PO'ed Veteran

[jinman]

I was in Walmart yesterday and picked up a can of spray lube. When checking out at the self-check, the register said I would have to get store clerk approval. As she was walking up to the register, I said, "Ma'am, if you ask me for my ID, I'm gonna kiss you on the lips!" She said, "If I don't ask for your ID, will you at least give me a hug?" We both had a good laugh.:laughing:

 

[MossRoad]

It is the stop part Moss, without probable cause and then once the officer stops you if he sees anything in your car that he deems suspicious he can frisk you and even search your car and you did nothing to provoke any of this....The officer never had probable cause and in my day , back in the '60's , you needed probable cause to stop someone...now days you don't..Now there will be those that say ..well, it does not bother me since I am doing nothing wrong..Well maybe and then again maybe not..it depends on the officer and his intent and honesty..The real point is...we used to be free to drive without interference unless we violated some law...that is no longer the case ..Is it ?

I agree that the stop part is bad. No cause, they shouldn't be stopping you to see your driver's license and proof of insurance. Funny that the legal basis for a DUI checkpoint has nothing to do with DUI. It has to do with checking for valid driver's license and proof of insurance, which has been deemed constitutional. Then, if they smell alcohol, pot, or see anything out of order in the car that is considered good reason to search.

I would like to see some studies regarding the effectiveness of DUI checkpoints VS spending the money and manpower on other forms of enforcement. 20 state cops spending 4 hours of O.T. , which equates to 120 hours of straight time pay to nab ZERO drunk drivers seems like a huge waste. They do usually get 3-4 people on outstanding warrants, though, but is seems like a low bang-for-the-bucks use of taxpayers' money.

 

[brin]

I agree that the stop part is bad. No cause, they shouldn't be stopping you to see your driver's license and proof of insurance. Funny that the legal basis for a DUI checkpoint has nothing to do with DUI. It has to do with checking for valid driver's license and proof of insurance, which has been deemed constitutional. Then, if they smell alcohol, pot, or see anything out of order in the car that is considered good reason to search.

I would like to see some studies regarding the effectiveness of DUI checkpoints VS spending the money and manpower on other forms of enforcement. 20 state cops spending 4 hours of O.T. , which equates to 120 hours of straight time pay to nab ZERO drunk drivers seems like a huge waste. They do usually get 3-4 people on outstanding warrants, though, but is seems like a low bang-for-the-bucks use of taxpayers' money.

I agree with you Moss from the standpoint of it wasting tax payers money, however, my concern and yes fear is the reach of government into our privacy and lives is going much too far. As an example, I am not a smoker but do you know in some cities in the US they have passed laws that forbid folks to smoke in their own homes ? I mean, where does this all stop..will BBQ grills be next or fireplaces.

I remember when I was a child in school and we learned that in communist countries drivers were stopped and had to show their papers at checkpoints and the teacher lectured on how bad that was and how it was not that way in America....We now have to stop at checkpoints and show our papers and then the police get a free look see into our vehicles. What if an overzealous - rogue cop planted some drugs....just to make himself look good...? Guess what ..you could never prove they were not your drugs...I'm just saying this country is changing in ways I never would have imagined and I think it is scary.

 

[MossRoad]

I have been stopped for speeding{which I was not, explain in a second} then frisked It was a crooked little town sheriff department, which has been shut down finally because they finally stepped on the wrong toes. Of course it took many years to shut down because their harrassing techniques were legal. I'm not saying all officers are bad many believe in their job and hope to make a difference. The problem happens when the laws over step the bounds of the innocent. Then of course there are the PUNKS that think they're tough because they have a uniform

My ticket was bocus because of the fact he clocked the wrong vehicle{me}, there was a side road{other vehicle}. Of course this seemed to happen more then once in that spot, if I'm not mistakin it was the same vehicle on the side road also??????

Like I said in another post we have enough dumb A*$ laws without injected more crap into our society. INSTEAD we need to enforce what is allready on the books.

You can't hold a crooked town with crooked cops responsible for all of societies woes. That kind of stuff happens in all sorts of occupations in all sorts of settings across the board. There are bums in all professions.

