Log Splitter question

[Cysco]

I am really green on hydraulics so be prepared as I will ask a lot of questions if I don't understand.
I have a Kubota 4610 tractor with a factory loader. I havd a remote installed by the dealer to operate a tilt scraper . My question is how do I get constant pressure back to the splitter control valve without having to "hold" or "tie off" the control for the remote. If you need more info I will get it for you.
Thanks for the help.........

 

[kennyd]

Welcome to TBN


A bungee cord or rope is the cheapest solution the the problem.
If that does not appeal to you, then you will need to create a "powerbeyond" loop at the rear of the tractor. PowerBeyond is a set of hoses (one IN and one OUT)that has constant flow of hydraulic oil when the tractor is running and ALWAYS needs to be connected(either together or to an implement with a open center valve like your logsplitter) To plumb this, you will need to determine if your existing FEL valve has a port marked "PB", or you can count the hoses connected to it and report back. If your valve is capable, then I would guess you will spend about $200 to get it plumbed.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Just a word of caution.... When using a power beyond circuit only hook up to it when the tractor is shut down or you will fry your pump. I have one on my tractor to run my log splitter. When not in use I use a short piece of hose to complete the circuit.


Like stated before the circuit always needs to be completed. In my case if the log splitter is out of the circuit I use the piece of hose.

Chris

 

[wkpoor]

I run a Prince pump for my splitter dedicated to that job for 2 reasons. One it gives much more flow than the tractor pump and second it saves wear and tear. I get a 6 sec cycle time with that pump, 22 GPM, if I'm at full 540 PTO RPM. Most of the time I run the engine at 1500RPM.

 

[bjcsc]

That's a nice clean setup, wkpoor. Well thought out - I like the receiver...

 

[Cysco]

Thanks for the info. I tried the bungee cord and it does ok. Cycle time is acceptable. I liked the Prince valve on the PTO but having to cope with the fluid tank and the cost it would be to much. I have the ports to do the constant pressure and will probably try that as my first option when the bungee cord breaks and slaps me in the head. Thanks for the good information. Ya'll have been very helpful. Have a good evening.

 

[Wayne County Hose]

You should never run a QD on the suction side of a pump.

 

[SPYDERLK]

I run a Prince pump for my splitter dedicated to that job for 2 reasons. One it gives much more flow than the tractor pump and second it saves wear and tear. I get a 6 sec cycle time with that pump, 22 GPM, if I'm at full 540 PTO RPM. Most of the time I run the engine at 1500RPM.

Is that a pressurized reservoir? I just cant see any other way to avoid cavitation at 22GPM with a restrictive suction circuit like that appears to be. Maybe the tubing and fittings are MUCH bigger than they appear to be. Quick connects cause a lot of turbulence and pressure drop. 22GPM is huge delivery thru restrictions when youve only got a few psi loss [14.7 max] allowed.
larry

 

[wkpoor]

You should never run a QD on the suction side of a pump.

I understand the concern, however how would one remove it conveniently from the tractor? This unit has been in operation for 3yrs now and used year around with no ill problems I know of. The suction side is 1"

Is that a pressurized reservoir? I just cant see any other way to avoid cavitation at 22GPM with a restrictive suction circuit like that appears to be. Maybe the tubing and fittings are MUCH bigger than they appear to be. Quick connects cause a lot of turbulence and pressure drop. 22GPM is huge delivery thru restrictions when youve only got a few psi loss [14.7 max] allowed.

This is not a bootstrapped system. However the tank is vertical in nature on purpose to maximize flooded suction. Prince made no mention to me that flooded suction wasn't adequate for this application. And again it has been tested....alot.

 

[Wayne County Hose]

Probably your saving grace is that you are running this pump below it's rated rpm. On the suction side, I would look at the wet line couplers like the huge dump trailers use. I don't know if they can be used on the suction side, but they are more reliable in your suction application than what you are using. The style you use do a good job of keeping fluid in, but not at keeping air out. They seal on the same principal as a hydraulic cylinder. I would also consider a sweep elbow on the suction side rather than a hard 90. All this being said, the setup works. So, what the heck do I know? Maybe not much.

 

[wkpoor]

If this pump were cavitating I would probably know it because the PTO mount allows for some slop on purpose. There is no chattering at all that I think would be there if it were sucking air. That might also show up in the cylinder. Everything operates glass smooth. Anyone who has split with me will vaulch for the speed and power of this setup. And I can regulate the amount of fluid in the oversize tank for winter or summer so my fluid stays where I want it. I couldn't be happier with how this has worked for me. Even if the book says it shouldn't.

