Property Value/Appraisals RANT

[Bob77064]

David, I am sorry to hear this I hope things work out for you.

 

[vtsnowedin]

He needs some Fels Naptha Mouthwash!!!![/guote]

Isn't that a little harsh. It was just a suggestion. as a last, last last LAST resort. after you have sold your first born into slavery last resort.

I can't believe he said it!

But it is just a lil' Kioti, not a JD or Kubota, it did not coust $100,000.00 !!!!! :laughing:

Hey his Lil' Kioti cost just as much as my lil' Jd 5045E. and i bet he has more of his paid off.

Thanks to both for the humor...

A laugh in the face of doom is sometimes all you can do. You will muddle through you don't have any choice.

 

[sshaw]

What I got back (so far just a verbal, awaiting the actual appraisal) is showing that after adding a real 2nd floor with another 1344 square feet, 2 bedrooms, a bath, and family room a mere $410K.

The situation sucks and I don't have a solution for you, but if it makes you feel any better I'd say your $410K appraisal value sounds pretty close. Based on your signature, my house is probably no more than 15 miles away from yours as a crow flies, and would compare in size to your remodeling plans. I've got 2900 sf, 4 bedrooms, 3.5 baths, three levels, walkout basement, patio, dock with gazebo, huge wrap around screened porch, and a garage. The house was originally custom-built by a local builder for himself to live in, and is very well put together with lots of woodwork inside, many extra windows, etc. My house sits in the center of 30 acres of mature woods, and overlooks a 3.5 acre spring-fed pond with deep water perfect for swimming and fishing. My appraisal from 2011 was pretty much the same as yours and I thought it was very fair. You've got 20 ac more land, but that's probably offset by my garage and other amenities.

The problem you and I have with appraisals is the location and the nature of the lot. Most of the homes in our area sell for an average of about $150K, so the appraisers won't likely find any comps nearby. Plus the appraisers won't give you much value for the things you or another buyer might value highly, like the large lot, mature trees, fields, and ponds.

Also, from my experience I wouldn't expect to get anywhere near 100% of the cost of a remodel job back in your appraisal. I'd expect maybe 75 to 80%, so hoping to get $140K value out of a $100K remodel investment probably isn't realistic. If it were realistic, everyone would be doing it to get that 40% return.

Also of note, Hanover county just mailed their property assessments and mine went down by about 10% compared to 2012. So did the neighbors.

Scott

 

[300UGUY]

I hope it works out for you. I know in my area, housing prices are still down after several years. My place is paid off, but it probably isn't worth what I put into over the last 25 years. My neighbor's home, on 10 acres, apprasied for 500K in 2003. She has been trying to sell it since 2007, and hasn't had a single offer, after dropping the price down to 300K. She has about 400K invested. Around here, the implosion of manufacturing jobs has kept home prices depressed.

 

[two_bit_score]

Keith,

The taxes are low, no help there. With 50.77 acres and a small house, NOBODY wants my business because the property will not "conform" for Fannie/Freddie... I am currently mortgaged ia a small local bank, and they were willing to do 85% LTV... I will try Farm Credit but they will max at 75% LTV...

David

I hope this does not come across the wrong way.

But.......maybe somebody upstairs is trying to tell you something. In the new Obama economy does anybody really need to increase their debt? This may just be one of those times to 'just make do'. Hunker own until the economy improves, if Obama doesn't totally kill it, and wait it out. It may be tough but the alternative may be worse.

Again, I hope that doesn't come across the wrong way.

.

 

[MossflowerWoods]

I hope this does not come across the wrong way.

But.......maybe somebody upstairs is trying to tell you something. In the new Obama economy does anybody really need to increase their debt? This may just be one of those times to 'just make do'. Hunker own until the economy improves, if Obama doesn't totally kill it, and wait it out. It may be tough but the alternative may be worse.

Again, I hope that doesn't come across the wrong way.

TwoBit,

It does NOT come across wrong. I am a fairly religious guy, and I have been worndering just exactly what the message is here.Some things are just green lights all the way, clear sailing, and other things simply cannot come together at all. I can say that I've now spent something approaching $12,000 on stupid PAPER trying to get some form of a remodel approved and that is REAL money that I could not afford to flush away.

