project update... If only!!!! Long

   / project update... If only!!!! Long #1  

tile

Bronze Member
Joined
May 28, 2006
Messages
89
Location
Florida
BTW I'm tiles wife, he's not here but said I should post.

Awhile back tile posted asking questions about the different types of buildings to erect. After many replies and good things to take into consideration, he decieded to go with a Arch style metal building from Pioneer Steel. It's a 40 x 48 with 16' ceiling. There are endwals at either end that are setback 16"+/- for an overhang. We purchased the building and hired a contractor friend who we have worked for in the past. We are a tile/epoxy contractor which is a finish trade. So, we see and know a bit of construction do's and don'ts. Unfortunately we do not get to see the structural end of all this construction. I say that because I really wish I had known more and I also wish I could rewind time to say mid July.

While I waited for the building documents and the permitting to go thru I had my neighbor dig up the area for the slab pad and I brought in several trucks of dirt. No real requirements but I wanted to elevate the barn about 2'. This dirt pad sat for some time til the contractor got the permit and we could finally get started. I was so excited to see something finally happen. It kinda makes you think you're really gonna have a barn. The contractor came out with a couple guys and they started forming this slab. They called for an inspection and to his surprise it failed. He was quite dumbfounded but said Ok we'll fix that. The problems were J-bolts not the right size, no wire and can not substitute fibre, the cages were not tied at the end. He comes back out in 2 weeks ( J-Bolts were special order) and fixes everything the inspector had a problem with. He calls for another inspection and again to his surprise it fails. This time the inspector says there is not enough space between the rebar and the ground, anchor bolts needed 6" embedment, and the footers were to be poured seperate and have a control joint. My contractor was not happy so he called the inspector and did whatever contractors do to get them to pass it. I say this because without making a single change to the 2nd list the inspector changed a failed inspection to a passed inspection. I thought ok they worked out whatever problems they may have had. As it turned out a couple days came and went without any word from the contractor. Then on Saturday I called him to let him know the building had arrived. He said great I'll be out tomorrow to check the bolt placement against the base plate. Seemed like an excellent idea to me. However he never showed until Monday AM and a concrete truck pulled in seconds after he did. May not be bad except he was alone. I had to leave to take my daughter to school, husbands not home and they are doing what they do. I was not very comfortable with the whole thing at this point. By the time I get back he has a couple guys with him and still one concrete truck which has just begun dropping concrete ( 40 minutes have passed). Shortly after I arrive home a second concrete truck shows up and sits for atleast 30 minutes before the third truck shows up while the first truck is just finishing. I am not happy at this point as I know this does not look good. I let my contractor know about my concerns to no avail. They continue with the pour and after a long day they finish up while leaving a trail of concrete throughout my field. Apparently a good bushhogging does wonders with a field of concrete, according to my contractor. I have since learned they added extreme amounts of water to each truck and after all was done the slab is not what I signed up for. I have included a few pics so you can see what I have so far. You'll see bolts that don't line up, concrete that was not finished and even a few areas that apparently didn't really need any concrete at all.

I'm not good at attachments so I've added links to the files on my site.
Click here for images


I think I'm going to have the factory look at the base plates to see if they are not being comprimised and have the concrete tested for structural deficiencies. What would you do? Any thoughts or ideas on this would be appreciated.


Thanks
 
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   / project update... If only!!!! Long #2  
I hope the contractor was not a friend, by the looks of the work that he did, I would do all that you said, as well as talking with an attorney, if you find that you need to rip it all out and start over, it wont be cheap.

Good luck!

Thanks

Bruce
 
   / project update... If only!!!! Long #3  
Hmmm...maybe contact the "inspector" and see what he REALLY approved, then the manufacturer, then an attorney. Indicate to the contractor you want "a few days" to let the concete set (while you figure out what the consesus is among the three mentioned above).

BTW- take keeping pictures and document, they speak millions and people HATE to justify their reasoning, when then are wrong!! I think that might have saved someone a HUGE problem in another thread with a contractor.

Good Luck!!
 
