Generator PTO Generator

[emmy71]

I have a 7500 watt generator that has the idle down feature. When it senses a load it revs up to the speed rated for 60 hz. When the load is removed it returns to idle after about 2 seconds. At idle it produces around 40 hz according to my meter.

Terry

 

[Soundguy]

you are probably right about the 0 current. I have not tried it so I dont know. but your arguement on that point makes sense. I guess your arguement goes back to what you are going to use the power for. If you are going to have a generator running so that you can have power for lights or tv or whatever then you can start the generator and have it run when you need it and turn it off when you are done. I believe I could do the same thing with my genrator. However if you are going to have power available so that you can turn on a light or power a fan for a heater. Then you are going to need to leave the generator running and my idle down feature on the generator would be a lot better. Luckily for both of us they make and sell both kind of generators so that we can both be satisfied with our choice whichever one is better.

I just have a different idea of 'emergency backup power' than some... IE.. in an emergency situation wher ethe grid is down.. and may be down for? who knows how long? I think I will be conserving fuel and generate power only when needed.. and not just be making it for convienience sake.

as you say.. both are available for those that need convienience power and those just worried about having enough fuel to make it all the way thru the crisis without the tv and lamps at the flp of a swich.


soundguy

 

[sandman2234]

A battery backup system to run small items, such as lights, tv, radio, etc would make the generator more efficent. When the batteries draw to a low state, or it is time to run the freezer/fridge (or my favorite COOK!)start the generator and use it during the needed time, but allowing it also to charge the battery bank. Makes great use of the fuel available.
David from jax

 

[JB4310]

A battery backup system to run small items, such as lights, tv, radio, etc would make the generator more efficent. When the batteries draw to a low state, or it is time to run the freezer/fridge (or my favorite COOK!)start the generator and use it during the needed time, but allowing it also to charge the battery bank. Makes great use of the fuel available.
David from jax

I agree, and think we need a separate forum to discuss all the "Alternate energy" ideas which seem to come out at this time of year
In a long term, don't know when the power is coming back type outage, that would be the way to go, inverter and a bank of batteries.
That's what the folks who live off the grid do, they are the true power managers, and it's not just lite loads, they have high out put inverters, pretty costly though.


In my home the vast majority of the time it's just lights and TV, only use the dryer 1 day a week and the stove 1 hour a day at the most, got oil fired heat and HW, the fridge being the biggest draw on average all day probably, so that's why I keep going back to an easier way to make 3-4 kw with my pto.
Maybe a small battery system would be ideal for me, but you'd prob spend more on even a small system than the genny. Of course I still want the pto genny for charging the batteries or using the dryer, stove, welder or compressor etc.

IMO, back up or standby power has to be made by diesel power, simply for the storage and stability concerns, (use to be cheaper but as was pointed out, can't use that anymore) and the fact that I always have several hundred gallons on hand (three 275 gallon oil tanks$$$)

JB.

 

[gemini5362]

I agree, and think we need a separate forum to discuss all the "Alternate energy" ideas which seem to come out at this time of year
In a long term, don't know when the power is coming back type outage, that would be the way to go, inverter and a bank of batteries.
That's what the folks who live off the grid do, they are the true power managers, and it's not just lite loads, they have high out put inverters, pretty costly though.


In my home the vast majority of the time it's just lights and TV, only use the dryer 1 day a week and the stove 1 hour a day at the most, got oil fired heat and HW, the fridge being the biggest draw on average all day probably, so that's why I keep going back to an easier way to make 3-4 kw with my pto.
Maybe a small battery system would be ideal for me, but you'd prob spend more on even a small system than the genny. Of course I still want the pto genny for charging the batteries or using the dryer, stove, welder or compressor etc.

IMO, back up or standby power has to be made by diesel power, simply for the storage and stability concerns, (use to be cheaper but as was pointed out, can't use that anymore) and the fact that I always have several hundred gallons on hand (three 275 gallon oil tanks$$$)

JB.

That is another consideration that i did not mention what type of fuel do you have the most of. I certainly dont keep 275 gallons of diesel fuel around If you have that kind of resevoir that would make sense to be able to use something that used diesel fuel. I actually am considering an actual standby generator. I saw one that would put out 200 amps and was labeled at having regulated power for computers and digital circuits If power went out I could run my whole house with it. It runs off of LP gas and I have a spot where I could just T off of the line where it goes into my house and have the generator sitting right next to the house ready to go. I use propane to cook with and for backup heating. I am on a route so they fill my tank every two weeks. I need to budget that kind of money but it would be a solution that would make sure I was prepared for a long term outage if that should happen.

 

[SPYDERLK]

That is another consideration that i did not mention what type of fuel do you have the most of. I certainly dont keep 275 gallons of diesel fuel around If you have that kind of resevoir that would make sense to be able to use something that used diesel fuel. I actually am considering an actual standby generator. I saw one that would put out 200 amps and was labeled at having regulated power for computers and digital circuits If power went out I could run my whole house with it. It runs off of LP gas and I have a spot where I could just T off of the line where it goes into my house and have the generator sitting right next to the house ready to go. I use propane to cook with and for backup heating. I am on a route so they fill my tank every two weeks. I need to budget that kind of money but it would be a solution that would make sure I was prepared for a long term outage if that should happen.

You may have to heat the propane tank when using a lot of power.
larry

 

[gemini5362]

You may have to heat the propane tank when using a lot of power.
larry

Heat the propane tank ?

 

[psj12]

Some of these units run off natural gas. That way if it is an electrical power failure you would have an unlimited supply of gas from a connected underground utility. However if the loss is due to some cataclism such as earthquate you will probably lose natural gas utility also.

