Pulling electrical wire -

[Egon]

How would one tell if the conduit was assembled before or after pulling the wire?

Perhaps post assembly would twist wires causing unseen problems?

Egon

 

[DaveNay]

I would also suggest installing some of this:

Underground Warning Tape

(This was just the first one I found on the web, your elecric supplier will have it too.)

So that you can find the conduit in the future.

If it is metallic conduit, and near the surface, you may not need it though.

Dave

 

[Inspector507]

Have I ever done it?? I'll never tell /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif
I would suppose there are too many opportunities to damage the cable insulation on sharp edges as you slide the conduit on the wire.

 

[8NTX]

Inspector - thanks for the heads-up on the soap. Will use the lube that Lazy suggested. And I plan on going with the rigid metal 90's and maybe even 45's.

Joe1 - I plan on building special stands or sawhorses to mount the spools on; total of 4 spools two abreast. Might use the tractor and boom pole to lift them if necessary, but at 155 pounds per 1000', 620 ft. each will only weigh 96 pounds plus the weight of the spool, so maybe two guys can handle it.

Bird - I've considered pulling wire as I assembled the conduit, but every electrician I've talked to thinks I'm nuts. If I do it one at a time, that will be 60 reconnections of the pull rope so time consuming, but that's one thing I have more than anything.

There will be 4 people doing the pull, maybe 5 if I get lucky. The electrician thinks that two men will be able to pull the whole thing in a single run without a pull box, but I don't know. May have to look into a rig to pull with. Wonder if a come-along might help? Too bad the tractor won't float, or I could use that. I'm going down tomorrow to look at the feasibility of straightening out the run through the woods. A day spent with a chain saw and brush hog might be worth it. Will still have to wind around some big trees, though. Should also save me 50-75 feet of wire if I do that.

Thanks for all the help so far, guys. You guys have given me more help and ideas than two other DIY and electrical forums combined. As usual...TBN is the best. Now I just wish more of you lived near Athens, TX.....we would have one heckuva TBN wire-pullin' Texas barbecue and beer bash. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[Bird]

Steve, like I said, when I was putting the wire and conduit in new, I run the wire through as I assembled the conduit (the only problem I noticed was being time consuming because I was careful to not damage any insulation). However, when I pulled new wire through existing underground conduit to my barn, I attached the new wire to the old and pulled it with my Kubota while my brother fed it into the other end.

 

[Nasty135]

8ntx, Well this is a good one, I was thinking (sometimes this is dangerous ) this has been done before, using 1 1/2" gray underground pvc you can connect to panel out of your first 90 into the ground and one 10' length layout your cable for the whole distance and slide the pvc 10' lengths over your cable and glue to the first piece, continue til you get to the other end dropping in trench as you go keeping the section your currently working with above ground with a pole under it bridging it over the trench and slide it as you go, It's flexable enough to do this and when you get to the last 90 measure and put the right length on it and your in.. That how I when about it , then laid phone & ca tv on top for those rainy days... I hope this is understandable sometimes I have trouble explaining things /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Junkman]

that is how I did mine also, but I cheated and went with a larger diameter PVC pipe. Easier to work with and not much differance in cost.

 

[LWFrisk]

The last time I had to make a long pull with heavy wire, I laid out the PVC conduit for the long part of the run but kept it on top of the ground. I pulled the wire through the conduit, then dropped it in the trench, put the 90 degree sweeps on each end then into the boxes. The PVC is fairly flexible and the gentle curves around the trees was easy to do. I actually laid the wire and the conduit out on the street. wrapped the conduit with a rope tied to my truck and a pull rope tied to my tractor and pulled the wire through. I had a friend watch the wire as it pulled through to make sure the insulation was not damaged. Then I used my tractor to drag it (Conduit with wire in place) to the area where the trench had been dug. Backfilled the trench after the wire was connected. -- I always use much larger conduit than requried.

I am not an electrician, but it worked great for me

LWFrisk

 

[EddieWalker]

I'm confused.

First, I dig the trench.

Second, I unroll the wire along the length of the trench.

Third, I slide the conduit through the wire along the trench.

Fourth, I roll it into the trench.

Last, I bury the trench.

Seems simple, what am I missing?

 

[8NTX]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I'm confused.

First, I dig the trench.

Second, I unroll the wire along the length of the trench.

Third, I slide the conduit through the wire along the trench.

Fourth, I roll it into the trench.

Last, I bury the trench.

