options for 0w-40 synthetic oil for new 4035?

[PHILIP8N]

We build compressors for Sibera with expeted temps -40F. We use John Deere 0w-40 in the engines, 540hp Cat C15 and 630hp Cat C18. I think you will be happy with the JD 0w-40. Philip.

 

[daman1]

Yeah, well ....... true enough ..... but then, unless I misunderstood the OP wasn't asking for a general oil recommendation for his heavy-duty Class 8 semi tractor ..... he was asking for 0w40 oil recommendation for a CUT .....


Yup ... newer ain't always better tho' ..... given a particular application.

CJ-4 oils were specifically formulated to meet compatibility requirements with particular emission devices (specifically diesel particulate filters) used on-road vehicles:

API CJ-4 Facts

In order to meet these compatibility requirements it appears some tradeoffs were made (despite what API and oil refiners/formulators might claim)

FWIW, M1 0w40 was the factory-fill from Mercedes on my OM 647 engine (2.7L, 154 HP) ........ and Mercedes approves it for use with extended drain intervals.

I suspect that if M1 0w40's soot dispersant capabilities were lacking, Mercedes would not be so inclined.

I do run extended drain intervals, which on average have ranged on average from 13K to 18K miles, although I have went much longer when I had the bypass filtration set up on it.

Personally, I currently have 345,000 miles on the vehicle using only this oil .... running in winter and summer conditions, ranging from south & west Texas (Laredo/El Paso), Arizona (Nogales, Tuscon, Phoenix) to Minnesota, Michigan (UP & LP), Ontario (as far up as Sudbury), and Quebec ..... operating in temps approaching 120 degrees F in the summer, and -25 below zero F in the winter ..... and have a number of friends, doing the same thing, with the same vehicle/motor/oil ..... with vehicle mileages ranging from 400K to over 800K ..... on original engines .....

My Blackstone UOA's speak for themselves, in terms of the performance of the product - note that the mileage on the current oil sump, as of the time of the following oil analysis, is 47,625 miles. Make up oil reported is cumulative (6.75 total quarts used over 47K+ miles):

Your missing the point i'm trying to make here, with out getting into it too much soot is a by product of combustion,tiny wear particles a CJ-4 oil suspends it(dispersant)better then any oil in the past so your filter has a better chance of removing it and keeping it away from vital parts that older spec of the M1 will not handle it like currant API oil will,doesn't matter if it's a 500hp CAT or 20 hp compact soot is soot you do not want it in your engine but there's no getting away from it so you want an oil that will handle it.


but hey to each is his own carry on! :thumbsup:

 

[5030]

and you both missed the point. Point is, tractors, gas or diesel, other than having an engine as motive power, have little in common with an on road engine. On road engines operate at a wide range of RPM and a wide range of loading that changes constantly. Tractors operate (if the operator has any sense at PTO rated rpm and the load may vary but the range of operation is much narrower.

Oil related threads remind me of political threads. Everyone has an opinion but most require extreme distillation to reach a plausable conclusion.

 

[rswyan]

Transit said to break engine in first but then I see many autos come with synthetic.

It probably depends on what the manufacturer recommends - in the case of my MB diesel in the van, it came with M1 0w40 synthetic from the factory .... but Cummins recommends no synthetic for the ISB in my RAM pickup until the engine is broken in ......

As I recall, it was because using synthetic oil will/could delay break-in ...

(FWIW, the little MB diesel in the van didn't seem like it was broken-in until it had about 100K miles on it :laughing

For the RAM, I'll wait until it has 20K miles on it before I make the switch to synthetic.

Is it old school or do I need to break it in with the OEM oil.

I dunno about OEM oil .... maybe just OEM-approved/recommended conventional oil.

Personally, I'd ask your dealer for the manufacturer's recommendation .... absent any info one way or another, I'd probably wait to switch to synthetic.

