M5-111 Clutch operation

[rwskinner]

I have a new M5-111 on order but it's not scheduled to come in until the first of next year. I did get the chance to drive one today.
That clutch seems to be pretty abrupt and difficult to feather. For example, inching back to implements, or using the bucket to place a load.
Now, I come from a manual syncro shuttle 7040 so some of it's may be just the difference in feel and something I have to get used to.

Do you have experience with a M5-091 or M5-111 and what's your opinion on the clutch?

Other than that, cab is larger and quieter, and the clutch pedal does seem a little easier to push. Nice tractor.

 

[Like Tractors]

I have an M5-091, the clutch does take some getting used to. It uses hydraulic clutch packs, there is some delay in clutch apply when trying to inch especially with cold oil. The simple way to look at it is, let the clutch pedal up a little bit and wait for it. You will get used to it. It is one nice tractor, I should have gone for the M5 instead of starting with an M7060.

 

[rwskinner]

Thanks for the response. Yes it was cold oil when I tried it. I use a front mounted hydraulic limb cutter and my 7040 allows me to move very slowly into position, but by the end of the day my left knee doesn't work anymore (getting some miles on myself). After test driving that M5, I thought to myself that precise inching may be impossible so I'm glad to hear it's not an issue and I just need to get used to it. For other task I don't see it being a problem at all.

 

[Like Tractors]

I am guessing your 7040 used a dry clutch rather than hydraulic clutches. My M5 is a 12 speed, I can't speak to clutch operation with an M5-111 with a 24 speed transmission, it is probably a safe bet to say they are very similar. The M5 are very nice machines!

 

[Tx Jim]

Ditto M7060 sync-shuttle utilizes a dry traction clutch. I'll guess M5-111 is similar to my M7040 HDC & utilizes a hyd valve attached to foot pedal to control wet shuttle clutches.

 

[Farmer495]

"Hydraulic Shuttle" clutch pedal doesn't feel the same as a normal dry clutch, not as precise for sure.

Things "feel better" when the oil is warmed up and you use low gears for precision work.

 

[JWR]

Thanks for the response. Yes it was cold oil when I tried it. I use a front mounted hydraulic limb cutter and my 7040 allows me to move very slowly into position, but by the end of the day my left knee doesn't work anymore (getting some miles on myself). After test driving that M5, I thought to myself that precise inching may be impossible so I'm glad to hear it's not an issue and I just need to get used to it. For other task I don't see it being a problem at all.

What sort of hydraulic limb cutter do you use? Driven by tractor hydraulics or by PTO driven pump?

 

[rwskinner]

Limbhog running from a rear remote with hoses running to front. 12 hp with reverse if you jam it. Absolutely love it.

 

[JWR]

Limbhog running from a rear remote with hoses running to front. 12 hp with reverse if you jam it. Absolutely love it.

Is that similar to a LaneShark? I use a Lane Shark [which works great] and previously tried larger heavier FEL mounted cutters with too little hydraulic flow from the tractor for them to be robust.

 

[rwskinner]

No, it's a 18" chain saw driven from a 12 hp hyd. motor. It's on a 8-10' extension made from 2-1/2" square tubing. Chain saw on a long pole.
You can google Limbhog and there are a couple of others that are almost exact copies. It's good for trimming trees by yourself. A man basket and a pole saw works wonderful you you have a helper.

I mounted my Limbsaw receiver to my grapple. I open my grapple wide open then disconnect the hoses and hook my saw up. As limbs fall and pile up, I can use the grapple to push them out of the way. When done, sliding the saw off is quick and then plug the grapple hoses in and clean up all the piles.

 

[sea2summit]

Thanks for the response. Yes it was cold oil when I tried it. I use a front mounted hydraulic limb cutter and my 7040 allows me to move very slowly into position, but by the end of the day my left knee doesn't work anymore (getting some miles on myself). After test driving that M5, I thought to myself that precise inching may be impossible so I'm glad to hear it's not an issue and I just need to get used to it. For other task I don't see it being a problem at all.

With my M4 I feather the brakes and the clutch if I'm doing really precision stuff, just to take the edge off the clutch engagement. Works for me when I'm stacking pallets in the shed or packing up to a hitch etc.

 

[5030]

If it's a hydraulic shuttle, the 'clutch' pedal don't act on a physical clutch because there isn't one. All that is in the bellhousing is a damper plate.

The 'clutch pedal' acts on the hydraulic proportioning valve and when the fluid is cold, the engagement is abrupt. The proportioning valve 'senses' the load and controls the traveling pack accordingly but cold fluid cause an abrupt lock up. Once the tractor's fluid is warm, it smooths out.

I won't run anything but a hydraulic shuttle simply because the clutch pack's failure 'wearing out' is pretty rare and unlike a conventional dry clutch, you never have to split the unit to replace it. Having said that however, if you do somehow manage to wear out the travelling pack, you will have tp split it to service it as it's only accessable that way. You can pull the back cover off the pto and see it, but you cannot reach it as it's in front of the rear drive components. Same applies to the wet clutch PTO pack. You can see it but not touch it (without a split).

I don't know if Kubota address the issues with the wet pack PTO clutch but both mine suffer from a weak PTO brake and I always use an over running external clutch (ratcheting) when using driven equipment that will over run the PTO id shut off abruptly. I heard that Kubota had addressed that issue on later models but mine requires the over running clutch.

I have over 6000 hours on one of my hydraulic shuttle Kubota's and I've never had to fiddle with the clutch pack or increase the lockup pressure due to plate wear and that unit does a lot of loader work too.

The other nice thing is you can 'half clutch' the pack and never worry about wearing it out, unlike a conventional dry clutch.

Really like the column mounted shuttle lever for front end loader work. You keep your feet on the floor and do everything with your left hand. Takes a bit of getting used to but once you master it, you won't go back.

Whatever you do however, don't cheap out on fluid. I either run Kubota SUDT or Chevron All Weather Synthetic fluid. Neither is cheap but the wet packs really require a premium synthetic fluid.... and, both mine operate a bit smoother in cold weather with the Chevron. Run Kubota filters as well. In fact I run Kubota filters exclusively. Not that much more than the other brands anyway.