Measuring fuel additives
- Thread starter Bob_Young
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patrick_g said:
Pat, I use a rock to keep the Cape Buffaloes away:
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/...do-i-dare-put-slick-2.html?highlight=elephant
Post 16.
It must work; I've never have seen one on the place.
tomd999
Platinum Member
Hiya,
I see my attempt at some sarcastic humor flopped....
I wish to state that I do not recommend that unapproved additives be added to fuels.
To the point of sulfurized compounds being used as extreme pressure anti wear additives in gear (GL series) lubricants. GL5 lubricant has an extreme pressure (EP) performance rating intended for Hypoid gear sets. This type differential design features sliding component contact areas that operate under high point loadings as part of normal operation. In applications such as these, lubricants must have the ability to maintain film coverage and prevent direct contact of components. This is achieved by incorporating high concentrations of sulfurized additives. Some of these sulfurized additives are very aggressive, designed react to the alloys in the components and tightly bond to them, providing the protection needed. The downside of such bonding in highly sulfurized lubricants is that it tends to corrode yellow metals. Most differentials do not utilize components that will be adversely affected however most end users use GL5 and GL4 lubricants interchangeably. In doing so they can seriously damage components such as brass synchronizer blocker rings and bronze bushings. (or fuel gauge senders)
Perhaps the most recent vehicle to be affected by this interchanged usage is the '03 and later "tank frame" Buell lightning and firebolt series motorcycles. The manufacturer uses an oil cooled, permanent magnet, exposed winding type alternator attached to the inside of the primary drive case cover. This housing contains the primary drive chain and wet clutch assembly. End users looking for a "better" lubricant frequently substituted a popular synthetic GL5 rated gear lube for the recommended "sporttrans" or "Synth3" lubes. Most owners that used GL5 series lubes found after several hundred miles, the aggressive sulfurized additives in the GL5 lube had attacked the copper windings of the alternator and rendered it non working.
I'll refrain form the lame attempts at sarcastic humor for now,
OK, that's long enough.... Something must be wrong with your formula for pachyderm protection, whenever I do that I find the salt gone and a bunch of happy deer in the front yard....
Tom
I see my attempt at some sarcastic humor flopped....
I wish to state that I do not recommend that unapproved additives be added to fuels.
To the point of sulfurized compounds being used as extreme pressure anti wear additives in gear (GL series) lubricants. GL5 lubricant has an extreme pressure (EP) performance rating intended for Hypoid gear sets. This type differential design features sliding component contact areas that operate under high point loadings as part of normal operation. In applications such as these, lubricants must have the ability to maintain film coverage and prevent direct contact of components. This is achieved by incorporating high concentrations of sulfurized additives. Some of these sulfurized additives are very aggressive, designed react to the alloys in the components and tightly bond to them, providing the protection needed. The downside of such bonding in highly sulfurized lubricants is that it tends to corrode yellow metals. Most differentials do not utilize components that will be adversely affected however most end users use GL5 and GL4 lubricants interchangeably. In doing so they can seriously damage components such as brass synchronizer blocker rings and bronze bushings. (or fuel gauge senders)
Perhaps the most recent vehicle to be affected by this interchanged usage is the '03 and later "tank frame" Buell lightning and firebolt series motorcycles. The manufacturer uses an oil cooled, permanent magnet, exposed winding type alternator attached to the inside of the primary drive case cover. This housing contains the primary drive chain and wet clutch assembly. End users looking for a "better" lubricant frequently substituted a popular synthetic GL5 rated gear lube for the recommended "sporttrans" or "Synth3" lubes. Most owners that used GL5 series lubes found after several hundred miles, the aggressive sulfurized additives in the GL5 lube had attacked the copper windings of the alternator and rendered it non working.
I'll refrain form the lame attempts at sarcastic humor for now,
OK, that's long enough.... Something must be wrong with your formula for pachyderm protection, whenever I do that I find the salt gone and a bunch of happy deer in the front yard....
Tom
patrick_g
Elite Member
tomd999 said:
1. I saw no failure of humor, lighten up on yourself.
2. I didn't give away ALL the magic ingredients/processes
There is still the part about a dead cat and spunkwater which is not common knowledge.
Pat
Soundguy
Old Timer
- Joined
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- RK 55HC,ym1700, NH7610S, Ford 8N, 2N, NAA, 660, 850 x2, 541, 950, 941D, 951, 2000, 3000, 4000, 4600, 5000, 740, IH 'C' 'H', CUB, John Deere 'B', allis 'G', case VAC
Coarse or fine grain? I need to know... our neighbor lady is large!
(wink)
Soundguy
(wink)
Soundguy
patrick_g said:
joerocker
Silver Member
So what do you think? ARE we wasting our time/money adding ANYTHING to the fuel? Is stanadyne or power service a waste?
patrick_g
Elite Member
joerocker said:
Ask a single questiion like yours and you will get several different opinions.
Most additive use is faith based with little or no good engineering data. Ahh, to have a corner on the market on petroleum distillate the chief ingredient of most of the snake oil.
Anti-gel additives for winter driving are a good thing. Cetane improvers, in moderation, can be a good thing, especially when actually needed. After that you are getting into a gray area which is most often faith based. Most additive sellers can give you a jillion personal testimonials from a collection of folks who are true believers. Few can offer hard science, irrefutable data from repeatable experiments performed by third party labs with no monetary interest in the product.
One of the chief errors in logic relating to the use of snake oil (fuel additives or diet pills or sex drive enhancers) is known as "post hoc propter ergo hoc" which translates as, after this therefore because of this. You use an additive for 200, 000 miles and get good results so you think it was because of the additive. You do x and later y happens and jump to the conclusion that x caused y. Maybe and maybe not. I peed off the back porch and the next day it rained. Do you think I caused the rain? Wanna hire me?
There may be good additives available and there may be good results obtained in some situations using them but there is a shortage of scientific evidence. Why? If a producer of additives could prove a benefit don't you think they would and then sell the **** out of the product due to the demand the proof produced?
UNSUBSTANTIATED claims and various good old boy testimonials abound but where are the repeatable scientifically significant results? IF you had a product that an independent lab could verify as beneficial you couldn't make the sutuff fast enough to keep pace with the demand.
Pat
Soundguy
Old Timer
- Joined
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- Messages
- 51,575
- Location
- Central florida
- Tractor
- RK 55HC,ym1700, NH7610S, Ford 8N, 2N, NAA, 660, 850 x2, 541, 950, 941D, 951, 2000, 3000, 4000, 4600, 5000, 740, IH 'C' 'H', CUB, John Deere 'B', allis 'G', case VAC
I'd also like to add 'biocides' to the list of addatives that do have benefitial properties, other than profit for the sellers..
and for the record.. I use PS...
Soundguy
and for the record.. I use PS...
Soundguy
Egon
Epic Contributor
We cant forget salt can we???