 

[rswyan]

Your missing the point i'm trying to make here,

No, I don't think so .... I "get it" ..... I'm just kinda ignoring it



It is a valid point ..... but ......

without getting into it too much soot is a by product of combustion, tiny wear particles a CJ-4 oil suspends it (dispersant) better then any oil in the past so your filter has a better chance of removing it and keeping it away from vital parts that older spec of the M1 will not handle it like currant API oil will, doesn't matter if it's a 500hp CAT or 20 hp compact soot is soot you do not want it in your engine but there's no getting away from it so you want an oil that will handle it.

Is that something you are stating based on an inside knowledge of Mobil's blending practices and oil formulations ...... or just an assumption based on it's API letter rating ?

Please keep in mind I'm running a vehicle with a heavily EGR'ed engine (up to 35% EGR, but no DPF) ..... a 50 state engine .... I have no shortage of soot here.

I've spent my time on BITOG too .... I do know and understand what the deal is with soot

Could be that the OP is buying a tractor that has the necessary emissions equipment that will require him to run a CJ-4 oil .... dunno.

Supposedly it is an EPA Tier IV engine .... EGR ? .... DPF ?

but hey to each is his own carry on!

Thanks - I will

Here's the deal - there are a variety of attributes in an add package that play into how a motor oil will perform. Dispersants are one of them - but they ain't the only one.

I can tell ya this tho' - I've seen UOA's from a friend's (newer) Sprinter that must use the newer oil specs due to the presence of emissions equipment (EGR/DPF) .... at 10K miles his oil is toast .... done .... fini .... game over ...

..... while I'm at 14 to 18K miles using the older CF-rated M1 0w40 .... and Blackstone is telling me I'm good to go for at least a few thousand more.

As to whether the oil I'm using is doing it's job, consider this: I currently have 345K+ miles on the clock with this oil - figuring a 50 mph average speed, that equates to around 6900 hours of operation using this oil.

In reality, it's considerably higher than that - because I idle the truck quite a bit, particularly in the summer (recharging a house battery bank and trying to stay cool while living inside a tin can, in triple digit temps) - and that never shows up on the clock.

Have a look at the comments section on the attached UOA's with regards to apparent condition of the engine - the oil is clearly doing it's job - and doing it well.

 

[rswyan]

and you both missed the point.

Ya think ?

I'm thinking you might be missing one yourself ..... based on your preconceived idea of how an onroad engine might be operated .....

I drive OTR .... typically for pretty long distances .... mostly all interstate. My average trip length is generally over 500 miles .... and quite often the trip length is much longer .... 800, 1000, 1200, 1500 miles .... or more....

My vehicle has an average range of around 500 to 650 miles on a tank of fuel. At 60 mph (my typical driving speed), with the cruise on, that's about 8, 9 or 10 straight hours of operation ...... at a fairly fixed rpm.

Since I'm under 10K and am not driving a CMV, I'm not subject to DOT regs as far as logging and scaling, or HOS .... and since I more often than not deliver time-critical, emergency freight, many of the runs are straight thru, direct ...

More often than not, my engine sees exactly the kind of operation you attribute to tractors - long periods of sustained operation at a fairly fixed rpm, with load varying according to the terrain I'm running.

Point is, tractors, gas or diesel, other than having an engine as motive power, have little in common with an on road engine.

..... little in common .... ?

Heheheh .... ya really might wanna contemplate that statement for a bit :confused2: ..... because from my vantage point they have have more in common .... than what they don't ...

On road engines operate at a wide range of RPM and a wide range of loading that changes constantly.

Sure .... some of them ..... even most of them .... do ..... but not all

Lose the city driving aspect ..... and then how does it seem ?

Tractors operate (if the operator has any sense) at PTO rated rpm and the load may vary but the range of operation is much narrower.

.... really ?

Well, clearly that's not necessarily the case (narrower range of operation) with vehicles which are driven OTR long distance.

