Opinion on installing larger sliding door

[RichT]

Not directly a tractor matter, but would appreciate opinion. I have an existing 60" sliding door opening that I'd like to expand to next stud, 76". Attached pic shows upper corner of existing install. I see 2 options with regard to the expansion, replace the header or "extend" it with metal reinforcement and lag bolts. Replacement would necessitate more extensive wallboard removal.

What would you guys do?

 

[jamiec]

It looks as though the header of the slider is holding up that beam in the top left of the picture? Is that a beam that has floor joist on top if it? If that is carring the load of the brown beam then i would definatly replace it with a new header. Realy if it is holding up much weight at all i would replace the header, the only time i wouldnt is if its on a gable wall and not supporting much from above.

 

[RichT]

I should have mentioned that...it is NOT supporting the ceiling beams, or much else that I can see beyond structural integrity of the wall.

 

[ray66v]

Yah, don't 60" sliders suck! If your sure the header is not holding anything up I suppose a really creative steel sleeve, or plate(s) could work. It will never pass any inspection however.

I would take down the drywall and replace the header, (not a big deal).

In lieu of that, how about accessing the header from the outside? I often remove vinyl siding and make structural changes from the outside easier. It can also make fitting the new door to the siding easy. If you can remove the siding and outside sheathing, then remove the outer 1/2 of the header, (if there is a gap between the inside and outside this might not be difficult). Span the opening with a new 76" header on the outside, and splice the inside. Then add spacers between the half's and screw the outside and the inside half's together. Then screw the outer plywood sheathing to the opening. That would give you a fairly solid wall. You may also be able to pull the whole header out from the outside leaving the drywall fairly intact.

 

[RichT]

I understand replacing the header is the best option. Having said that I'm trying to minimize drywall work. Its a stucco house so accessing the header from the outside would require substantial stucco repair. I've added a pic which shows a notional brace arrangement - to attach a header wood extension. The long, center metal piece would extend a couple inches into the headers. This piece would be welded to the four 1/4 plate squares with at least one lag bolt on each plate.

 

[Superduper]

Most exterior openings are load bearing, whether they appear to be or not. The fact that the ceiling joists run parallel to the wall does not necessarily mean it is not load bearing, the roof might exert a load onto this wall. Even if it was not a load bearing wall, other factors need to be considered as well such as shear strength of wall. The shear strength keeps the wall (and home) from racking during earthquakes and heavy wind loads. If the shear strength of the wall is reduced below acceptable levels by the reduction of wall area, then additional special strong-wall panels need to be included into the design to ensure that sufficient shear strength remains.

Admittedly, if the wall has sufficient sheathing, it is not likely that the 16" expansion will reduce the shear strength enough to causing problems and require shoring so if we ignore that, then at the very minimum, you should replace the header with another of adequate size. Note that adequate might mean larger than your current header to account for the additional span and to account for new building codes which might be more restrictive than the code that existed when the home was built.

In short: presuming that there are no shear wall issues, then the only appropriate way to effect this retrofit is to replace the current header with a new one of an appropriate size for this installation. If you possess the skills to replace the header, then the wallboard issue should be relatively minor.

 

[ray66v]

Keep in mind, your going to be holding up the other 60" of header from that end. My "gut" feeling is you need more than that to make sure you don't get any sagging there.
Can you add a plate on the side with 1/8 steel, like 12 inches on each side of the splice and a lot of heavy drywall screws?

 

[Superduper]

It appears that you are located in Southern California, earthquake country. I highly suggest you resist the urge to retrofit the header in this manner. It really is an inappropriate method and will never pass inspection. I understand that stucco is never fun to work on. However, it might be possible for you to remove the existing header by running a long sawzall blade between the header and the exterior sheathing to cut the nails securing it to the sheathing. If there is no exterior sheathing and the stucco mesh is attached directly to the studs, then there is even more reason to do it properly. Should the installation ever fail and someone gets hurt, it could set you up for huge liability problems.

 

[ray66v]

It appears that you are located in Southern California, earthquake country.

Yikes! He has a good point there. If your worried about the drywall dust, it can be mitigated to the point that it is not a factor. I do "dustless" repairs. for people.

 

[RichT]

It appears that you are located in Southern California, earthquake country. I highly suggest you resist the urge to retrofit the header in this manner. It really is an inappropriate method and will never pass inspection. I understand that stucco is never fun to work on. However, it might be possible for you to remove the existing header by running a long sawzall blade between the header and the exterior sheathing to cut the nails securing it to the sheathing. If there is no exterior sheathing and the stucco mesh is attached directly to the studs, then there is even more reason to do it properly. Should the installation ever fail and someone gets hurt, it could set you up for huge liability problems.

Good points, thx. There is exterior sheathing, but I don't know how to tell if its structural or nonstructural (home was built in 1980). So I'll have to figure out how to cut between the studs (to remove)/header and sheathing. I definitely want to avoid having to cut the stucco/sheathing around the header, so I have to remove it from the inside.

My carpentry book says the existing 4x6 header is good to about 6ft. I don't have sufficient clearance to replace with a 4x8. Should I reinforce the 4x6 for a 76" span?