Posthole Digger Post Hole Digger vs Bucket Spade for Pulling Small Trees

[FreedomFamilyFarms]

Hello TBN!

I'm planning to pull over some small trees on my property keep from leaving behind a stump. When I was a kid we'd use a PHD to auger around the tree roots and loosen the dirt before tugging on the stump.

I've been looking at PHDs and the best price I've seen is an older Ford 905 with a 12" auger for $350 on Craigslist. I'm wondering if a bucket spade might get the job done for a little less money and a bit more versatile tool.

Running a 27HP Kubota B2710 with loaded rears.

Thanks in advance!

 

[TractorGuy]

Sounds like a certified pain in the butt. Screwing a PHD auger in among tree roots is not something I would do on purpose.

 

[teg]

Can you define "little trees"? Also, are we talking mainly hardwoods (vs. pines)? Soil type and rocks?

I'm guessing you have a front end loader since you asking about a bucket spade... I've pushed over 12" dbh white pines that were 40 feet tall without digging.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

Sounds like a certified pain in the butt. Screwing a PHD auger in among tree roots is not something I would do on purpose.

I would have to agree with this.

Does the PHD come with a box of shear pins?

 

[Brazos by Nemo]

Why not a stump bucket? They work pretty good for small trees.

 

[FreedomFamilyFarms]

These are very small trees, less than 5" DBH. Soil is a solid clay. We did occasionally get the PHD stuck when using it to loosen dirt around stumps and yes, we kept a box of hardware store bolts and nuts as shear pins. The stumps and the tractor were much larger back then. It sounds like that approach may be overkill for this use case. I'll see what I can do to just push em' over with the loader. Any tips appreciated.

 

[CobyRupert]

I've pulled over some "big trees" ("big" being a relative term, but way bigger than I though possible. ~ 18" maple & pines) by hooking a cable up as high on it as I dared climb (with a ladder).

The cable is also easy to rehook onto the root ball to pull out that last root(s) that remains planted on the side that the tree pivoted on. IMHO easier than trying to position the FEL to catch and pry the root ball to get that last root.

Also it keeps you and your shiny tractor away from falling trees and branches when the unexpected happens.

I also had the advantage of sitting on the tractor behind a protective screen/cage in case cable snapped. But a chain would work too.

"Give me a lever long enough and a fulcrum on which to place it, and I shall move the world." - Archimedes (c. 287 BC – c. 212 BC)

 

[FreedomFamilyFarms]

I have some cable I've used to direct larger trees when felling. How thick should it be to just pull one over?

 

[CobyRupert]

I have some cable I've used to direct larger trees when felling. How thick should it be to just pull one over?

I'll answer a question with a question: How heavy is your tractor? When pulling a cable that's attached to a point higher than the tractor, I don't think you can pull with more force than the weight of the tractor. Unless you get a running start (not recommended).

I'd compare the rating of your cable to the tractor weight and apply a generous safety factor. Typically, I'd think a 3/8" or 1/2" cable would be more than sufficient, depending on it's condition and construction. Especially if the tree tress are only 5" DBH.

 

[CobyRupert]

It maybe be unnecessary, but are trees in a spot where you can soak the roots/soil prior to pulling? Rainy year?

 

[rd_macgregor]

You didn't specify what kind of trees, but at 5" and less, it shouldn't matter much. I have pushed and pulled over living trees bigger than that, mostly spruces, but including some birch and maple. The softwoods here tend to have much shallower root systems than the hardwoods, so are easier to uproot.

When budget permits, I hope to have the local metal shop fabricate a 3PH root ripper. That would relieve some of the stress on my tractor (which I have pushed beyond the breaking point a couple of times in the past) by loosening a tree's hold on the grounda and making tree removal much easier.

 

[FreedomFamilyFarms]

The tractor is rather light even with loaded rears. Leverage will be key to pulling. I think I'll give pushing them over a try, followed by a good pull from up high. That may prove difficult in the woods. I'd imagine I'll have a pretty good idea of where to go after that. No PHD for now. Thanks everyone.

 

[CobyRupert]

Just don't do this:
(Classic: Oldie but a goodie)

 

[4570Man]

You don't have enough tractor do do it in any kind of timely manner. If there's more than a few I'd rent a machine.

 

[teg]

You don't have enough tractor do do it in any kind of timely manner. If there's more than a few I'd rent a machine.

I agree with this ^^ a buddy of mine rented a track hoe for the week and he finished what he needed done and dropped it off for me to play with... a dozen or two trees later and in very little time, I had a big mess that my tractor took care of after returning the hoe!

 

[TractorGuy]

These are very small trees, less than 5" DBH. Soil is a solid clay. We did occasionally get the PHD stuck when using it to loosen dirt around stumps and yes, we kept a box of hardware store bolts and nuts as shear pins. The stumps and the tractor were much larger back then. It sounds like that approach may be overkill for this use case. I'll see what I can do to just push em' over with the loader. Any tips appreciated.

I think your tractor with a loader should be able to push 5" trees over with no problem. I have pushed similar size trees over with my little JD without a loader. I have pulled larger trees over with a rope. When I did that I was able to tie the rope to the tree I was pulling and wrap it around the trunk of another tree so I could pull to the side of where I wanted the tree to fall. You don't want to just tie onto a tree and pull it down on you.

Those days are gone now since I bought a backhoe.

 

[4570Man]

I think your tractor with a loader should be able to push 5" trees over with no problem. I have pushed similar size trees over with my little JD without a loader. I have pulled larger trees over with a rope. When I did that I was able to tie the rope to the tree I was pulling and wrap it around the trunk of another tree so I could pull to the side of where I wanted the tree to fall. You don't want to just tie onto a tree and pull it down on you.

Those days are gone now since I bought a backhoe.

I guess that depends on the soil and the tree, but it ain't happening here. My Kubota L3240 base tractor weighs twice what his tractor does. After you add in the weight of my backhoe, loader, and loaded tires it outweighs his by a significant amount and I couldn't push over 5" trees with it unless they were maple trees in a swamp.

 

[mardenm]

I would suggest you pick up a ouple of pulleys, a good static rope, and set up a 5:1 .mechanical advantage to your tractor. This would be safer and easier on your equipment. Of course it's easy for me to say because already have the pulleys. Take a look at this video to see what a little leverage can do for you
Mechanical Advantage vs. Straight Pull Stumpin' - YouTube

 

[FreedomFamilyFarms]

I would suggest you pick up a ouple of pulleys, a good static rope, and set up a 5:1 .mechanical advantage to your tractor. This would be safer and easier on your equipment. Of course it's easy for me to say because already have the pulleys. Take a look at this video to see what a little leverage can do for you
Mechanical Advantage vs. Straight Pull Stumpin' - YouTube

Exactly the advice I was looking for. Thanks for posting!

 

[jemclimber]

What I do to rip out ash trees is hook up my subsoiler and cut a square around the tree to break the roots. Sometimes if the tree isn't cooperating, I use the forks or just one fork in the middle to further break the stubborn root. Then I use a chain to pull out the stump. On the bigger trees I'll first cut it off 6-10' high so it doesn't fall on me when I'm pulling it over. Smaller trees I push over with the FEL. With my tractor, I've used this method on ash trees 10-12" in diameter.

My ash are all dying from EAB and I'm trying to reclaim a field which is why I want the roots out.