Looking at a Case 580CK for my new rural home (total newb to tractors)

[JohnnyAirtime]

Hello all...
New guy here, and new to tractors in general.

I'm a handy person, hobbyist welder, etc... just not too much of a motor mechanic type.

I'm in need of renting, or buying a tractor... ongoing, for property work at my new house. From digging trenches (electrical, water drains, etc) to grading and smoothing, to brush clearing or moving dirt and debris. Do I "NEED" a tractor around on a monthly basis, no. But I can see the many uses once it's here and owned, especially if I add forks to the bucket when needed.

There's a gentleman about 40 miles from me who is selling a 1967 Case 580CK.
He has the rear gannon, and the backhoe attachment for it. Has replaced a few lines (during his ownership of about 6yrs), and says he's replaced the pump. Said the brakes are good (no problems), the shuttle hasn't given him any issues, and the motor (gas) doesn't smoke or leak any fluids. I've yet to see a demo, and verify no hydro leaks... nor did we fire it up. He's firm at his asking price, so I didn't offer when I stood there looking it over.

I signed up for this site, simply because I was reading posts about the 580CK. It seems, that if it's in good shape and needs little work that the worth could be about what he's asking. Yet, he was a bit slow to respond to some of my detailed questions and the timelines didn't match up from over the phone conversation and then the in person discussion. As example, how long he's owned it... how long ago things were replaced... and similar. It just made me a bit skeptical, as well... the yard it was kept in.

Without me posting pictures, and the hours being an unknown... is it something the experienced on this site can help in determining a real-world worth? And more importantly, WHAT things to look for when buying this particular model (known issues, etc)?

Thanks in advance!!

 

[jeff9366]

Here are some Case 580 VIDEOS: case 58�k backhoe - YouTube

Here are Case 580 CK SPECS from tractor data.com: TractorData.com J.I. Case 58� CK Construction King industrial tractor information

Tractordata shows both Three Point Hitch and PTO as optional. Find out if these are on the Case you are looking at. Case 580 "Construction King" may be too much machine, too much weight for your tasks.

Tractordata shows bare gas tractor @ 3,750 pounds. Loader/Backhoe @ 9,500 pounds. Therefore the FEL and Backhoe combined will be in the area of 5,750 pounds combined. It will be awkward to mount or dismount a >one ton Backhoe should you wish to use the Three Point Hitch or PTO.

How close is the nearest Case service? How will you transport the unit for service? Dealer can always transport but cost is likely to be $2.50 per mile for machinery this heavy/wide.
Forty miles = 40 X $2.50= $100.00 X 4 (two round trips) = $400 just for transport.

When buying used machinery with more than one owner the questions are always: How prudent were the operators?
How carefully was scheduled maintenance performed? Most sequential owners skip maintenance for a substantial period before they sell. So, the more owners, the greater risk you have buying.

Also note Case 580 is 2-WD, so you cannot use it on hills because only rear tractor wheels have brakes. When weight shifts forward going down hill, you have little or no stopping power without 4-WD.

Here are 20 eBay "SOLD" listings for Case 580 TLBs, which will give you an idea of prices buyers actually paid recently.
Case 580 in Backhoe Loaders | eBay


If you buy at a good price and do NOT have misfortune of (very expensive) repairs you may me able to sell in 1-2 years for the same price you paid IF the economy remains as good as today. During 2008/9 construction equipment like this went for a pittance when sold. Mechanic charges vary by region but $150 an hour would not be unusual for this equipment at a San Diego Case dealer. Mechanic charges on my three year old, small Kubota in Florida are $75.00 per hour and seem to be the cheapest service rates anywhere.

 

[ovrszd]

Hello all...
New guy here, and new to tractors in general.

I'm a handy person, hobbyist welder, etc... just not too much of a motor mechanic type.

I'm in need of renting, or buying a tractor... ongoing, for property work at my new house. From digging trenches (electrical, water drains, etc) to grading and smoothing, to brush clearing or moving dirt and debris. Do I "NEED" a tractor around on a monthly basis, no. But I can see the many uses once it's here and owned, especially if I add forks to the bucket when needed.

There's a gentleman about 40 miles from me who is selling a 1967 Case 580CK.
He has the rear gannon, and the backhoe attachment for it. Has replaced a few lines (during his ownership of about 6yrs), and says he's replaced the pump. Said the brakes are good (no problems), the shuttle hasn't given him any issues, and the motor (gas) doesn't smoke or leak any fluids. I've yet to see a demo, and verify no hydro leaks... nor did we fire it up. He's firm at his asking price, so I didn't offer when I stood there looking it over.