 

[20 20]

You can't hold a crooked town with crooked cops responsible for all of societies woes. That kind of stuff happens in all sorts of occupations in all sorts of settings across the board. There are bums in all professions.

agreed, and I don't hold them responsible for societies woes, I hold society responsible for letting crap happen like this in the 1st place, that's why I started the thread.

 

[20 20]

Brin I like your way of thinking. I am not a smoker either but I hated to see smoking banned{in this state} in privately owned establishments. If I don't like smoking then I can go elsewhere, the government HAS NO BUSINESS telling a private institution that they can't allow a legal activity.

MossRoad; I agree, I'd also like to see some studies done on the amount of money that is made{and wasted} of off check points. I'd also like a comparison done on money made of off simple traffic violations compared to catching real scum. I could take you to a city right now that is writting illegal parking tickets. I recieved one, called and told them they were wrong, mine was dropped, they also told me they'd fix the problem, quess what folks are still getting illegal fines. Is it the cops fault, is it the cities fault or is that people just say who gives a _____ it's only a couple $ ???? I'll write it again little issue's have away of growing bigger and eating holes into society.

 

[MossRoad]

I agree with you Moss from the standpoint of it wasting tax payers money, however, my concern and yes fear is the reach of government into our privacy and lives is going much too far. As an example, I am not a smoker but do you know in some cities in the US they have passed laws that forbid folks to smoke in their own homes ? I mean, where does this all stop..will BBQ grills be next or fireplaces.

I remember when I was a child in school and we learned that in communist countries drivers were stopped and had to show their papers at checkpoints and the teacher lectured on how bad that was and how it was not that way in America....We now have to stop at checkpoints and show our papers and then the police get a free look see into our vehicles. What if an overzealous - rogue cop planted some drugs....just to make himself look good...? Guess what ..you could never prove they were not your drugs...I'm just saying this country is changing in ways I never would have imagined and I think it is scary.

BBQs and fireplaces are already banned in many places for various reasons like fire codes, pollution caps, etc...

And the rogue cop example is kind of ridiculous because that can happen in any scenario (if the glove don't fit, you must acquit is a good example). Remember, rogue cops are criminals, just as anyone else that breaks the law is a criminal.

A lot of folks here tout majority rule over minority rights on issues such as religious freedom, firearm ownership, gay marriage, etc... yet when the majority of people support things like anti-smoking laws in public places, DUI checkpoints and ID checks for age verification on controlled substances.... well, lets just say it depends on whose ox is being gored.

I think my part of this discussion is winding down, as I see it going towards the political realm. I will have to agree with most of you that yes, some of our freedoms are getting squeezed, and I will have to disagree with some of you that think getting carded for age verification when purchasing controlled substances is an erosion of our personal freedoms. I hope that one day all of you will look old and gray enough and the law will allow for punk kid cashiers to not ask you to show your AARP cards. :laughing:

 

[brin]

Moss - Please clarify for me what you consider political since you are a Moderator. To me as long as no one is talking about democrats or republicans or specific parties or candidates but rather our rights as Americans...that can hardly be politcal in my view but if I am wrong please correct me.

 

[CinderSchnauzer]

Brin I like your way of thinking. I am not a smoker either but I hated to see smoking banned{in this state} in privately owned establishments. If I don't like smoking then I can go elsewhere, the government HAS NO BUSINESS telling a private institution that they can't allow a legal activity.

Without going into the whole list we have fairly wide ranging "banned smoking." The argument the customer can always go elsewhere is significantly countered by the fact non smoking employees cannot go elsewhere and their "rights" are protected by the ban.

In the last few days we have MADD (Mothers Against Drunk Driving) advocating unrestricted random traffic stops with mandatory breathalizer tests on the spot. Not surprising, the Deputy Commissioner of Police thinks this would be a great idea.

It would appear George Orwell was right on with his book - just off by a few years.

 

[brin]

The More I think about it...........I may just go up in the attic and find my old Pipes..I used to enjoy smoking a pipe...maybe I will take that up agian and dare someone to try and stop me from smoking my pipe on my farm ....Yeah ...that's the ticket.