My letter to Kioti, loader rerepair, long

IslandTractor · Jun 7, 2006

My thoughts exactly.

Yoohoo, Kioti, are you lurking? Throw us a bone.

IslandTractor · Jun 7, 2006

My thoughts exactly.

Yoohoo, Kioti, are you lurking? Throw us a bone.

Redneck_Randy · Jun 7, 2006

( The one thing that I know is that the way that this thing has escalated, there needs to be an official statement. It wouldn't matter which avenue Kioti chose to utilize to make the statement public. Just as long as the statement is put out so that the owners with losses would know that something is being done. I know that the well-respected dealers here have stated that it is being worked on, but the many loyal owners deserve something more than second hand information. )

Sorry but I think they won't. Kioti is going to let it roll and only fix those that are informed of the problem. Those that have no idea about it will be on the loosing end for the dealers will not even step up to the plate. That's how big business works. Kioti will never admit fault in a public forum. That would admit fault thus causing them to fix/replace more FELs then they care to. Kioti is like all the rest, NH, Case, MS and so one. They could care less after they get there money. Same goes for the dealers. Not all but most dealers.

Randy

Redneck_Randy · Jun 7, 2006

( The one thing that I know is that the way that this thing has escalated, there needs to be an official statement. It wouldn't matter which avenue Kioti chose to utilize to make the statement public. Just as long as the statement is put out so that the owners with losses would know that something is being done. I know that the well-respected dealers here have stated that it is being worked on, but the many loyal owners deserve something more than second hand information. )

Sorry but I think they won't. Kioti is going to let it roll and only fix those that are informed of the problem. Those that have no idea about it will be on the loosing end for the dealers will not even step up to the plate. That's how big business works. Kioti will never admit fault in a public forum. That would admit fault thus causing them to fix/replace more FELs then they care to. Kioti is like all the rest, NH, Case, MS and so one. They could care less after they get there money. Same goes for the dealers. Not all but most dealers.

Randy

MOTractorman · Jun 7, 2006

Hey Highbeam, I posted on your original loader problem when you first discovered it and had the repair done. I informed you then I was taking my CK30 in because I too found long cracks in the same area. Sorry, you requested photo's and I did never got around to posting them.

Sorry for not responding sooner, I have been extremely busy. I have photo's but I'm on my work computer and my home computer is having difficulty sizing the photo's for posting.

I informed my dealer of the cracks and he contacted Kioti. He said Kioti informed him to have me bring the loader in to have a plate welded on for support. I brought it in and my dealer again called Kioti after seeing the cracks in person.

I was standing near him while he was on the phone with the rep. The rep told him to weld on a supporting plate to the loader brace to fix the problem. The rep did not ask the dealer for photo's. The dealer and mechanic did not feel they could satisfactorily weld the loader and felt the repair needed to be done by a nearby welding shop.

The dealer again called Kioti and they authorized him to send it to the welding shop. The dealer sent me to the welding shop armed with a spray can of Kioti orange paint. I talked with the welder and he said to fix it correctly (to prevent the loader from cracking again) the entire brace should be taken out and put back with thicker gauged steel. I told him to fix it correctly because Kioti was paying for it. To my knowledge there was no contact between the Kioti rep and the welder.

The welder for whatever reason welded on two pieces of 1/4 inch thick angle iron to the bottom front and back side of the support and welded in two flat pieces where the gaps created a void on the sides of the inspection plate (so the inspection plate fit on flush on all four sides).

The shop cut out round notches in the angle iron where the hoses fit into the frame and cut holes for the screws for the inspection plate. The welding shop then spray painted the angle iron fix.

Although this repair was done fairly neatly, I wonder if Kioti knows this is how the repair was completed. I returned to the dealer with the loader and they installed longer bolts through the inspection plate to compensate for the thickness of the angle iron.

I plan on sending Kioti the before and after pictures so they could determine if the loader will be structurely sound to prevent future cracking and or failure.

I know others wanted to know what Kioti was doing about this problem and I too beleive it is a widespread problem especially with heavy loader use. I will post before and after photo's at a later date when my picture sizing problems are worked out.

My repair does not look so bad and I'm not terribly displeased by it. I doubt it will affect the resale. My only concern is if Kioti beleives it is a suitable fix.

My tractor had 220 hours at the time of the repair. It was purchase new in late June of 2005. I have no problems with my dealer, he was just following the manufacturers suggested fix.

MOTractorman · Jun 7, 2006

Hey Highbeam, I posted on your original loader problem when you first discovered it and had the repair done. I informed you then I was taking my CK30 in because I too found long cracks in the same area. Sorry, you requested photo's and I did never got around to posting them.

