Pickups and Legal Trailer Weight Limits

[RandyT]

If you're like many (most ?) people who are confused on this matter, probably the first word you might want to clear up is this one:

com•mer•cial/kəˈmərSHəl/
adjective
concerned with or engaged in commerce.

Now let me explain a gotcha moment. My nephew has a F250 with a 9,200 GVWR. In IL you have two options for plates on a pickup one is a Class B truck plate with a 8,000 pound limit, but take into account that the truck with driver and passenger weighs around 7,200 which only allows for a payload of 800 pounds. The other option is the Class D truck plate which is a 12,000 limit plate. Now the gotcha is in IL the 12,000 plate is a commercial plate. So by putting the D plate on the truck you are now licensed for commerce, and per the court ignorance of the law is no excuse.

 

[jim_wilson]

Thanks for all the answers. I think that clears it up. I did remember from reading thru this thread (and others) a few years back - that you can get in trouble for having a rig that is *capable* of being loaded over the 26,000 pound limit - and not just because you actually *are* over the limit.

It was that 10,000 pound trailer thing that seemed confusing to me.

I started thinking about this again - because I'm considering converting my Suburban over to Duramax diesel power - and upgrading the rear axle and suspension, and adding a heavier duty hitch. This is a relatively common conversion, the Duramax/Allison drivetrain from a 2500 or 3500 Silverado is used and swapped in place of the gas engine. There's a number of guys out there who have done this and are towing 12-14,000 pound travel trailers around with them on long trips. By all reports - it's a great combination.

The usage that would be at the top of the list for using a truck with this capability - would likely be for pulling a dump trailer locally. So that got me thinking: how big of a trailer could I tow with it - and still be legal?

On a related subject: Does anybody know what is considered when the enforcing authorities look at how a truck is loaded? In other words, each truck has a GVWR - and a published tow rating (somewhere). The aftermarket hitch manufacturers make hitches that seem to exceed the published tow ratings of the vehicles they can be installed on. It is my understanding that things like rear axles also have ratings on the axle itself. I'm sure the engine and transmission are also "rated" by the manufacturer as to what they think they can reasonably tow - and not blow up while still in warranty.

So what happens when you upgrade a truck and increase it's capacity? Using my prior Suburban example, If I put a diesel drivetrain in it , upgrade the rear axle - and put a 14,000 pound rated hitch on the back - the only piece of the puzzle that keeps the truck from having the capability of a 3500 series Silverado - is potentially the frame. And it's my understanding that the frame in the 2500 and 3500 series Chevy Silverados - is the same frame. The 2500 Suburban has a GVWR of 8600 pounds , the 2500 Silverado has a GVWR of 9200 pounds - and my understanding is that the difference comes from the fact that the Suburban is just a heavier vehicle - so it loses some weight carrying capacity. A 3500 series Silverado has a GVWR of 11,400 if I remember correctly.

In other words - Suburban 2500 and Silverado 2500 should have equally strong frames - which should by extension mean the Suburban frame is capable of carrying a 3500 rated load.

But even if all that work is done - the decal on the door still says the truck has a GVWR of 8600 pounds - even though the truck now has all the components of a 11,400 rated vehicle.

Which wins when the inspector looks at it - the decal - or the components?

 

[terryknight]

If you're like many (most ?) people who are confused on this matter, probably the first word you might want to clear up is this one:

com瀕erè‹—ial/kəˈmərSHəl/
adjective
concerned with or engaged in commerce.

to help you out. federal law says (can't speak for state level. i hope the links work)

Regulations Section | Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (i bolded the important word. section 383.5 definitions)

Commercial motor vehicle (CMV) means a motor vehicle or combination of motor vehicles used in commerce to transport passengers or property if the motor vehicle

Commerce means (a) any trade, traffic or transportation within the jurisdiction of the United States between a place in a State and a place outside of such State, including a place outside of the United States and (b) trade, traffic, and transportation in the United States which affects any trade, traffic, and transportation described in paragraph (a) of this definition.

Your example would be 29,999 pounds which is over 26,001 therefore CDL required. But since the trailer is under 10,000 that would make it a class B CDL instead of CDL A.

no true. you can run over the 26001 combined vehicle weight (at least federally, can't speak for all states) IF the truck GVWR is under 26000 lbs AND the trailer GVWR is under 10000

Regulations Section | Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration (section 383.91 Commercial motor vehicle groups)

(1) Combination vehicle (Group A)輸ny combination of vehicles with a gross combination weight rating (GCWR) of 11,794 kilograms or more (26,001 pounds or more) provided the GVWR of the vehicle(s) being towed is in excess of 4,536 kilograms (10,000 pounds).

(2) Heavy Straight Vehicle (Group B)輸ny single vehicle with a GVWR of 11,794 kilograms or more (26,001 pounds or more), or any such vehicle towing a vehicle not in excess of 4,536 kilograms (10,000 pounds) GVWR.