   / project update... If only!!!! Long
  • Thread Starter
#4  
He's not a close friend but a friend I thought I could trust not to do me this way. I paid for all the materials (including 4100.00 for concrete) and he has yet to give me a bill but I think he is holding off because he knows I'm not happy. His bill I expect to be around 4,000.00 according to earlier estimates. However he won't see a dime until my tests come back and then we'll go from there. I hate being a difficult person and would much rather everything work nicely like it should. But, you have to do what you have to do. Right?!

BTW those are only a few of the pics. It's much worse in person. Out of 130+ J-Bolts I'd guess a good 50 - 60 are wrong and some are in such a way that cutting and epoxying other bolts probably are not an option.

I'm hoping I don't need to rip it out or hire a lawyer for that matter. Only time will tell.
 
   / project update... If only!!!! Long #5  
Geeeze, I don't know much about 'crete, but that just don't look good.

jb
 
   / project update... If only!!!! Long
  • Thread Starter
#6  
john_bud said:
Geeeze, I don't know much about 'crete, but that just don't look good.

jb


You say the sweetest things ;)

Makes you wanna cry don't it, I know I do.
 
   / project update... If only!!!! Long #7  
First, your contractor doesn't know anything about pouring concrete. Not just the bolts, but the pad is about as sloppy a job as I've ever seen. What type of contractor is he? I've seen guys who do some things great try something new and get in way over there heads.

Two failed inpsections tell you right off that he's an amature.

The concrete company is gonna want it's money. You are the home owner and you are the one they will be coming after to get paid. Your contractor isn't owed a dime for causing you this disaster. Do not pay him or anybody anything until you have it all worked out.

I hate to suggest this, but in your case you will need a lawyer. Your contractor did not do what you paid him to do. He is liable for ruining your slab along with the financial burden you are now under.

Take more pictures. Get a straight edge like a 2x4 or 2x6 and lay it on the concrete and take pictures that show how uneven the surface is. Show how bad those corners are. The more pictures you have, the better your case.

Did you sign a contract with him?

Do not listen to him anymore. He should be fired and not allowed to make things any worse. He's lied to you from the beginning and will continue to do so.

Has the inspector been back to inspect the pad? Talk to the inspector personally and take notes. Get all records of what he denied and aproved. Did he really pass the second inspection? If nothing was done and he passed it without re-inspecting it, prepare for the inspector to be very dificult to deal with since he's going to be covering his butt. Find out who's in charge of him and go over his head. Get names, write down dates and everything that is said. Write notes in front of them while your talking to them. It will let them know your serious and keep them honest. Lies are easy to check.

Call in a few real concrete contractors. Guys who do this every day and have been doing it for years. Ask them what it will take to fix your slab and get it in writing. This is important in your suit against your contractor and in how you'll fix this problem.

I'm sorry you had this happen to you. The pad might be salvagable, but you're going to need some onsite inspections by some very knowledgable people. Not your former contractor. His word isn't worth anything.

Good luck,
Eddie
 
   / project update... If only!!!! Long #8  
I agree with Eddie 100%. His advice is the best you are going to get. I will add that you need to do it NOW, do not delay.
David
 
   / project update... If only!!!! Long #9  
I'll 3rd what Eddie said. HOPEFULLY you have a written contract. I made a HUGE mistake and had a "friend" pour our slab when we built our home 6 years ago. Not only did he do a poor job that I still worry about sometimes, but then he handed me a bill for about double the going rate and said it was to cover the "extra" work he had to do. We ended up going to arbitration before court and I ended up paying about 150% of the going rate for a crappy slab just to keep from having to drag through an actual court proceeding. It was a very bad experience but the important thing is getting it sorted out as quickly as possible.
 
   / project update... If only!!!! Long #10  
tile and tile's wife,

Seeing those pictures made me sick. Truly sorry that happened to you. I was looking at the bolt placement and when I looked into a steel building they recommended epoxying the bolts in instead of pre-placing them in the concrete since the metal framework needs to be so exact. Much different on a stick built where you can just lay the sillplate down and drill where you need to.

I agree with Eddie also that you should investigate your legal avenues immediately and review whatever contract you entered into with the cement guy.
 

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