 

[Farmerford]

I don't know your brand of quick disconnects, but I checked the specs on the 1" Parker QD I used to connect a backhoe to my JD 455D crawler/loader, with a 23gpm pump. They are rated for 50 gpm, and show a pressure drop of 15 psi at 50 gpm and 2 1/2 psi at 15 gpm.

The pump inlet pressure that causes cavitation varies according to the pump type and make. However, the accepted safe level for most gear pumps is 3 psi gauge vacuum at the pump inlet. That is the pressure setting on the bypass valve on my suction strainer and on the warning gauge.

If you have 15" of head in the reservoir (relative to the pump inlet), that adds about 1/2psi positive pressure. That mitered elbow going into the pump adds a bit of loss, but I haven't looked it up.

Seems to me that, at least once the fluid is warm and you operate the pump at about 2/3 normal 540 pto rpm, your net pressure drop (ignoring the short suction line and elbow) is probably 2 psi. Even at 540 rpm the net drop is probably no more than 4 psi, so you are probably okay, but without any margin for increase. If you have a strainer on the suction line, it should be cleaned regularly to avoid any pressure drop across it.

That is a neat looking splitter. Did you just wash it or does it really stay that clean? My hydraulic stuff is always covered with fluid and dust. Two lines burst on the backhoe Saturday and managed to cover me (and the machine) with fluid before I could get the thing stopped.

I particularly like the channels that hold the wedge. Do they ever get clogged with chips at the fixed end?

 

[wkpoor]

I don't know your brand of quick disconnects, but I checked the specs on the 1" Parker QD I used to connect a backhoe to my JD 455D crawler/loader, with a 23gpm pump. They are rated for 50 gpm, and show a pressure drop of 15 psi at 50 gpm and 2 1/2 psi at 15 gpm.

The pump inlet pressure that causes cavitation varies according to the pump type and make. However, the accepted safe level for most gear pumps is 3 psi gauge vacuum at the pump inlet. That is the pressure setting on the bypass valve on my suction strainer and on the warning gauge.

If you have 15" of head in the reservoir (relative to the pump inlet), that adds about 1/2psi positive pressure. That mitered elbow going into the pump adds a bit of loss, but I haven't looked it up.

Seems to me that, at least once the fluid is warm and you operate the pump at about 2/3 normal 540 pto rpm, your net pressure drop (ignoring the short suction line and elbow) is probably 2 psi. Even at 540 rpm the net drop is probably no more than 4 psi, so you are probably okay, but without any margin for increase. If you have a strainer on the suction line, it should be cleaned regularly to avoid any pressure drop across it.

That is a neat looking splitter. Did you just wash it or does it really stay that clean? My hydraulic stuff is always covered with fluid and dust. Two lines burst on the backhoe Saturday and managed to cover me (and the machine) with fluid before I could get the thing stopped.

I particularly like the channels that hold the wedge. Do they ever get clogged with chips at the fixed end?

Those are parker QD's as you guessed. I do power wash my stuff from time to time but those connections have never leaked a drop. The only place I see oil is the filler cap. There is no suction strainer on that unit. Only a return filter. And that probably wasn't needed in this closed system.
The channels did get clogged before I cut over an inch out of both sides (since that pic was taken last winter) right up against the toe plate. That solved the problem. Speeco addressed that issue in their updated beam by adding slots but I doubt they are large enough to allow all debris to fall through. I got to believe Prince Mfg. intended for that pump to be plumbed like I did because of the location. Otherwise the ports would be located in the rear and not the side. However the 40GPM 1000PTO model does have the ports in the rear and maybe that is the reason. I'm going into my 4th season with this setup and it is a pleasure to operate. In fact the splitter rarely leaves the back of that tractor. If I need to take it off I lower it onto a furniture dolly, remove hitch and hoses and roll the whole thing back against the wall in the shop. Takes all of 5min. to get it off or on. Speed is fa nominal and fuel is not an issue at all as I run the tractor exclusively on sumped jet A.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Here is a pic of a log splitter I made for my 3 point. I bought the beam off a wrecked tow behind unit then started fabricating. I did not like the store bought units since they only allowed access to one side of the splitter. I usually split with a buddy. I had to fabricate the frame, hitch, wedge, then put together the cylinder, hoses, and valve. I have about $400 in it. It goes horizontal and vertical and runs off my tractors hydro system. It will split anything I throw at it and I am guessing it has about a 6 or 7 second cycle time at 1300 rpm's.

Chris

 

[Diamondpilot]

Here are a few more pics.

Chris