Sorry for not responding sooner, I have been extremely busy. I have photo's but I'm on my work computer and my home computer is having difficulty sizing the photo's for posting.

I informed my dealer of the cracks and he contacted Kioti. He said Kioti informed him to have me bring the loader in to have a plate welded on for support. I brought it in and my dealer again called Kioti after seeing the cracks in person.

I was standing near him while he was on the phone with the rep. The rep told him to weld on a supporting plate to the loader brace to fix the problem. The rep did not ask the dealer for photo's. The dealer and mechanic did not feel they could satisfactorily weld the loader and felt the repair needed to be done by a nearby welding shop.

The dealer again called Kioti and they authorized him to send it to the welding shop. The dealer sent me to the welding shop armed with a spray can of Kioti orange paint. I talked with the welder and he said to fix it correctly (to prevent the loader from cracking again) the entire brace should be taken out and put back with thicker gauged steel. I told him to fix it correctly because Kioti was paying for it. To my knowledge there was no contact between the Kioti rep and the welder.

The welder for whatever reason welded on two pieces of 1/4 inch thick angle iron to the bottom front and back side of the support and welded in two flat pieces where the gaps created a void on the sides of the inspection plate (so the inspection plate fit on flush on all four sides).

The shop cut out round notches in the angle iron where the hoses fit into the frame and cut holes for the screws for the inspection plate. The welding shop then spray painted the angle iron fix.

Although this repair was done fairly neatly, I wonder if Kioti knows this is how the repair was completed. I returned to the dealer with the loader and they installed longer bolts through the inspection plate to compensate for the thickness of the angle iron.

I plan on sending Kioti the before and after pictures so they could determine if the loader will be structurely sound to prevent future cracking and or failure.

I know others wanted to know what Kioti was doing about this problem and I too beleive it is a widespread problem especially with heavy loader use. I will post before and after photo's at a later date when my picture sizing problems are worked out.

My repair does not look so bad and I'm not terribly displeased by it. I doubt it will affect the resale. My only concern is if Kioti beleives it is a suitable fix.

My tractor had 220 hours at the time of the repair. It was purchase new in late June of 2005. I have no problems with my dealer, he was just following the manufacturers suggested fix.

IslandTractor · Jun 7, 2006

I don't believe MOTractorman was part of Birdhawk's recent compilation so his report now makes a total of 12 TBN member tractors now with cracked loaders.

IslandTractor · Jun 7, 2006

I don't believe MOTractorman was part of Birdhawk's recent compilation so his report now makes a total of 12 TBN member tractors now with cracked loaders.

KiotiJohn · Jun 8, 2006

( OH PLEASE STOP. It is well known that you have an exceptional relationship with your dealer, you've even written where you helped unload some new tractors when they were delivered. But let's set the record straight (and Highbeam if I missed something please correct me).)
So what if it's well known, Bob? Does that change the fact that he would have taken care of a customer. It wouldn't have to me!

( Joe went to his dealer with a cracked loader. The dealer went to Kioti. Koiti authorized a repair at a 3rd party shop. The shop did a crummy job. Joe's dealer agreed it was a crummy job. But the dealer really is not to blame here. He may not be the best dealer, but he sure sounds to be trying to be responsive. He is attempting to take care of the problem but the reality is the problem is bigger than just a repair.)
Read Joe's posts. He has said many times that much of it was the dealer's fault. The dealer chose the welder, not Kioti, OH PLEASE STOP. After all Bob, there's no reason Joe's tractor should even be at the dealers. The tractor is NOT NEEDED TO MAKE THE REPAIR TO THE LOADER. Joe could be cutting his oh so tall grass right now, AND EVERYONE KNOWS IT.

( And if the dealer lends a tractor to Joe, then the dealer is going to take a new tractor, and reduce it to 'loaner' status, which means it will sell for less, and therefore that is money out of the dealer's pocket. Most dealers will not lend out tractors. It sounds like Joe's dealer is a small dealer so he probably can't lend out a tractor. It seems to me that you are just trying to deflect the problem and blame Joe's dealer.)
I'm not trying to deflect anything at all. I've already posted that Kioti should notify owners of the loaders that there could be a problem with them. What more do you want from me? How much more can you twist my words to your own liking, like telling us that Neil said he was doing a spread sheet for his company, which HE DID NOT SAY.
( Kioti could have fixed this long ago, they seem reluctant to do that.) We've hashed and rehashed that misnomer.
Kioti has been trying to do just that. It's only been a few weeks since Joe actually sent the pictures for them to see!
( All that is being asked for by folks like Highbeam, IslandTractor, and the others is for Kioti to admit there is a problem,
for Kioti to send out a letter or notice saying they are working on a solution, and then to ultimately fix the problem correctly.)
Gosh Mr. Bob, I don't know what I would do without you to tell me what I've already read over and over. You have taken this opportunity to simply restate all the negatives of this thread, and to misrepresent all of my statements, based on me saying Joe should have a loaner. It's not much different that a dealer who drops off a tractor for a few days for someone to try out on their properties. This is something you advocate frequently, so what's changed? Why are you now saying it's such a negative thing? Because it's convenient to your argument which is all wet!

