Old tractor front loader weird hydraulic connection

[woodier]

Hi all, I'm new here, in fact this is my very first post.

I have an old Shibaura SD2843T (equivalent to a Ford 1700/1900) and it has a front loader that looks like its connected hydraulically in a very weird way. It seems it goes through the 3 point hitch hydraulic, what I mean is that the front loader only starts working when the 3 point hitch is at its highest position, is this normal?

To aggravate my problem, the 3 point hitch sags, so my front loader always has to wait for the 3PH to raise fully before the loader starts working.

I wonder if there is another way to connect the loader, my tractor appears to have 2 hyd pumps (photo attached).

What do you guys think? Can I have the front loader operating independently from the 3 point hitch?

 

[LittleBill21]

looks similar to mine, one should be for power steering, my 3pt does not affect loader use though, not sure if that is normal, has it allways done this?

 

[ptsg]

The way it's setup now, is the easy and cheap way of doing it.

They basically used a port that is often used for dump trailers. Basically a single acting remote using the 3 pt lever.

To make it right, it's better to go straight from the pump, to the Pressure In of the valve. On the valve you'll need the Power Beyond sleeve for that valve in particular. This Power beyond sleeve will go on the N port of the valve, also called PB or C. An will go from this sleeve back to the 3 pt cylinder.

Finally, you'll run an hose from the Tank port of the valve to somewhere in the transmission housing. You'll have to find a plug or something that you can dump the fluid coming from the Tank port into the transmission. Some people use the Fill port for this.

EDIT: You'll also need to figure out which pump runs the 3 pt hitch. This is the pump you want to use. The other one must be for power steering.

 

[woodier]

Ouuh! Power steering? Didnt know it had that! Steering is very hard (almost impossible) when not moving. I can't find any power steering cylinder, seems to be come straight from steering wheel -> box -> long rod -> tractor wheel.

Anyway, the front loader has always done this (I'm relatively new to the tractor) and it has the electric over hydraulics that Shibaura thought was a good thing, a manual lever would have been a lot better.

So, you can have a plow on your 3pt plowing and operate your front loader?

 

[woodier]

The way it's setup now, is the easy and cheap way of doing it.

They basically used a port that is often used for dump trailers. Basically a single acting remote using the 3 pt lever.

To make it right, it's better to go straight from the pump, to the Pressure In of the valve. On the valve you'll need the Power Beyond sleeve for that valve in particular. This Power beyond sleeve will go on the N port of the valve, also called PB or C. An will go from this sleeve back to the 3 pt cylinder.

Finally, you'll run an hose from the Tank port of the valve to somewhere in the transmission housing. You'll have to find a plug or something that you can dump the fluid coming from the Tank port into the transmission. Some people use the Fill port for this.

EDIT: You'll also need to figure out which pump runs the 3 pt hitch. This is the pump you want to use. The other one must be for power steering.

Looks expensive, but likely the proper way to have this connected. Recon any hyd shop would be able to pull it off?

 

[ptsg]

Ouuh! Power steering? Didnt know it had that! Steering is very hard (almost impossible) when not moving. I can't find any power steering cylinder, seems to be come straight from steering wheel -> box -> long rod -> tractor wheel.

Anyway, the front loader has always done this (I'm relatively new to the tractor) and it has the electric over hydraulics that Shibaura thought was a good thing, a manual lever would have been a lot better.

So, you can have a plow on your 3pt plowing and operate your front loader?

Usually when a tractor has two hydraulic pumps, one of those runs the power steering.

Yes, once you fix that issue, you can run the loader at all times, regardless of what the 3 pt is doing.

 

[ptsg]

Looks expensive, but likely the proper way to have this connected. Recon any hyd shop would be able to pull it off?

Depends on your location but there plenty of hydraulic shops out there capable of doing it. Or even going through the dealer.

As far as price, I say about 100€ worth of hoses and fittings, give our take 20€.

 

[woodier]

Usually when a tractor has two hydraulic pumps, one of those runs the power steering.

Yes, once you fix that issue, you can run the loader at all times, regardless of what the 3 pt is doing.

One pump just for PAS? It feels like a very under utilized pump given that the other has to do so much more.

Either way will look around for the elusive PAS cylinder that I couldn't find anywhere thus far. Thanks.

 

[woodier]

Depends on your location but there plenty of hydraulic shops out there capable of doing it. Or even going through the dealer.

As far as price, I say about 100€ worth of hoses and fittings, give our take 20€.

When I first read your explanation, I was imagining 1000's like anything hydraulics. You seem to be base in Portugal, good to know. I'm in Portalegre district, do you know any reputable shop around here?

I still don't know if I'm keeping this tractor as the electrics over hydraulics aren't my favourite, maybe that can also be changed to a manual lever, what do you think?

 

[ptsg]

One pump just for PAS? It feels like a very under utilized pump given that the other has to do so much more.

Either way will look around for the elusive PAS cylinder that I couldn't find anywhere thus far. Thanks.

It's done that way because doing this way means you will always have power steering regardless if your using the loader, 3 pt or anything else. Basically makes a dedicated hydraulic system to the steering, only sharing the fluid. Some tractors also use it for the PTO clutch pack.

You may not have a cylinder for the cylinder. It may be done at the steering box. Not familiar with the model and very little info online, so can't really help you much.

When I first read your explanation, I was imagining 1000's like anything hydraulics. You seem to be base in Portugal, good to know. I'm in Portalegre district, do you know any reputable shop around here?

I still don't know if I'm keeping this tractor as the electrics over hydraulics aren't my favourite, maybe that can also be changed to a manual lever, what do you think?

I know the area more or less as I really enjoy that part of the country by I'm not familiar with hydraulic shops in particular. I'm sure there are a lot of tractor dealers though. I'm located more in the center and towards the coast, around Leiria.