I signed up for this site, simply because I was reading posts about the 580CK. It seems, that if it's in good shape and needs little work that the worth could be about what he's asking. Yet, he was a bit slow to respond to some of my detailed questions and the timelines didn't match up from over the phone conversation and then the in person discussion. As example, how long he's owned it... how long ago things were replaced... and similar. It just made me a bit skeptical, as well... the yard it was kept in.

Without me posting pictures, and the hours being an unknown... is it something the experienced on this site can help in determining a real-world worth? And more importantly, WHAT things to look for when buying this particular model (known issues, etc)?

Thanks in advance!!

You aren't giving us much to work with here. You haven't heard it run. You haven't stated general overall appearance. You haven't told us his asking price.

A real-world worth is whatever you are willing to pay.

 

[fried1765]

Hello all...
New guy here, and new to tractors in general.

I'm a handy person, hobbyist welder, etc... just not too much of a motor mechanic type.

I'm in need of renting, or buying a tractor... ongoing, for property work at my new house. From digging trenches (electrical, water drains, etc) to grading and smoothing, to brush clearing or moving dirt and debris. Do I "NEED" a tractor around on a monthly basis, no. But I can see the many uses once it's here and owned, especially if I add forks to the bucket when needed.

There's a gentleman about 40 miles from me who is selling a 1967 Case 580CK.
He has the rear gannon, and the backhoe attachment for it. Has replaced a few lines (during his ownership of about 6yrs), and says he's replaced the pump. Said the brakes are good (no problems), the shuttle hasn't given him any issues, and the motor (gas) doesn't smoke or leak any fluids. I've yet to see a demo, and verify no hydro leaks... nor did we fire it up. He's firm at his asking price, so I didn't offer when I stood there looking it over.

I signed up for this site, simply because I was reading posts about the 580CK. It seems, that if it's in good shape and needs little work that the worth could be about what he's asking. Yet, he was a bit slow to respond to some of my detailed questions and the timelines didn't match up from over the phone conversation and then the in person discussion. As example, how long he's owned it... how long ago things were replaced... and similar. It just made me a bit skeptical, as well... the yard it was kept in.

Without me posting pictures, and the hours being an unknown... is it something the experienced on this site can help in determining a real-world worth? And more importantly, WHAT things to look for when buying this particular model (known issues, etc)?

Thanks in advance!!

If you buy that, or a similar machine, you should probably plan on buying a 12,000 lb. GVW trailer as well (14,000 lb., if in your state you can use that GVW legally).
Then, you could take the loader bucket, and the hoe bucket off for transport, and likely be legal with a 12,000 lb. trailer.
I have a 14,000 GVW trailer. My machine weighs 8500 lbs. with both buckets still attached.
My trailer weighs 3350 lbs. so .... 11,850 total. My vehicle hitch is rated at 12,000 lbs., so I am legal!
Tough to find a good used trailer.
I bought a new 14,000 GVW trailer for $4400 in 2015.
I would not want to be without it!

 

[George2615]

First of all, Welcome to TBN...................

If you look at the SOLD listings Jeff9366 posted you'll see most of those had the diesel engine which would be worth way more than the gas engine 580CK you are considering. Transport costs and the fact you are not a mechanic should be factored in too. That CK can get very costly if major repairs are needed.

For your uses a newer used TLB (tractor loader backhoe) may be a better option.

 

[jeff9366]

For your uses a newer used TLB (tractor loader backhoe) may be a better option.

Here are nine eBay tractor "SOLD" listings around San Diego: Tractors | eBay

 

[JohnnyAirtime]

Good day fellas....

Sorry, I thought I was going to be notified when anyone responded to my post... but, didn't get anything. I'll check into that.

Sorry... I didn't want to post too much info due to the possible seller being on here, and reading my post. Sometimes deal breakers are those small things that just rub someone the wrong way.

None-the-less... I bought the tractor. $8300.00 delivered.
I've looked and looked at the options of buying and what most come with. This was the ONLY one I've seen that is both a backhoe and comes with a gannon. Simple to remove, and change to another attachment. Takes about an hour taking one's time and not dropping something or causing damage.

At first look, I didn't start or operate the tractor... hence, nothing of that mentioned.

Second look, I had the cash with me and we ran the tractor. It runs GREAT, and operates all the attachments as it should. We pulled the gannon, and put the backhoe on to run it as well. All operates as it should. There was minimal leaking from any hose or cylinder, and so I handed over the cash.

I had originally posted here hoping that someone would chime in to give me a heads up on "what to look out for" when buying a used tractor. Simply because, it's my first. Well... I didn't get much feedback, so I went with my gut. Actually, my neighbor has already asked to buy it if I ever sell it... and for $10K. So that makes me feel better already.

I operated the tractor for an hour the other day... mostly the hoe, and it performed well. Had one line leak a bit of fluid, but I was also trying to dig to china. So, I'll make sure it's tight as it looked newly replaced and like it was leaking from the fitting itself. Overall, I'm impressed.