This journey has not been easy... I did not want to own 3 houses, but suddenly I was just having my dream acreage fall into my lap, and suddenly it was mine. That was a Friday. on the following Tuesday I was notified my contract with the Federal Govt. (I was self empolyed 1 man company) was being terminated due to unexpected budget cuts... I went 11 months unemployed with 3 mortages, and a home equity loan, and then foir the next 14 months I was very much under employed, making about 60% what I typically make. Then I crashed my Harley and broke my collar bone and had to have friends help me build the horse fence. Everything with this place is either smooth sailing, or impossible.

My wife is NOT happy, neither are my girls.

We moved out of a very, very nice huge house into a tiny broken down modular. we are drowning in our own stuff, and have nowhere to put it.

Credit, just like a firearm, is merely a tool. I've been very skilled at managing my debt to income and efficient useage of capitol to maximize my stewardship of the resources we've been blessed with.

I am at a loss. I simply cannot finish the attic, work full time, manage the horses, build the run-in and pasture fence, clear the riding trails, put in food plots for deer hunting, all by myself, AND with no additional funds... Something has gotta give...

I am at a loss. I simply cannot figure out what to do...

I know God is sending me a message, I just wish I was not too stoopid to understand it...

Be well,
David

PS - From my reading of the Obama economy. Unfortunately every one of our dollars has more true value today than it will have. inflation etc will devalue our money rapidly (already has) I've had a similar income for a long time, and money just does not go very far any more... As much as I hate to say this out loud, I suspect it is almost foolish to save right now... But I cannot stop saving, and trying to get the best value for every dollar I spend, the fruits of MY hard earned labor...

 

[zzvyb6]

How about this concept for your AG land? You could call it User Bin-Living, or Silo Nara, or Corn-A-Copia, or Tack Shelter, or ???

 

[dave1949]

I am at a loss. I simply cannot finish the attic, work full time, manage the horses, build the run-in and pasture fence, clear the riding trails, put in food plots for deer hunting, all by myself, AND with no additional funds... Something has gotta give...

I am at a loss. I simply cannot figure out what to do...

I would say you have to prioritize your efforts and expenses. Your core mission is to put a roof over your family's head. Horses and deer are gravy. Maybe it's time to give yourself a break? Sit down and discuss with your family what their priorities are, giving everyone a voice and understanding of the limits of time and money. The current situation won't last forever, but in the meantime, you have to be realistic.

 

[plowindeeper]

When I had my place appraised before I bought it the appraiser asked my "What do you want it to appraise for and are you buying or selling".

There are not any code or inspections build what you want were you want.

Called my banker yesterday, for a letter of credit, on a home auction. His reply "I'm printing it now". That is why I use a small hometown bank.

 

[two_bit_score]

TwoBit,

It does NOT come across wrong. I am a fairly religious guy, and I have been worndering just exactly what the message is here.Some things are just green lights all the way, clear sailing, and other things simply cannot come together at all. I can say that I've now spent something approaching $12,000 on stupid PAPER trying to get some form of a remodel approved and that is REAL money that I could not afford to flush away.

This journey has not been easy... I did not want to own 3 houses, but suddenly I was just having my dream acreage fall into my lap, and suddenly it was mine. That was a Friday. on the following Tuesday I was notified my contract with the Federal Govt. (I was self empolyed 1 man company) was being terminated due to unexpected budget cuts... I went 11 months unemployed with 3 mortages, and a home equity loan, and then foir the next 14 months I was very much under employed, making about 60% what I typically make. Then I crashed my Harley and broke my collar bone and had to have friends help me build the horse fence. Everything with this place is either smooth sailing, or impossible.

My wife is NOT happy, neither are my girls.

We moved out of a very, very nice huge house into a tiny broken down modular. we are drowning in our own stuff, and have nowhere to put it.

Credit, just like a firearm, is merely a tool. I've been very skilled at managing my debt to income and efficient useage of capitol to maximize my stewardship of the resources we've been blessed with.