Yes, you may have to heat the propane tank in very cold climates as the use of the propane causes the gas to boil off and cool the tank (ever see frost on your BBQ bottle). As the temp plummets the internal pressure drops to the point it will become unuseable.

 

[Soundguy]

A battery backup system to run small items, such as lights, tv, radio, etc would make the generator more efficent. When the batteries draw to a low state, or it is time to run the freezer/fridge (or my favorite COOK!)start the generator and use it during the needed time, but allowing it also to charge the battery bank. Makes great use of the fuel available.
David from jax

I also agree.

I keep a good interstate battery as a spare.. I take it with me to run a 12v winch on tractor hunting expiditions.. or when i go to a show just incase mine or another persons tractor dies and needs winching up on a trailer.

in any case.. i have 4 inverters.. well 5 really.. but one is small.. just enough for a laptop. Various sizes. I also have a jumper / booster pack that has 12v outlet, led lamps.. etc. I have a few hand crank lamps and radio's.. as well as a hand crank lamp/weather radio/radio/tv.

For the first bit of an outtage that is storm related.. i usually don't rig up genny power -yet-.. If i need an update on weather a hand crank radi suffices... insividual lamps can be run off an inverter..e tc. Once I know outtage will be for 8+ hours.. i get the genny ready to keep the refers cool and cycle them.. etc. / recharge the bat's for the inverters.

soundguy

 

[Soundguy]

Heat the propane tank ?

Ever been to a tractor show and seen the big one-lungs running off a bbq tank.. and after sucking on it for a few minutes the thing freezes up.

remember the cooling effect of releasing a compressed gas....

soundguy

 

[Egon]

By golly fellows, you just may have inadvertently stumbled upon a C3 refrigeration system! Now all you do is add a compressor and condenser.

 

[gemini5362]

Ever been to a tractor show and seen the big one-lungs running off a bbq tank.. and after sucking on it for a few minutes the thing freezes up.

remember the cooling effect of releasing a compressed gas....

soundguy

I was wondering if you were thinking something like bbq tank. I have a 250 gallon propane tank. I guess there could be a problem. I am not sure how much of a draw it would take to do that. I have had my tank for over 15 years and I have had 100,000 btu of heat going plus the cookstove at the same time and did not have a problem I dont know the useage for a generator so I would have to look into that. I also see pickups and at one time school buses that used propane. The pickups just had the tank in the back of the truck and were powering a v-8 engine with that. Would a generator have a larger useage than a v-8 engine pulling a trailer ?

 

[Soundguy]

Usage will depend on power generated and efficiency.. however..If you got a large sump for evaporation.. and a large surface area.. I think you will be fine..

soundguy

 

[Smokin Diesel]

Never deviated. Thought fuel economy was brought into play as part of the issue or did you miss that?

You fellows always in the habit of ignoring facts if they don't suit your opinions

Didn't miss a thing. The issue was the fuel economy of a loaded vs. unloaded diesel engine at a set RPM, not the fuel economy of your loaded vs. unloaded pickup. Apples and oranges. Especially if you don't have any idea how much horspower your truck is actually producing in each situation (and judging by your "shouldn't the Fuel Mileage just go to astronomical levels if it's about HP required" comment, you don't).

Your truck requires about 60-70 hp to propel itself at highway speeds. Probably 100-110 hp-ish with your load (no wind). You get probably 18 mpg empty and around 11-12 mpg in your loaded configuration. A little quick calculator work, and it looks like you"ll use about 30-35% less fuel when you're using 30-35% less hp. How much more mpg are you expecting when you're unloaded? What facts am I ignoring?

I've had my 2001 Dodge Cummins on a dyno a couple of times, which told me what boost pressures roughly equate to various horsepower outputs. And I've towed/hauled many different configurations, including something similar to what you have in your picture. So that's where I get my facts. You?

 

[Egon]

I've had my 2001 Dodge Cummins on a dyno a couple of times, which told me what boost pressures roughly equate to various horsepower outputs. And I've towed/hauled many different configurations, including something similar to what you have in your picture. So that's where I get my facts. You?

Me, Nope no dynos. Heck, I don't even know what boost pressure means. I just go by what the load/mileage data shows.

I do like to equate things to the amount of sweat on Syphilous's headband though! Thats kinda like saying how much work was done ehh.

Sota depends on how much one pays for wall paper I guess!

 

[Egon]

Usage will depend on power generated and efficiency.. however..If you got a large sump for evaporation.. and a large surface area.. I think you will be fine..

I think he may be saying that the regulator should be sized to the flow rate of C3 required.

Now if it gets down to -40C or is it -40F then it may be time to take other measures.

 

[gemini5362]

I think he may be saying that the regulator should be sized to the flow rate of C3 required.

Now if it gets down to -40C or is it -40F then it may be time to take other measures.

if it gets down to -40c or even to -40F I will take other measures it is called pulling up stakes and moving farther south

 

[Egon]

if it gets down to -40c or even to -40F I will take other measures it is called pulling up stakes and moving farther south

That is the proper alternative although it was not available for some of us.

Course other's that have not had the benefit may try to talk about it!

 

[gemini5362]

That is the proper alternative although it was not available for some of us.

Course other's that have not had the benefit may try to talk about it!

I am not worried about doing that. If it gets down to -40 in arkansas you folks that live north of me will be frozen popsicles. I dont remember when the last time I saw it get to 0 degrees F
here.

 

[Iplayfarmer]

if it gets down to -40c or even to -40F I will take other measures it is called pulling up stakes and moving farther south

No way!! It's the occasional -40F that keeps my area sparsely populated and keeps my land affordable. Plus, I'll go through a hundred Idaho winters vs. a single Arkansas summer.

I'm sure you'd say just the opposite, though. Different strokes for different folks.