New log book rules

[OkeeDon]

I, too, don't like to respond to a thread without any experience, unless I disclaim any experience, and I'm doing it to learn more.

So, right now, I admit that I have no experience, that I didn't really understand a lot of the jargon (what's an o'o?), that I thought I was pretty good at math but trucker's log books have always thrown me for a loop, and that my comments are for the purpose of learning.

Here are my perceptions. I understand the disdain that experienced drivers have for 90 day wonders, but exactly where are new drivers going to get the experience they need to get a better job if JB Hunt, Schneiders and others didin't employ them right out of school? My understanding is that the drivers accept the low wages, etc., in order to get that experience, then they move out from those companies. I always considered it a sort of apprenticeship. Of course, no experienced driver worth his salt would work for them.

Bird mentioned the Schneiders trucks moving at or below the speed limits; my understanding is that because they hire inexperienced drivers, not only are the trucks governed, but they already make extensive use of GPS locators to know where there trucks are, how fast they're moving, and whether the driver is cheating on his log book.

It would seem to me that any driver that "graduated" from that system will have learned good habits. I also suspect that the GPS locators are the wave of the future and will solve many, if not most, of these problems. Many truckers already use Nextel; most of the new Nextel phones (and many others) are GPS enabled; and there are dozens of management programs out there that will keep track of the trucks. It will be harder and harder to cheat the log book, and that seems to be a Good Thing.

As far as the new regulations, while I don't have any knowledge of the industry, it would seem logical to me that rather than putting 40,000 more trucks on the road, with the 40,000 new drivers that requires, it would make more sense to put the same investment into even more new drivers and use more driver teams. If the truck keeps moving, it might even result in fewer trucks. It seems a terrible waste to me that when a driver has downtime, the truck does, too. I've had freight take two weeks to reach me, when it should have taken 5 days, because the trucker ran into log book problems and the truck sat still.

That concept would seem to me to also improve the quality of drivers, because the team could take on the concept of pilot-copilot, with less experienced drivers paired with a master driver until they are ready to be a chief driver, themselves.

I realize this would probably be more difficult for independents (aren't there an awful lot of husband/wife teams out there already, though?).

 

[Gary_in_Indiana]

<font color="blue"> I don't want to sound crass, but you chose that profession. With any profession, comes responsibility. If you want to be successful and profit in any occupation, sometimes you must make sacrifices. </font>

Daryl,

I imagine this is in response to my reply to your complaints about trucking hours and income when I compared it to running a small trucking company in this marketplace. My point was simply to illustrate that the grass isn't so green on the ownership side, either. I stand squarely behind everything I said. The owner's hours are at least as long and he's on call 24/7. Add to that the fact that he has his capital at risk and it isn't the prettiest picture.

I run my own business because, all in all, I enjoy the heck out of it. I like being compensated for what I accomplish (and even the flip side of not being compensated when things don't go well). I like making my own decisions-good, bad or indifferent-and living with the results.

That having been said, the one thing I don't like is the implication or inference that mine or that of any owner/entrpreneur is the easy side of the street. Call it pride or vanity or whatever you like, but that's part of being me. When I hear something like that, my standard response is always that if things I do are so easy, do them better and put me out of business so you can make this 'easy money' you see me making. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[5030]

Don:

First off, Team drivers are fine for long haul, most drivers are "regional" or short haul, like me. I don't have a sleeper truck, I have a day cab.

An o'o is a owner operator.

Experience is the best teacher, but also a teacher of bad habits. When I started trucking at 18 (many years ago), you learned by the seat of your pants.

Basically, truck driving school is a place where you learn the laws and regulations so you can pass your CDL (certified dummies license). They also teach you how to fill out a log book. As far as complicated math on a log book, never. Any bozo can fill out a log book and recap his hours.

Actually, JB and Schneider do have some very experienced drivers with many years under their belts. Both JB and Schneider have break freight points and shuttle points and the local drivers they have are of high caliber. I don't know about Schneider, but JB pays their local drivers by the hour and the wage is good. They drive day cabs just like me. I know a couple of them.

You are right, you do have to start somewhere. Outfits like CR England, JB Hunt, Schneider, Marten, etc., all hire right out of driving school or have their own train as you earn programs. Problem is, those drivers also contribute the largest majority of accidents and damage claims. I deliver all around the State of Michigan including Metro Detroit, Grand Rapids, Lansing and Jackson. Most of the city work I do involves close quarters, blind side backing and off street deliveries. I have watched with amusement some of the "green" drivers try to back into places I go to every day. Sometimes, I get frustrated and back their outfits in for them.