I am at a loss. I simply cannot finish the attic, work full time, manage the horses, build the run-in and pasture fence, clear the riding trails, put in food plots for deer hunting, all by myself, AND with no additional funds... Something has gotta give...

I am at a loss. I simply cannot figure out what to do...

I know God is sending me a message, I just wish I was not too stoopid to understand it...

Be well,
David

PS - From my reading of the Obama economy. Unfortunately every one of our dollars has more true value today than it will have. inflation etc will devalue our money rapidly (already has) I've had a similar income for a long time, and money just does not go very far any more... As much as I hate to say this out loud, I suspect it is almost foolish to save right now... But I cannot stop saving, and trying to get the best value for every dollar I spend, the fruits of MY hard earned labor...

In situations like that I'm glad I have a few CD's to take out a loan against. Thats why I like to stay away from debt. you don't have yo worry about all this other fees, charges and BS from the bank. Just go borrow some of your own money.

I'm with Dave on the horses and deer plots. I think it's time to hunker down, cut expenses and just jump out on really good deals that you can do for cash, turn quickly or afford to hold until things improve.

Of course, everybody does things their own way. Praying for guidance for you and your family.

.

 

[kenmac]

Thats why I like to stay away from debt.

.

I'm with you. In my line of work the economy has hurt.But, with no debt, I'm ok.Others that I know in my line of work have gone out of business. I haven't been a slave to debt in some time. I hope all works out for you. I'm thankful I'm not in your shoes

 

[creekbend]

I truly wish you and your Family the best. This comes from the "very bottom of my Heart and Soul". All your other posts have depicted your Family as being loving and caring individuals. I really think that if you and your Family had a "meeting of the minds", that positive results will be found. Your Family will surely understand. Best wishes.

 

[vtsnowedin]

I take it that you are also under water on the other two houses or nearly so and selling one of them would not raise any free cash. They used to talk about farmers being land poor but in your case you are house poor as taxes and upkeep are straining your income. You might have to let one of them go at today's market price if you can get just what you owe on it. You'll lose a lot of equity you once thought you had but it is gone and probably won't come back anytime soon.
A tough break all around and I do feel for you.
You are not alone in this, something like one out of four mortgages in the whole country is under water and the owners are stuck unable to borrow ands trying to muddle through. miss one paycheck and they are toast. One of my neighbors has a house in Conn. she can't afford to sell or to keep. At times she looks on the verge of collapse from the strain.
I too am worried about government spending and the inflation which will result and my strategy is to get as many things I might need in the future bought now at zero % interest and get them paid off before the cash flow stops. SUV for Her, fuel efficient 4x4 pickup for me and the JD with loader to haul fire wood, plow snow , haul sap for sugaring and plow gardens if needed. I think those things bought and paid for will be worth more then a pile of gold and silver coins hidden in a safe somewhere.

 

[hr3]

I'd do some research on local values I agree it doesn't sound right .. Ladysmith, VA Home Values - Virginia | HOMES.com

 

[MotorSeven]

Good luck Moss, we went through the same thing on our re-fi. We had been with Farm Credit since 2001, credit was good but debit ratio high because I built a house on cash & credit cards. FC turned us down saying that our debit ratios was too high?????? THIS IS WHY WE WERE ASKING FOR A RE-FI. We owed $165K on 100ac, the shop/apartment & outbuildings and current appraised value was $250K. The loan officer at FC looked at the completed house and said it was worth $200K.....add that to the $250K & you get $550K. Ok, now it gets good, we were asking for only $50K more...in other words $215K TOTAL......less than half of it's value just so we could pay off the CC debit we had charged for building materials(yes I have every stinking receipt from day one). Negative.........., denied because we had a high debit ratio.

Our combined income is over $100K(half of that is my retirement income) a year so I was pretty steamed up. We started looking around for other banks but as you know anything over 20 acers gives banks the willies...why I have no idea. Land is easier to value, cant be trashed(for the most part), is easier to sell then a house, etc. Anyway, we went with a Credit Union and ended up with a lower interest rate, and a closing cost of $800 total compared to FC's $3,500 + a $1900 fine for lowering our interest rate with them 6 months prior(AT THEIR SUGGESTION).

