Loader problem Cylider or Valve...Help!

[Willl]

When running I can push the bucket to return

After reading that, I'm changing my answer to cylinder.

Do the 'orange' tractors have quick-disconnect hoses that you could swap around to test ?

 

[Mike_VT]

Dealer was closed today for the holoday. I am going to be the first call that they get tomorrow morning. (right now I have the buket off and I am just dealing with the weight of the quick connect plate)

With the joy stick at center I am unable to push the the bucket plate to what would be level when I move the joystick to level position I am able to push the fluild out of the cylinder. The puzzling thing is that as soon as I turn the engine the loader returns to full dump. One minute I think it is the cylinders and the next the valve. At this point who knows????

Jerry G good question, I do not have the feeling of load when the tractor is running.

Anyway I will let you all know how this turns out thatks for the input. Hopefully the dealer can get this in this week.
Mike

 

[john_bud]

jb, that part about the cylinders extending with the engine running and centered valve bothers me too. I think it is a cyl, but maybe in bursting, the fluidic shock damaged the valve as well. I cannot explain the full symptoms as described without a reach like this. Im not sure at this point that mine exhibited the centered valve extension. I am tho, haunted by a couple of nuance changes in mine that I believe are attributable to valve damage. When valving at full relief pressure - like if held to full curl and released - my valve does not return to center automatically as readily as it did before the break. ?Could it be imagination-just didnt notice before? MAYBE. Also, I now have a slow leakdown on curl that I didnt notice before. Another maybe-could be valve or new cyls or just didnt notice. This thread tho, is giving me a suspicion that there is some likelihood of damage thruout the curl circuit in this type failure. Either that or I have a gap in my understanding of the workings. Mike, please post the full diagnostic when you get it figured out.
larry

larry, Just for comparison. I have left my loader with the bucket in level position about 5' off the ground for over 2 weeks and it only sagged a inch or so. No bucket curl down. With my 900# boxblade on the back the 3pt will sag about 1 foot in the same 2 week time. I was bored and wanted to check seal integrity...

Mike-VT, I am bouncing back to valve damage - with a side bet on a burst cylinder seal too! Dang but these long distance diagnosis are rough!

jb

 

[RedDog]

Here is your problem. Mine was not under warranty, so I did it myself. Under $10.00 for new seals.

I think yours will be warranted.

Good luck,

 

[Mike_VT]

Brought it to the dealer today and here is the diag. No valve problems, but both cylinders had problems. On one cylinder the nut completely stripped off the rod and on the other cylinder the nut was loose, as you would imagine this caused the malfuntion. The fix: the dealer has ordered two new cylinders and in the mean time they welded both nuts onto the rod and reinstalled the cylinders. Everything is working now and based on my discusion with the service manager the cylinders in this state should be fine for years to come, unless they start to leak. I plan on storing the new cylinders in my shop and using the fixed (welded) cylinders until they malfunction. From what I understand, from a friend at the dealer, one of Kubota's biggest issues is the with their cylinders. Thanks for all the help.

 

[SPYDERLK]

Good! Youre lucky to be able to keep the old cylinders. They [Mahindra]wouldnt let me keep the broken ones. Can you, or anyone explain why the cylinders extended when you started the tractor with the curl spool in neutral. I assumed that closed off flow from the pump to the cyls.
larry

 

[john_bud]

Good! Youre lucky to be able to keep the old cylinders. They [Mahindra]wouldnt let me keep the broken ones. Can you, or anyone explain why the cylinders extended when you started the tractor with the curl spool in neutral. I assumed that closed off flow from the pump to the cyls.
larry

First of all MikeVT, good to know you are back and running! It is a really odd ball failure, but ... By the way, those nuts are usually held on by 4-600 ft-lb of torque and some locktite. Guess there is a guy on the cylinder assembly line that wasn't paying attention.


As to why the cylinders would extend, that's easy. The pistong that has the seals wasn't attached to the rod, so the rod could move. Fluid was able to flow thru the piston's center hole so the bucket moved. Remember that both cylinders are connected together.


jb

 

[SPYDERLK]

Quote jb: As to why the cylinders would extend, that's easy. The pistong that has the seals wasn't attached to the rod, so the rod could move. Fluid was able to flow thru the piston's center hole so the bucket moved. Remember that both cylinders are connected together.

Huh? Why did they take off and move when he started the tractor? With the valve in neutral should be no diff running or not.
larry

 

[john_bud]

Quote jb: As to why the cylinders would extend, that's easy. The pistong that has the seals wasn't attached to the rod, so the rod could move. Fluid was able to flow thru the piston's center hole so the bucket moved. Remember that both cylinders are connected together.

Huh? Why did they take off and move when he started the tractor? With the valve in neutral should be no diff running or not.
larry

Larry,

Can you see that with the nut from the piston off, fluid would go thru the hole in the piston where the threaded end of the rod is supposed to be? That fluid path would enable the other cylinder to move (it was still connected).

Why did it move when the engine was running? My guess is that the vibrations from the running engine and the weight of the bucket on the one remaining cylinder was enough to get it to move. There is several hundred ft-lb of torque wanting to rotate a bucket down.

Is any of this a 100% certainty? Naw, just my best guess from the facts stated and a bit of experience with cylinders.

Take care,
jb

 

[Soundguy]

Engine vibration is my guess as well.. sinc ethe pistons were loose and allowing oil to bypass.

To the original poster.. with those sparecy;s' put some oil in the cyl. then compress..cap the compressed side to keep some oil in it..fill the uncompressed side with oil and then cap. Grease any exposed rod, and the wipe area.. grease yoke ends. Now, either wrap in have contractors paper.. or visquene and contractors paper and store. They should be good for years to come.

Soundguy