Bird made the statement about JB and Schneider drivers running at or below the speed limit. Most of the large fleet carriers have instituted a "fuel bonus" program that gives the driver a few extra cents per mile if they achieve a certain average mpg. The company I work for could care less about fuel economy. You don't get good mileage when your are hauling around 85 to 102,000 pounds on the deck anyway. That takes a BIG motor. We don't have any unit in the fleet with less than 500 horsepower or 1750 pounds feet of torque. Our company opens the trucks up all the way, if the final drive ratio will allow 100+ mph. That's were it's set. It's the drivers discretion to control his speed, not the companies. My particular Western Star makes 525 horsepower @ 1750 lbs ft. It has a 3.70 final drive ratio and will top out at 102. I'd never go that fast anyway, but the company doesn't believe in castrating a truck. Again, driver discretion is the common denominator.

There have been "tattle tales" in trucks since the beginning of time. They were called Tachrographs. Now with GPS, companies do track drivers, but it's more of a concern about timely delivery than a drivers good or bad habits.

As far as a freight delivery, it probably had a lot to do with where in came from and where it went to (distance) and the time of week, more than anything else. Owner operators don't like to run on weekends. They like being home with their loved ones just like you do.

Again, team drivers are only good for long haul operations or really time sensitive freight. Short haul has no place in it for a team.

 

[Bird]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( Bird made the statement about JB and Schneider drivers running at or below the speed limit )</font>

Nope, Daryl, only Schneider. I've had lots of JB Hunt trucks go sailing by me.

 

[OkeeDon]

Daryl, thanks, I learned quite a bit.

The log book "math" I was talking about that throws me is trying to balance all the variables in order to make the best advantage out of it. I imagine some are better at it than others. Just thinking about it gives me a headache.

You're right; I was thinking more about long haul than local on the team concept. My experience with local delivery is limited to the daily pickup and delivery loads from terminals. Those fellows seem to work pretty "normal" hours and don't run into log book problems.

I really do understand the problems with backing up. When I was much younger, I was a receiver at a warehouse in downtown Pittsburgh where the dock was located in an alley with parking on both sides and about 1" clearance on either side of a truck. The dock was recessed in the building and nothing longer than a 40' trailer could negotiate the opening between the pillars (the building had been built in the '30s). I was amazed every day at the skill of the drivers, and really felt sympathy for the guys that couldn't do it. There were only two receiving docks and I was the only receiving employee. There were usually a couple of trucks waiting. The company definitely took advantage of the drivers; usually the waiting drivers would come in and help unload so the process would move faster. I think we were the most hated stop they made.

 

[5030]

Don:

When you unload a truck, that's called "lumping". Remember, truckers have their own language.

Here is a few examples:
Chicken House--state weigh scale
Full grown Bear--State Patrolman
Local Yokel--Sheriff or city cop
Polar Bear--Ohio State Patrolman in New White car
Beaver with a leaver--Gay person

I could write a dictionary of phrases and words, all original to trucking.

 

[Bird]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( truckers have their own language )</font>

Yep, last trip I made to Alaska (with my wife and brother along) was in March and we were wondering how bad the ice would be on the road going over Steamboat Mountain. When we stopped for fuel, my brother went in the coffee shop to ask some truckers who were headed the other direction. When he came back and told me and my wife that the driver said he came over "barefoot and screamin'" that wasn't exactly a lot of comfort to my wife who's been known to do a little screamin' herself when we go over mountain roads. That is until he explained that it meant he didn't have to stop and put the chains on and didn't even have to slow down. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

 

[5030]

Bird:

It's always good to keep the rubber side down and the shiny side up.......Hammer down!!

Remember, it's not fuel, it's motion lotion.

 

[Gary_in_Indiana]

FWIW, I talked with a friend of mine who's a partner in a refrigerated hauling outfit (all 53' reefers) and he said he's already planning on some changes for the Jan. 4 change. One is going to be an across the board 5% rate increase with an equivalent discount for payment received within thirty days to compensate for some of the increased costs they might encounter.

He was telling me that the toughest part of this is that they have no idea what, if any, cost increases there might be until it happens.

 

[lamarbur]

Sent this before and it didn't go for some reason, anyway, admittedly, I haven't owned or driven a tractor trailer unit since 91. I do go to a local restaurant (trucker type) twice a week, just to sit and listen to waht truckers say today. All of them regardless if they are company drivers, owner operators and two guys that own 10 or more rigs, every single one of them claim the new rules most likely will hurt the short haul/daily driver and help the long haul. Time will tell as all of them will have to work it out..