I'll never do business with FC again and I regret giving them $50K+ in interest since 2001. Since then we have persuaded several friends to drop FC and go with Consumer Credit Union....to date they have lost over one million in loans. We are manipulated like little pawns by the abstract use of credit scores & it's a big game to the banks always at our expense. When I get this loan payed off I ain't playing anymore....ever.

Moss I like the portable outbuilding idea. Kids don't care where they sleep as long as their parents love 'em:thumbsup:

 

[300UGUY]

My job went away in 2008. But we had everything paid for. We have a modest house, 2000 sq ft. We used to have horses, but we got rid of them, too expensive, and we didn't ride anymore anyway. Horses are very expensive, my regular shots from the vet were $500 @ here in Michigan. I see horses for free in CL, and my vet recently asked if I was interested in a nice saddlebred. (free) I laughed and said no. I've had good times, bad times, politics never affected my employment, but I never worked in the defense industry. I think talking to the family is in order. You have to manage expectations a bit. I really think that more debt would be very bad for you. What if you get caught up in another layoff? With more debt, you would be in even worse shape. Btw, having horses is like having more dependents. You really need that?

 

[sdkubota]

An acreage does little for property value in the lenders eyes. I live on 10 secluded acres abutting a lake within 9 miles of the largest city in Sioux Dakota and it has little value to the assessor. To me it is worth 1 million dollars.

 

[dfeck]

I read desperation in your post but again I think adding additional debt is NOT the right thing to do in your situation. I'm a firm believer in what is meant to be will be and if it doesn't then there was a reason why. I live by this premise everyday! By reading your situation I'm convinced someone is trying to tell you something and it's NOT meant to be. I'm 46 years old and as I get older (more mature) I've come to realize that little or no debt is the way to go. Having huge debt creates stress and frustration (sound familiar?) and you'll find yourself chasing the almighty dollar. Do I have debt? I sure do but it's low and if I lose my job I'd be okay for a long time before running into any problems. I consider myself blessed and very grateful for what I have considering today's economy. I think you should be happy that you have a job, home and a loving family. I would sit tight, build equity and save capital before building onto your house. Good luck and don't get frustrated by the current situation. Things will change and hopefully for the better!

 

[dmccarty]

If you have 10 pounds of scat in a 5 pound sack, you need to remove 5 pounds of scat.

We lived like that in our city house for years. PITA but it was what we needed to do to buy land and build our house. We still need storage space at the new house and our barn is a box off a box truck. The box has been painted, which is now peeling in places, and the box looks like it was from a U Haul truck. We filled that up pretty quickly and I built a shed next to the box barn. Looks like scat and I can't stand it but it is what we could afford and what I had time to do. We still need storage space. My current project is to build a well house. I built a temporary well box NINE years ago. The plan was to build the well house EIGHT years ago but more important issues popped up. :shocked:

I have way too many chores, family health problems, job requirements, family responsibilities and no where near the time to do all of what I would LIKE to do. Ironically, all I have to do to go hunting is walk out of the house. I have gone deer hunting three times since we have owned this place. :shocked: I am just too busy to have time to hunt. In 2012, I mowed the place ONCE. Yes, once. There simply was not enough time to mow, and when I did have time to mow, it was wet from rain or I had equipment problems. I thought I would be able to mow the yard again at XMAS but other more important issues got the time slice.

You have to prioritize and do what NEEDS to be done and try not to worry about the things you would LIKE to get done. My new mantra over the last few years is, "I was not born to mow grass!" :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Chickens, horses, and pets, take up a huge amount of time and MONEY. Keeping the family happy with the critters is a high priority for me but thankfully we no longer have a horse!

Can you put pull stuff out of the house and put it in storage? If the house needs space for the home school and other things, a portable building might look like scat but ya gotta do what ya gotta do. I would think if you subdivide the property so the house was on 5-10 acres the banking issues will be much simpler.

Later,
Dan

 

[riptides]

PM sent, ignore the stupid looking charachters. Sorry about that.

As far as acreage, my last appraisal only covered what the HOUSE is sitting on. Other parcels not considered.