Piranha tooth bar!!!

[JOHNTHOMAS]

You need rear weight any time you are using the FEL on a tractor. I've done work with my FEL with out weight but with counter weight the FEL/tractor will do so much better and is much safer in many applications.
These Kubota Sub compact and compact tractors will usually lose traction before they run out of power.
A boxblade is a very useful implement for many different jobs and a heavy one can/will add the weight you need for the rear. Weight can be set on top of them also if more weight is needed. Sakrete comes in 50 and 80 lb bags for cheap and probably real cheap if the bag gets wet, which is what you want, at the building supply. They'd probably give it to you to get rid of it.

 

[workinallthetime]

All that and no pictures??!

---------- warning this post has nothing to do with the Piranaha tooth bar----------------:confused2:
here is the one built, the length of the teeth helps in almost every situation. The only down side of the length is the weight is now transfered past the cutting edge when picking up heavy items.

 

[deezler]

I'm glad most folks are happy with their piranha tooth bars, but from a physics perspective, they will obviously be somewhat of a compromise for digging (vs a traditional tooth bar).

The ability to pierce undisturbed soil is a function of contact pressure. Traditional tooth bars, having just 5 to 8 teeth, concentrate the entire force of your loader/tractor onto a very small total area. Once the teeth penetrate the soil, it easily fractures the ground into clumps. The long reach of the shank tips past the bucket edge keeps the contact pressure with new undisturbed soil high as your plow forward.

The piranha has a much longer cutting edge, and thus less contact pressure with the soil. In addition, the short reach means you may engage most of the edge at one time when trying to cut forward. The serrated edge is what helps it work better vs. a smooth bucket edge though. Make sure you are pointing the tips into the soil when trying to get started digging.

 

[BXpanded]

I'm glad most folks are happy with their piranha tooth bars, but from a physics perspective, they will obviously be somewhat of a compromise for digging (vs a traditional tooth bar).

The ability to pierce undisturbed soil is a function of contact pressure. Traditional tooth bars, having just 5 to 8 teeth, concentrate the entire force of your loader/tractor onto a very small total area. Once the teeth penetrate the soil, it easily fractures the ground into clumps. The long reach of the shank tips past the bucket edge keeps the contact pressure with new undisturbed soil high as your plow forward.

The piranha has a much longer cutting edge, and thus less contact pressure with the soil. In addition, the short reach means you may engage most of the edge at one time when trying to cut forward. The serrated edge is what helps it work better vs. a smooth bucket edge though. Make sure you are pointing the tips into the soil when trying to get started digging.

Deezler. Your point is well taken that the ability to penetrate the ground is (somewhat, not the only factor) relative to the contact area. The large teeth on the Piranha serve the major function of penetrating and disturbing the earth. You probably don't realize that the teeth are slightly narrower than the traditional teeth, making the actual contact area of the 8 teeth on the Piranha roughly the same area as 6 conventional teeth. BTW, That was not an accident.

The teeth on a conventional bar are spaced pretty far apart. Any dirt not broken in the area between the teeth, now hits the straight edge of the bucket. The small, sharp teeth on the Piranha penetrate this dirt and fracture it as well. Of particular note, any area with roots, etc. is much more easily cut. One of the many test prototypes actually had the small teeth omitted. Another had longer teeth. Longer teeth significantly reduce breakout force (important when clearing brush) as well as made it more difficult to cut level grade. We used the combinations that gave us the best overall results in building an effective and versatile attachment. The Piranha does much more than just dig.

It was immediately obvious, is that any tooth bar drastically improves the loader's digging performance. Also obvious, the ground being manipulated and the operator's technique made far more difference in digging than did the type of tooth bar.

Cheers!
Harry

 

[newbury]

Trying not to hijack the thread but get more info I think many of us would like -

Harry - Many of us have clamp on tooth bars. I've seem to remember at least one poster (don't know where the post is) who successfully installed a set of clamp-on's over a Pirahna.

How difficult would it be for someone with tools like a 4 1/2" handheld grinder

to cut off a couple of the small teeth of their choosing for a custom spacing of the clamp-ons?

Basically how hard is the metal?

/edit -
And to anyone - How well do you think the Pirahna would work for digging up bamboo "stumps"?

My present bamboo clearing method is to trim them down to 2" high then back over them with a 5' rototiller. I can't drive over them for fear of puncturing tires.

 

[BXpanded]

Trying not to hijack the thread but get more info I think many of us would like -

Harry - Many of us have clamp on tooth bars. I've seem to remember at least one poster (don't know where the post is) who successfully installed a set of clamp-on's over a Pirahna.

How difficult would it be for someone with tools like a 4 1/2" handheld grinder

to cut off a couple of the small teeth of their choosing for a custom spacing of the clamp-ons?

Basically how hard is the metal?

/edit -
And to anyone - How well do you think the Pirahna would work for digging up bamboo "stumps"?

My present bamboo clearing method is to trim them down to 2" high then back over them with a 5' rototiller. I can't drive over them for fear of puncturing tires.

I'm guessing you mean clamp on forks... Some of the clamp-ons will work as is. We haven't researched that, of course. You can cut it with a grinder if you use a thin cutting disc. Just take your time. Keep in mind it comes off in a minute or less. Just 2 bolts.
There was a post on TBN about someone that was using a Piranha to clear bamboo. Said it "went through it like a chainsaw" if I remember correctly.

 

[workinallthetime]

Deezler. Your point is well taken that the ability to penetrate the ground is (somewhat, not the only factor) relative to the contact area. The large teeth on the Piranha serve the major function of penetrating and disturbing the earth. You probably don't realize that the teeth are slightly narrower than the traditional teeth, making the actual contact area of the 8 teeth on the Piranha roughly the same area as 6 conventional teeth. BTW, That was not an accident.

The teeth on a conventional bar are spaced pretty far apart. Any dirt not broken in the area between the teeth, now hits the straight edge of the bucket. The small, sharp teeth on the Piranha penetrate this dirt and fracture it as well. Of particular note, any area with roots, etc. is much more easily cut. One of the many test prototypes actually had the small teeth omitted. Another had longer teeth. Longer teeth significantly reduce breakout force (important when clearing brush) as well as made it more difficult to cut level grade. We used the combinations that gave us the best overall results in building an effective and versatile attachment. The Piranha does much more than just dig.

It was immediately obvious, is that any tooth bar drastically improves the loader's digging performance. Also obvious, the ground being manipulated and the operator's technique made far more difference in digging than did the type of tooth bar.

Cheers!
Harry

i might be interested in one that would fit over the teeth on a backhoe, maybe 24" long. i currently use a 24" blade over the teeth when needed. this is a great way to cut sod and do finish work after digging a trench. i do belive some people call them squeegies, i have also seen big hoe's use a 6" piece of pipe with holes cut in it for the teeth to go through. in addition the design should have "wings" at each end to assist in capture of the material

 

[Maestro71]

Ok with the cutter on the back for weight it was much easier. Thanks all. It digs well now, it sucks that I can't get my brush forks on though.

 

[nessmuk53]

I am likely going to order one for my BX1500 Monday. Does one model fit all BX buckets? I have a LA181 with what the specs say is a 48" bucket. The inside dimension is 46 5/16". The owners manual shows the same dimensions for the LA211, all 48".
I will get a definitive answer Monday when I call them, but was just wondering if it is a stock size fits all BX buckets or if I am going to need a custom size for the little LA181.

 

[BXpanded]

All of the BX Buckets are the same width. Nothing special required for the BX1500.
Harry
BXpanded