More electrical problems

[JasonMI]

I've had ongoing electrical problems with this tractor. Several times, it will start up fine, run it for a while, shut it off, and when I go back to start it (either the same day or the next)---nothing. No power. I take the positive battery cable off, sand it carefully, and replace it, and then it will usually start. This time, however; nothing. No dash lights, no starting lights, nothing. I even just replaced the entire positive battery cable. I took off and sanded the negative cable (at both ends).

The battery reads 12.3 volts. The battery is about four years old; I did not have (as I recall), any of these issues before getting this battery. It's an off-the-shelf one from Autozone (not an interstate battery or anything). Yes, I know. A clue.

Last night I took my battery charger/starter (its one of the tabletop models, not one of those big ones on wheels), hooked the negative jumper cable to a good ground on the frame, and the positive directly to the positive battery cable. I set the charger to 50amp-Jump, and cranked it. Wow! Very bright dashboard lights. When I turn it to start, the first time there was a spark sound, second time, it tried to crank (although all I got was that clacking sound---the starter didn't turn over). Twice I tried it, and twice, the first crank got that sparking sound.

I'm guessing I either have a bad battery, or perhaps something is getting grounded that shouldn't. I can bring a truck into the barn and try a direct jump start.

Suggestions?

 

[washita]

the ''telltale'' spark sound indicates a loose/corroded electrical connection in the system check both sides of the electrical system ie; positive and negative

 

[JasonMI]

Thanks....I was afraid you'd say that. Is there an easy way to find it, or am I going to be tracing lines for the next two weeks?

 

[CharlieS]

Always try the simple/inexpensive cures first. In this case, disconnect the batt. ground, then pull/clean/reinstall/tighten the positive battery cable ends, both at the battery and starter or solinoid.
Then, detach the neg. batt cable from the ground point on the tractor motor/frame, clean and reinstall/tighten, and finallly clean and reinstall the neg. battery terminal connection.
The reason for unhooking the neg. first is to prevent a dead short should you slip with a wrench and make a solid hot to ground connection. All those arc's and sparks wreak havoc on any sensitive electronics, if present.

On a side note, my experiences through the years, most intermittent automotive electrics problems can be traced back to faulty grounds.

 

[grsthegreat]

The best bet is to put another battery on the tractor. 50 amps WONT start any tractor. A cold start may need 300 amps.

The clicking is the starter trying to engage.
Most batteries have 750 amp cold start capability

 

[kensnelling]

You should also check your battery cables for continuity and resistance. Your cable(s) may be causing the problem.

Ken

 

[grsthegreat]

My battery with no load on it reads about 13.1 V on a digital meter. While starting it drops to about 12.3 ish.

What does your meter show while trying to start it???

 

[Gizmos]

If you have clean cable and think your connections are good then forget the jumper cables, save time and swap the battery out of your truck, then you know you have a good battery. Jumper cables are typically too light to carry full starting current.
Sounds more like a selonoid or brushes in the starter. Try tapping on the starter with a small hammer. If the brushes are worn the vibration will help seat them agains the commutator, you may get one or two good starts.

 

[gengine]

I think it's your battery. If I recall, if your fully charged battery reads less than 13vdc, then it needs replaced. Although you may be getting the voltage needed, you may not be getting the amps. You can pull the battery and have it tested at any parts shop, usually for free. It may have a dead cell, causing your problems. The clicking sound is your starter engaging, but not turning the flywheel because of lack of power. Good luck!

 

[grsthegreat]

i always wonder why diesel tractors dont have 2 batteries like trucks do.....really get the starting juice.

 

[JunkManBob]

If you turn either lights or ignition on, you should get lights with even a weak or under rated battery.
If you don't, probably a bad connection (or fuses).
Easiest thing to do is to do whatever should turn on the lights; then take a voltmeter, set to read DC --- volts and connect the neg (black) to your neg battery clamp and check along the path using the red probe.
Suggest you use your black jumper cable to go from the battery clamp to the meter black lead, so you can get you and the meter to where you want to check.
But be SURE to start out checking the Positive post of the battery, to make sure you get your 12 volts there. That makes sure your test connections are good, and the ground clamp is well connected to the battery post.
Once you know you can read 12 volts on the positive battery post, you can see where the open circuit is.
You might want to go directly to the frame first, and check it. If it reads 12 volts (from the battery neg), you know you have a bad ground connection between the battery clamp and the frame. Check along that cable to pin down where.
If frame is ok (near zero volts), then work the other way. Make sure you still have 12 volts at the positive post, then test each point you can get to along the wiring path until you don't get 12 volts anymore. You can check through the fuse block, making sure you get 12 volts on both sides of the fuse for the lighting.
Make sure you have the lights "on" (but not lighting) the whole time. If they light up, you may have disturbed the bad connection (maybe see/hear a spark at that point).
Once you get the lights working, THEN move on. Starting problems can be checked the same way, down to the solenoid and starter. But no point in that until the lights work right.
Lights are easier because you can just leave them on; don't need someone or something to turn a key; and no moving parts to bust you up if it suddenly decides to crank.
If you don't have a voltmeter; you should. They're cheap, and can tell you a lot.
A "test light" can do the same; but it's harder to tell about slightly bad connections with a light, versus clearly seeing the voltage drop across the bad connection with a meter.

 

[JasonMI]

Thank you all very much for your help; I'll try these out tonight and let you know what I find.