On the sense aspect of it, I'd venture to say that there are quite a few folks here on TBN, that according to your definition (operating at PTO rpm) lack any sense .... me among them :laughing:

From my perspective, it seems to me that the sensible thing to do is to operate a tractor (or any engine for that matter) ...... at the rpm appropriate for the task .... taking into account the proper speed required for the operation of the implement being driven ...... and the horsepower required to power it ......

I understand where you are coming from ..... and considering the totality of all vehicles on the road it's "true" ..... in a general sense ... but not in an absolute one

Oil related threads remind me of political threads. Everyone has an opinion but most require extreme distillation to reach a plausable conclusion.

Indeed ....

 

[sw03]

Threads on TBN never end!! Throw in your own oil you want and drive it. The engine will not blow up and wow, you will have higher then normal wear or fuel for XX miles using a synthetic oil for some miles.

Been on here since 02 (not this logon) and the same issues and the world will end.....amazing...

 

[DMW]

Esso XD-3 Extra 0W-40. Good for year round use, your diesel will gel before you get below its temperature rating. I've only been able to get it from a lubricant distributor, no stores carry it on the shelf around here.
http://www.esso.ca/Canada-English/Files/Products_Lubes/IOCAENCVLESEsso_Xd-3_extra.pdf

 

[dmccarty]

It is time for me to change fluids and filters in the truck and tractor so I ordered some JD 0Wx40 oil. It has gone up a w ee bit in price since the last time I bought a five gallon bucket. The last bucket was $100....

This bucket is $175! :confused2: I ordered it and I might be crazy. The price was the same or a bit cheap than other 0Wx40 oil and Shell 5Wx40 oil was only a bit cheaper. The last bucket I ordered was cheaper than Shell.

At this price I think it will be my last bucket of JD but we shall see.

Just throwing that price out so people can compare.

Later,
Dan

 

[daman1]

No, I don't think so .... I "get it" ..... I'm just kinda ignoring it



It is a valid point ..... but ......


Is that something you are stating based on an inside knowledge of Mobil's blending practices and oil formulations ...... or just an assumption based on it's API letter rating ?

Please keep in mind I'm running a vehicle with a heavily EGR'ed engine (up to 35% EGR, but no DPF) ..... a 50 state engine .... I have no shortage of soot here.

I've spent my time on BITOG too .... I do know and understand what the deal is with soot

Could be that the OP is buying a tractor that has the necessary emissions equipment that will require him to run a CJ-4 oil .... dunno.

Supposedly it is an EPA Tier IV engine .... EGR ? .... DPF ?


Thanks - I will

Here's the deal - there are a variety of attributes in an add package that play into how a motor oil will perform. Dispersants are one of them - but they ain't the only one.

I can tell ya this tho' - I've seen UOA's from a friend's (newer) Sprinter that must use the newer oil specs due to the presence of emissions equipment (EGR/DPF) .... at 10K miles his oil is toast .... done .... fini .... game over ...

..... while I'm at 14 to 18K miles using the older CF-rated M1 0w40 .... and Blackstone is telling me I'm good to go for at least a few thousand more.

As to whether the oil I'm using is doing it's job, consider this: I currently have 345K+ miles on the clock with this oil - figuring a 50 mph average speed, that equates to around 6900 hours of operation using this oil.

In reality, it's considerably higher than that - because I idle the truck quite a bit, particularly in the summer (recharging a house battery bank and trying to stay cool while living inside a tin can, in triple digit temps) - and that never shows up on the clock.

Have a look at the comments section on the attached UOA's with regards to apparent condition of the engine - the oil is clearly doing it's job - and doing it well.

Running a bypass filter set up makes all the difference,happen to have one with out it listing soot levels and wear metals? for the same type intervals?

and it's still going to be application dependent a little 2.7 MB engine is allot easer on any oil then say a highway truck or off road heavy equipment engine, sure as heck wouldn't put that oil in our 600hp C18's or our 550 hp N14,ISX Cummings.