn temp to pass Tier IV. Which makes me wonder which engine is more fuel efficient. DOC vs DPF advantages in other areas are a whole separate kettle of fish.

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

DOC also runs a lot of EGR (exhaust gas recirc) that comes with an entirely different set of concerns and efficiency issues. That along with the higher required engine base heat to operate at all. There is no free lunch.

Interesting footnote, Kubota makes DOC only engines but chooses not to use them in their tractors.