( Nobody asked for an immediate fix. This has become a PUBLIC RELATIONS problem that is far bigger than a loader problem.)
This is so blatantly untrue so as to be funny. You yourself just said ( Kioti could have fixed this long ago, they seem reluctant to do that.)
Island tractor has said several times that he's made because the problem hasn't been taken care of. One only has to reread the posts to know that your statment is incorrect.
As for the public realtions problem, I doubt seriously that it would be nearly the problem it has become had non Kioti owners not come here to stir up all this ruckus.
You may say as many times as you want that you are objective, but the misstatements in this post alone are enough to show anyone that you are not.
This thread has become as non-productive as any I have ever seen. Isn't it amazing that a certain moderator, who has ended lesser controversies much sooner has chosen to allow this crap to continue.
John

KiotiJohn · Jun 8, 2006

( OH PLEASE STOP. It is well known that you have an exceptional relationship with your dealer, you've even written where you helped unload some new tractors when they were delivered. But let's set the record straight (and Highbeam if I missed something please correct me).)
So what if it's well known, Bob? Does that change the fact that he would have taken care of a customer. It wouldn't have to me!

( Joe went to his dealer with a cracked loader. The dealer went to Kioti. Koiti authorized a repair at a 3rd party shop. The shop did a crummy job. Joe's dealer agreed it was a crummy job. But the dealer really is not to blame here. He may not be the best dealer, but he sure sounds to be trying to be responsive. He is attempting to take care of the problem but the reality is the problem is bigger than just a repair.)
Read Joe's posts. He has said many times that much of it was the dealer's fault. The dealer chose the welder, not Kioti, OH PLEASE STOP. After all Bob, there's no reason Joe's tractor should even be at the dealers. The tractor is NOT NEEDED TO MAKE THE REPAIR TO THE LOADER. Joe could be cutting his oh so tall grass right now, AND EVERYONE KNOWS IT.

( And if the dealer lends a tractor to Joe, then the dealer is going to take a new tractor, and reduce it to 'loaner' status, which means it will sell for less, and therefore that is money out of the dealer's pocket. Most dealers will not lend out tractors. It sounds like Joe's dealer is a small dealer so he probably can't lend out a tractor. It seems to me that you are just trying to deflect the problem and blame Joe's dealer.)
I'm not trying to deflect anything at all. I've already posted that Kioti should notify owners of the loaders that there could be a problem with them. What more do you want from me? How much more can you twist my words to your own liking, like telling us that Neil said he was doing a spread sheet for his company, which HE DID NOT SAY.
( Kioti could have fixed this long ago, they seem reluctant to do that.) We've hashed and rehashed that misnomer.
Kioti has been trying to do just that. It's only been a few weeks since Joe actually sent the pictures for them to see!
( All that is being asked for by folks like Highbeam, IslandTractor, and the others is for Kioti to admit there is a problem,
for Kioti to send out a letter or notice saying they are working on a solution, and then to ultimately fix the problem correctly.)
Gosh Mr. Bob, I don't know what I would do without you to tell me what I've already read over and over. You have taken this opportunity to simply restate all the negatives of this thread, and to misrepresent all of my statements, based on me saying Joe should have a loaner. It's not much different that a dealer who drops off a tractor for a few days for someone to try out on their properties. This is something you advocate frequently, so what's changed? Why are you now saying it's such a negative thing? Because it's convenient to your argument which is all wet!

( Nobody asked for an immediate fix. This has become a PUBLIC RELATIONS problem that is far bigger than a loader problem.)
This is so blatantly untrue so as to be funny. You yourself just said ( Kioti could have fixed this long ago, they seem reluctant to do that.)
Island tractor has said several times that he's made because the problem hasn't been taken care of. One only has to reread the posts to know that your statment is incorrect.
As for the public realtions problem, I doubt seriously that it would be nearly the problem it has become had non Kioti owners not come here to stir up all this ruckus.
You may say as many times as you want that you are objective, but the misstatements in this post alone are enough to show anyone that you are not.
This thread has become as non-productive as any I have ever seen. Isn't it amazing that a certain moderator, who has ended lesser controversies much sooner has chosen to allow this crap to continue.
John