I'm still kicking it around gentleman.I am leaning towards a steel beam as some of you suggested.I still can't grasp the later bracing requirement or how it's done.Any examples,pics?.This looks like it would spread wide open at the bottom.
Laminated beam
- Thread starter bones1
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schmism
Super Member
bones1 said:
even if its a simple single member, a beam has 2 diffrent "forces" in it. tension at the bottom, and compression at the top.
Any member in compression will want to bend out of plane. (push on the ends of a yard stick and see what happens)
while the beam has a combination of tension on the bottom, and compression in the top it doesnt simply squirt out of plane like the yard stick. instead it starts to fold over on its self ,twisting. (the top rolls toward the bottom)
to prevent this you either need more material in the section, or need to brace the Top edge of the member.
For rafters and floor joists this is accomplished by the floor/roof sheething. But due to the addtional load floor joists take you often see cribbing (or blockign) beteen the joists to prevent them from ALLL folding over.
the standard CYA statement given to our customers is "braceing for the (fill in the blank) is to be supplied by the building engineer." ie a person who has looked at the entire buliding system and designed a braceing "plan" that properly accounts for the braceing of the beam and its connection to the rest of the building/diaphram.
in the real world, this often takes the form of CLB (contious lateral braceing) which is a structural member (again propertly designed to withstand the out of plane buckleing force) (in the roof truss industry its often a 2x4) attached with mechanical faseners (again the connection needs to be designed to transfer the out of plane buckleing force to the CLB) in the real world thats often 2-3 10d box/gun nails.
So hopefully that has explained the role and application of braceing without specificly telling you what you need in your situation
btw steel I beams suffer from the same forces, but the large perpendicual top and bottom flanges are there to help reist those out of plane bending forces (in the strong axis of the top flange). A given steel beem may be tall and skinny to carry a large load, but has addtional cross braceing to prevent roll over (look at rail way bridges) vs other clear span beams (overhead trolly cranes) that end to have massively thick and wide top and bottom flanges compaird to there web thickness.
chili
Bronze Member
Bones1, I am still unclear as to what kind of column support you plan on having at each end of your potential steel beam. How will your columns attached at the floor? Looking at your picture of your shop, another concern is to think of what elevation you plan of placing the bottom flange of your beam. Assuming you plan on going parralell with your wood trusses, If you place the bottom flange at same level as the bottom chord of your wood trusses you need to figure out if you have room to erect the beam without fowling the top flange of your beam with your building. A W10x22 beam is about 10 1/8" deep and a W12x26 is about 12 1/4" deep. Also note that steel beams may not be perfectly straight, they may have camber, always place your camber up.
This is one idea I had to support it.Open to all suggestions.http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c29/shenders/beam1.jpg
Thanks for all the help so far.Feel free to modify picture and shoot it back.
Thanks for all the help so far.Feel free to modify picture and shoot it back.
Raddad
Silver Member
Save a bunch of $ and buy a good cherry picker. You can move the engine to where you want it. You can move it to your engine stand. You can leave the dead vehicle in the same spot. You wont have any overhead obstruction. You can add a lift later. I use a cherry picker and prefer it over a beam and chain fall.
Raddad,already have 2 engine hoists.I regularly pull bodies off of corvettes to do frame offs.Beam with a trolley could lift the body up and move it over to the body dolly.I'm just tired of using cranes.Raddad said:
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chili
Bronze Member
Bones1, it appears from your sketch that you are placing the top of the steel beam at the bottom of your 2x12. How high is your 2x12 from the floor? Will this allow enough room for your hoist and lifting? I assume the steel beam will bear on top of the wood columns according from your sketch. You would need to fasten the beam to the wood columns somehow. One possible way to attach is to weld a angle to the bottom flange of the beam and bolt thru some holes in the other leg of the angle into the side of the wood column. I would run that thru "tuolumne".
MrJimi
Elite Member, Rest in Peace
Bones, the way I attached mine is to a 8 inch column with a 12" X 12", X 1/4" plate bolted with grade 8 bolts and bolted to my 3,500 PSI concrete floor
It's solid
J_J and Sandman2234 have seen it
It's solid
J_J and Sandman2234 have seen it
tuolumne
Gold Member
Bones - you could through-bolt a triple 2x to the side or face of your column, or use a steel angle seat. Or, do it as you sketched with column all the way down. The shear loads at the support are very small; half the beam weight and whatever you're lifting if the trolley is all the way to one side. You wouldn't need the extra 2x6's shown in the sketch. Anything to keep the beam from jumping off the support is fine - I would use a pair of lags. We all have such diverse areas of expertise; the concept of hauling the engine out of a Corvette would sure frighten me!