I still have yet to figure out ALL the controls, and what somethings do... and, need to tackle the brake on the right rear as it's not the best and barely holds or slows the tractor. The left rear is great, and will skid the tractor to a stop if needed. Could it be just a fluid issue? Anything to check before tearing into it?

Here's a couple pictures of it in my yard or on the trailer headed to my house;

 

[ovrszd]

Hope it works great for you!!!! Keep us updated as you use it more. Love to see other's projects!!!

 

[fried1765]

Good day fellas....

Sorry, I thought I was going to be notified when anyone responded to my post... but, didn't get anything. I'll check into that.

Sorry... I didn't want to post too much info due to the possible seller being on here, and reading my post. Sometimes deal breakers are those small things that just rub someone the wrong way.

None-the-less... I bought the tractor. $8300.00 delivered.
I've looked and looked at the options of buying and what most come with. This was the ONLY one I've seen that is both a backhoe and comes with a gannon. Simple to remove, and change to another attachment. Takes about an hour taking one's time and not dropping something or causing damage.

At first look, I didn't start or operate the tractor... hence, nothing of that mentioned.

Second look, I had the cash with me and we ran the tractor. It runs GREAT, and operates all the attachments as it should. We pulled the gannon, and put the backhoe on to run it as well. All operates as it should. There was minimal leaking from any hose or cylinder, and so I handed over the cash.

I had originally posted here hoping that someone would chime in to give me a heads up on "what to look out for" when buying a used tractor. Simply because, it's my first. Well... I didn't get much feedback, so I went with my gut. Actually, my neighbor has already asked to buy it if I ever sell it... and for $10K. So that makes me feel better already.

I operated the tractor for an hour the other day... mostly the hoe, and it performed well. Had one line leak a bit of fluid, but I was also trying to dig to china. So, I'll make sure it's tight as it looked newly replaced and like it was leaking from the fitting itself. Overall, I'm impressed.

I still have yet to figure out ALL the controls, and what somethings do... and, need to tackle the brake on the right rear as it's not the best and barely holds or slows the tractor. The left rear is great, and will skid the tractor to a stop if needed. Could it be just a fluid issue? Anything to check before tearing into it?

Here's a couple pictures of it in my yard or on the trailer headed to my house;

I paid $10,000 for my 48HP 1970 Ford 3400 TLB (smaller than your machine) when I bought it in 1986.
Like yours, it is gas (highly regarded Ford industrial engine). Mine had 1350 hours then, and has 1850 now.
This is my 31st year with the machine.
It has only a 10' hoe, but the breakout force is impressive.
I have never had it to a dealer (nearest Ford dealer is 85 miles away).
This past summer, I had it disassembled, and a complete (CAT yellow) paint job.
I only use it for myself, and it has been a great/incredibly handy, machine.
It has saved me probably 8-10 times what it cost, and is likely worth as much, or more now, than I paid for it.

Since you are in San Diego, could you trailer it over the border, if you should need any major work done?
I have a 12,000 lb. equipment trailer, (3 tractors) and a seasonal home in rural Canada.
I took my 46 year old 3400 Ford up there last year for repairs, and paint.
It looks sharp! Almost like new!

 

[JohnnyAirtime]

I paid $10,000 for my 48HP 1970 Ford 3400 TLB (smaller than your machine) when I bought it in 1986.
Like yours, it is gas (highly regarded Ford industrial engine). Mine had 1350 hours then, and has 1850 now.
This is my 31st year with the machine.
It has only a 10' hoe, but the breakout force is impressive.
I have never had it to a dealer (nearest Ford dealer is 85 miles away).
This past summer, I had it disassembled, and a complete (CAT yellow) paint job.
I only use it for myself, and it has been a great/incredibly handy, machine.
It has saved me probably 8-10 times what it cost, and is likely worth as much, or more now, than I paid for it.

Since you are in San Diego, could you trailer it over the border, if you should need any major work done?
I have a 12,000 lb. equipment trailer, (3 tractors) and a seasonal home in rural Canada.
I took my 46 year old 3400 Ford up there last year for repairs, and paint.
It looks sharp! Almost like new!

That's good to hear... I mean, I'm not looking to make money or re-sell anytime soon. It's just nice to know it's not too bad a deal.

I do plan to rub some elbow grease, and make'er look a little prettier. Once I go through and do a service on all needed items (I just added 5gal of hydraulic fluid as it was low - and it sure made a difference on how well it all worked)... I don't know it's maintenance schedule, so I'll start a new one and keep up on it.

Yes, I do have the border 20min from my house. But no equipment trailer to haul it, and I live in a mountain range type area. Not the most convenient, and if I had an issue post fix... I'm SOL. I'll try local first if the need arises.