1 is class A license combined >26000 LBS where the trailer (towed vehicle) has a GVWR >10000 lbs

2 is class B license vehicle with a GVWR of >26000 LBS OR a vehicle with a GVWR >26000 towing a trailer (towed vehicle) with a GVWR <10000 lbs

so the example used of a 20000 lb truck falls under the GVWR of 26000, used in 2 (class B) and the trailer falls under the GVWR of 10000, used in 2 (class B)

i used to think the way you do, but have been corrected

 

[terryknight]

On a related subject: Does anybody know what is considered when the enforcing authorities look at how a truck is loaded? In other words, each truck has a GVWR - and a published tow rating (somewhere). The aftermarket hitch manufacturers make hitches that seem to exceed the published tow ratings of the vehicles they can be installed on. It is my understanding that things like rear axles also have ratings on the axle itself. I'm sure the engine and transmission are also "rated" by the manufacturer as to what they think they can reasonably tow - and not blow up while still in warranty.

So what happens when you upgrade a truck and increase it's capacity? Using my prior Suburban example, If I put a diesel drivetrain in it , upgrade the rear axle - and put a 14,000 pound rated hitch on the back - the only piece of the puzzle that keeps the truck from having the capability of a 3500 series Silverado - is potentially the frame. And it's my understanding that the frame in the 2500 and 3500 series Chevy Silverados - is the same frame. The 2500 Suburban has a GVWR of 8600 pounds , the 2500 Silverado has a GVWR of 9200 pounds - and my understanding is that the difference comes from the fact that the Suburban is just a heavier vehicle - so it loses some weight carrying capacity. A 3500 series Silverado has a GVWR of 11,400 if I remember correctly.

In other words - Suburban 2500 and Silverado 2500 should have equally strong frames - which should by extension mean the Suburban frame is capable of carrying a 3500 rated load.

But even if all that work is done - the decal on the door still says the truck has a GVWR of 8600 pounds - even though the truck now has all the components of a 11,400 rated vehicle.

Which wins when the inspector looks at it - the decal - or the components?

call your state easiest way to get the answers. around here (MD) care around your plated weight, your axle ratings, and your tire ratings, along with proper paperwork and safety equipment. they don't seem to care about what door stickers say.

 

[jim_wilson]

call your state easiest way to get the answers. around here (MD) care around your plated weight, your axle ratings, and your tire ratings, along with proper paperwork and safety equipment. they don't seem to care about what door stickers say.

Thanks. The plated weight would pretty much match what was on the door sticker - unless the vehicle was inspected by the DOT or something like that - and the registration was changed. Thanks for mentioning that - I forgot that the weight rating was on the registration.

 

[Happy Gilmore]

Your example would be 29,999 pounds which is over 26,001 therefore CDL required. But since the trailer is under 10,000 that would make it a class B CDL instead of CDL A.

You are incorrect Randy

 

[RandyT]

Terry, went back and read the standards and it appears you are correct. It does say single vehicle over 26,0001 pounds. I thinks the confusion starts with the Class B and some states used to have it worded and/or.

 

[oliver1555]

Thanks. The plated weight would pretty much match what was on the door sticker - unless the vehicle was inspected by the DOT or something like that - and the registration was changed. Thanks for mentioning that - I forgot that the weight rating was on the registration.

Your plated weight has nothing to do with the door sticker. I have in the past plated my Dodge CTD for 26,000#. It's currently plated for 18,000# because that's all I need. Plated weight is all about revenue.

 

[Diamondpilot]

If you're like many (most ?) people who are confused on this matter, probably the first word you might want to clear up is this one:

com•mer•cial/kəˈmərSHəl/
adjective
concerned with or engaged in commerce.

Correct. My company has about 300 vehicles on the road. We have 3 full time guys who just maintain records, drivers info, ect.

I had dinner last Thursday with the department head. I asked him detailed questions. Long story short is if it's not for hire, IE: personal stuff with no pay involved you need nothing.

Chris

 

[Btown]

Sorry to re-open a really old thread - but it seems to make more sense than to start an entirely new one. I'm a bit confused by some of the wording of the requirements of my state for needing a CDL: Massachusetts Commercial Drivers License Rules | DrivingLaws.org So I'm reading this to mean that as long as my tow vehicle and trailer combination are not over 26,000 pounds - then no CDL is required, but if the trailer is over 10,000 pounds load rating - then a CDL is required - irregardless of what the combined weight of the tow vehicle and trailer are. It seems a bit confusing - because (as an example) my 2003 Chevy Suburban is rated for 12,000 pounds tow with a 8.1L engine. The truck weighs in the 6500-7000 pound range empty. Loaded - it could weigh 9000 or so. Even with that - and a trailer weighing 12,000 pounds behind it, it's still not up at the 26k limit. Am I correct on that?

First off are you using it for commercial purposes? If not in MA you can be over 26,001 with no CDL. If it is for commercial use than the combo of vehicle and trailer, over 26,000 would need class A. Single vehicle over 26,000 lbs needs class B. The confusing part for most is the trailer weight of over 10,000 this only comes into affect for a class B vehicle towing a trailer. If trailer is rated at 9,900 lbs being towed by a vehicle with a gvw of 40,000. Class B license is good. If that same vehicle is towing a trailer rated for 10,000 lbs then Class A license is needed. Then there is the whole Farm use exemption. Hope this helps.