Our barn build

[deezler]

Also, our clay does drain. Slower than sand, for sure, but it does drain.

Let's revisit this thread in 25 to 30 years, and we'll see what happened.

You'll be totally fine. If you have the drainage around the building flowing well away (roof overhang/gutters/downspouts/slopes away from building on all sides), then your posts will be dry all the time anyway. Even if one oddball post does rot at ground level, it's not like the building will be in any jeopardy. 100+ years no problem, would be my bet.

 

[rbstern]

Project is progressing. Skirts, girts, some side roof plates are up, and and getting started on side shed rafters. The wife and I are having a lot of fun doing this, despite our middle-aged aches and pains.

Some random thoughts about the build and process:

Structural screws rock. So much easier than thru-drilling and bolting. Brushless 18v drivers (Ryobi) are awesome for driving big structural screws. What a great way to build.

Was sure I would buy a nail gun for this project. Didn't get around to it, and I've been hammering 16D galv. ring shank common nails, and while it's a chore, it's a long time since using a hammer this much. I'm enjoying it.

We've substituted 2x8 lumber for 2x6 in a bunch of places. For reasons that only the marketplace gods understand, the larger boards are about 25% less expensive.

Ratchet straps have been essential for squaring up the dimensions, higher on the posts.

We've been using a pallet on the LS FEL w/ forks as a work platform when our ladders leave us feeling vertically challenged. It's worked great.

 

[rbstern]

Next questions: The concrete.

Based on an online calculator, a 5" slab for this 36x36 structure is going to be right at 20 cubic yards. My plan is to reinforce the skirts with hammered-in rebar around the perimeter, and then have the mixer truck access the bays from the front, where there is plenty of clearance. We have no overhead obstruction in the center bay until the loft joists go in. The side sheds have rafters sloped from 9.5' to 12.5'. No idea what kind of clearance a mixer truck needs.

My plan is to pour right on the dirt, with fiber reinforced cement, I assume 3000 to 4000psi, but I haven't talked to a concrete company yet.

Should I recess the dirt a few inches at the front of the building to create an edge ramp?

What else do I need to think about?

 

[ovrszd]

Great progress!!!

In regards to concrete, there are a LOT of options. The final method is down to personal preferences.

Regardless how good your dirt guy was, your pad is going to have areas where it settles more than others. When that happens it is imperative that the concrete be stable.

For that reason I would never consider pouring concrete without rebar. At the most 24" squares. Elevated and sitting on chairs. And add the edge ramp at the doorways.

I prefer to pour on gravel. But it's too late on this project.

Looking forward to pics and progress!!!

 

[MossRoad]

Nice project.

In regards to pouring the pad, are you doing that yourself, have you ever done flat work before, and/or are you going to have knowledgeable and adequate people there to help you?

We put up a 24x24 garage addition two summers ago. I did it in three 8' x 24' pours because there was no way I and my family could do a 24x24 area in one pour. 8' x 24' at a time was just right for us.

Good luck with the project.

 

[rbstern]

Great progress!!!

In regards to concrete, there are a LOT of options. The final method is down to personal preferences.

Regardless how good your dirt guy was, your pad is going to have areas where it settles more than others. When that happens it is imperative that the concrete be stable.

For that reason I would never consider pouring concrete without rebar. At the most 24" squares. Elevated and sitting on chairs. And add the edge ramp at the doorways.

I prefer to pour on gravel. But it's too late on this project.

Looking forward to pics and progress!!!

Regarding stability: I've watched two pours with fiber mesh on this property, by two different, experienced concrete companies, that were done directly on dirt.

A 6' wide walkway, about 150 feet long, poured in 2011. Foot traffic, golf cart traffic, and maybe a couple of times a year, 2000 to 3000lb. tractors. That walkway is still perfect; it still has no visible cracks. It was dug by hand, formed, and poured in a day.

Our driveway, poured in 2018, on a clay pad prepped by the same grader who did the new barn site. That driveway is routinely parked on by vehicles weighing as much as 6000lbs, and also sees some tractor traffic. Has a couple of small, hairline cracks at this point. Nothing that would indicate a problem with the dirt below.

Hence my confidence in the soil/fiber mesh combo. Anticipated weight on the barn floor expected to be no different than the driveway. I don't have a problem doing rebar or wire mesh, but I see these previous fiber mesh projects as having worked extremely well. One of the advantages we have is a very shallow frost line. Ground freezes aren't very common and don't heave very much, if at all.

EDIT to add: I just remembered I did a 10x20 pad under my shooting bench with the excess from the driveway pour. Also on dirt. Foot traffic only. No cracking after 4.5 years. Not a great test because it doesn't bear much weight, but the ground underneath hasn't moved, either.

 

[rbstern]

Nice project.

In regards to pouring the pad, are you doing that yourself, have you ever done flat work before, and/or are you going to have knowledgeable and adequate people there to help you?

We put up a 24x24 garage addition two summers ago. I did it in three 8' x 24' pours because there was no way I and my family could do a 24x24 area in one pour. 8' x 24' at a time was just right for us.

Good luck with the project.

Thank you.

Haven't done flat work on this scale. Largest I've done was a 10x20 pad.

My plan is to call in all of my neighborhood labor I.O.U.s That should net me 2 or 3 strong bodies, along with 3 family members.

 

[gstrom99]

Next questions: The concrete.

Based on an online calculator, a 5" slab for this 36x36 structure is going to be right at 20 cubic yards. My plan is to reinforce the skirts with hammered-in rebar around the perimeter, and then have the mixer truck access the bays from the front, where there is plenty of clearance. We have no overhead obstruction in the center bay until the loft joists go in. The side sheds have rafters sloped from 9.5' to 12.5'. No idea what kind of clearance a mixer truck needs.

My plan is to pour right on the dirt, with fiber reinforced cement, I assume 3000 to 4000psi, but I haven't talked to a concrete company yet.

Standard concrete truck is 12 feet tall. Check with the company, to be sure. 4000psi is standard here, fiber reinforcement, not so much.

 

[Jrasband]

What length post did you use, and what was your method for setting them? I am getting ready to do a barn build and am putting 20' post in the ground and am wondering if I should make a boom pole for the front end loader to set the post. My tractor bucket will go 13' off the ground on it's own.

 

[rbstern]

What length post did you use, and what was your method for setting them? I am getting ready to do a barn build and am putting 20' post in the ground and am wondering if I should make a boom pole for the front end loader to set the post. My tractor bucket will go 13' off the ground on it's own.

8 20' posts and 8 18' posts. Dug a 4' deep hole with my tractor backhoe, set the post atop 6" of compacted, dry poured concrete, then wet set them with 5 80lb bags of mixed Sakrete. Vibrated the concrete for uniformity. Backfilled after concrete set (usually next day) with crush-n-run.

As far as placing the poles: Set them down alongside the hole, with one end over the hole, then hand hoisted them (me, wife, sometimes with my son). One of us would hold to keep stable while the other would brace the posts. We'd then reset our layout strings and move the post in the hole with a sledgehammer, and used a post level to get the post plumb. Not hard to do with two physically capable adults. We did some on a windy day, and that was a little bit adventurous.

Before all of that, I spent a sleepless night concocting a pallet fork-and-chains method for the hoisting. But we set the first one by hand, didn't have too much trouble doing it, and decided to skip the tractor, so I never got around to actually using the tractor for that task.

I have no doubt, as long as you have a reasonable method for lassoing the post to your bucket, you can lift them that way.