... I guess I'm back to my question, and I can post it in another thread if needed. But I'd like to know best way to start troubleshooting the brakes. First thought is to pull wheels, and check the shoes/etc. But, wasn't sure if there's a more simple FIRST step. Anyone with ideas, I'm all ears!

 

[Sonny580]

I got my 1968 580-Diesel from township sealed bid auction for $ 2,000 and it was a good machine.---now it need injection pump repair and later a clutch, ( township operators rough on equipment) ---Unit has cab and heater and wiper, good glass and good paint.--even has good working beacon on it! thanks; sonny580

 

[BarnStangz]

Concerning your brakes, what's up with them. Does it stop at all? Have you looked at adjustment? I'd do that first. I think your price is fair, but man.... That's a lot of cash to spend on something so old. I hope it serves you well however!

 

[rScotty]

That's good to hear... I mean, I'm not looking to make money or re-sell anytime soon. It's just nice to know it's not too bad a deal.

I do plan to rub some elbow grease, and make'er look a little prettier. Once I go through and do a service on all needed items (I just added 5gal of hydraulic fluid as it was low - and it sure made a difference on how well it all worked)... I don't know it's maintenance schedule, so I'll start a new one and keep up on it.

... I guess I'm back to my question, and I can post it in another thread if needed. But I'd like to know best way to start troubleshooting the brakes. First thought is to pull wheels, and check the shoes/etc. But, wasn't sure if there's a more simple FIRST step. Anyone with ideas, I'm all ears!

I'm glad to hear there are other old mechanics out there who appreciate how well those old gassers were built. Our JD310 is pushing 7000 hours on the meter and still works good as a new one. Our 1958 JD530 Ag tractor was retired and then used as a stationary water pump in a corn field for a decade. To our surprise when we unhooked the water lines it worked just fine and we drove it to its new home. Even the power steering works!

As for brakes, check the exploded diagrams to see where they are. The brakes may or may not be behind the rear wheels. Lots of those old machines put their brakes on the countershaft instead of the rear axle. On a heavy low-geared machine you get better braking that way.
Luck,
rScotty

 

[KWentling]

So I've been doing a little research on these and may go look at one today. I've read that the park brake locks the right side only unless the pedals are linked together. It probably had the brake set without the pedals connected and was operated with the park brake on, wearing that brake. It's supposedly a drum or band, don't remember which and the axle has to be pulled to repair. Could also be an oil soaked lining problem. Looks like terrain that I would want good brakes!

 

[LarJea]

First thing I would do is pull the top cover off the rear differential and check the ring/pinion and bearings, not fun splitting that tractor in two.

 

[LarJea]

As far as your brakes are concerned if they are like the ones that were on my 580B you do NOT pull the wheels off. There is a housing on each side of the transaxle that needs to come off to get to the brakes. Besides replacing the bands check that the ball bearings are perfectly round.

 

[KWentling]

As far as your brakes are concerned if they are like the ones that were on my 580B you do NOT pull the wheels off. There is a housing on each side of the transaxle that needs to come off to get to the brakes. Besides replacing the bands check that the ball bearings are perfectly round.

That's good to know. Still thinking on the one we looked at. Needs injection pump work so didn't get to try it out much.

 

[JohnnyAirtime]

... I guess I'm back to my question, and I can post it in another thread if needed. But I'd like to know best way to start troubleshooting the brakes. First thought is to pull wheels, and check the shoes/etc. But, wasn't sure if there's a more simple FIRST step. Anyone with ideas, I'm all ears!

Thought I'd post an update...

Never pulled the rear apart, and after some use... the right rear will now skid the wheel. Not sure what changed, but now the cutting brakes (split pedal) work great and I can slow the tractor. Not as scary as it was when I first got it.

Other then severe leaking from a few cylinders (of the backhoe attachment, one cylinder pours a stream of fluid now - I'll have to work on new seals or getting them checked by someone)... and a recent P/S hose leak, it's been a great rig.

I broke a handle off the gannon levers, and one was already missing. I'll weld up a new set here soon... plan to make them different lengths to differentiate the controls. I don't use the rippers, so they'll get a short handle... and, it'll progress taller from side-to-side tilt to the dig tilt to the up/down of the gannon. It'll be nice to have them in that order, and not my current "vice-grip" handles. Haha.

... I'm only using it for maintenance on the property now. Moved hundreds of yards of material with it over the time we've had it. Now it's just road maintenance, and maybe one more trench if I decide to use 'ground mount' solar panels.

Cheers!

 

[LarJea]

Providing your CK is like my old 580B when the brake assembly ball bearings get out of round they will lock up the wheel when applied. When I did mine I bought the whole brake kit, if on a budget you might get by with just the bearings.
If I remember right it was not a hard job to do.

 

[LarJea]

Should also mention if the steel balls look ok you might get by cleaning out all the rust and dirt and check the seals.