Seems simple, what am I missing? )</font>

Eddie - I agree with you, and that's how I was gonna do it before the electricians said that NEC code doesn't like that method for some reason. But I guess the 90 deg. and 45 deg. turns make it a little more difficult than it sounds.

 

[Junkman]

No need to be confused.... do it any way that you find easiest to do it for you. My suggestion was to have the wire on the rolls and the spools supported so you could pull 10' and put that into the first piece of conduit. Then pull off another 12' of wire and slip the conduit over the wire and glue the two ends together. Keep doing this till you get to the end. Just lie the conduit on the ground as you go. When you get to the end, then put the entire run into the trench and cover. Use newspaper on the ground when you are making the splices of conduit to keep everything clean. This was the easierst method for me. If I had a lot of help and a winch, I might have done it differantly, but I didn't and my method worked. In the end, that is all that I was concerned with. No one was looking over my shoulder to see if it was the NEC approved method and when it was done, no one could tell either. I believe that the proper experession is .... "there is more than one way to skin a cat!"...... /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif Your project, so do what you think is best for your circumstances. No matter how you do it, remember to keep the dirt out of the pipe and to clean and glue each connection well.

 

[Lazy]

Hi
Junkman it seems to me each time you add a section of conduit you are then pulling thru that section and all previous sections and without the conduit anchored after about 3 sections you will be moving both wire and conduit. Thats why you need to have the conduit installed so it can't move before trying to pull the wire, if pulling the wire into the conduit first were the easiest way to do it then electricians would do it that way. but if it works fer you then do it that way. If it was me I would install the conduit then pull the wire. and use the largest size conduit you can afford to make the pulling easier. the more you handle the wire the more likely you will damage it.

Charlie.

 

[DannyD]

I like the put the conduit on the wire, glue it and let it go method. Who is going to tell the inspector if you dont. If you have room to lay out each section between the boxes that would be the simplest method.........just dont pay attention to the guy with the camera in the car painted gray and having inspector stickers on it. I doubt the inspectors main objective is to make you do it again

 

[keeney]

The reason the code requires the conduit to be assembled first is of the high probability of damage to the wire when assembling conduit around it. Especially metal conduit.

Conduit fittings are designed to protect the wire from sharp edges after they are assembled, but not necessaily before they are assembled.

- Rick

 

[DannyD]

Reminds me of a story about a gas line inspector. Seems he refused a permit on a small thing, made the contractor fix it, then he would come back....

the guy fixed it, but that nite it also rained to beat the devil, inspector shows up and asked if he fixed it. He made the inspector get in 5 foot of water to inspect the small item. I really dont think this would happen again, but who knows.

 

[8NTX]

Fortunately, there are no inspectors to deal with. Property is in the country and no permits, inspections, etc. are required. I just want to do it right. I have decided, unless advised otherwise the day of installation, that I will put in a pull box and break it down into two sections. Use 2" pvc, connected at the main panel (not wiring); plenty of wire lube, and a total of 4 other helpers lending a hand (including the electrician).

If...I can straighten this out to 500 ft. or less by going through the woods, I will spend a day with the chain saw and brush hog clearing out 300 ft. or so through the woods wide enough for the trencher.

A couple of notes to others who offered advice and opinions: looked into solar, but decided against it since it was only going to save about $700 (net taking into account the 12V conversion for the hoist), and I would still need to run trail lights. Plus harder to guard against theft, since the boathouse is in a remote and secluded location out of sight of our house or even other property owners. And my cost will end up at around $2.10 per foot for the wire, elbows, pull box, and conduit.

I appreciate everyone's help, comments and advice on this one, because I truly am an amateur when it comes to wiring. It will happen one week from today, weather permitting.

 

[Egon]

Uh- I think you pull the wire through the conduit. Not pull the conduit over the wire.

Egon

 

[5030]

Egon:

Must be those Canadian cigarettes. I hear the tobacco causes dementia.

 

[SPIKER]

I somewhat agree with others.

for the cost and hassle of the 600 foot wire trench pulling conduit and such you could but a 5500 watt generator mount it on a small 3 point rig for the tractor and tractor it down to the boat house anytime you were going to need power out there! you will have plenty of power with that 5500 watt generator and only cost 500 bucks. plus a bit of time making a small trailer or 3 point mount set up. or jusst haul it in the tractor bucket if it has FEL.

otherwise yes assemble the conduit first, the chance of GLUE sticking to the wires is one of the reasons for assemble it first, beside the damage issue mentioned above....

use ONLY approved LUBE for the wires.

break the conduit outside the house where it is all straight feed and start the pull from there. the conduit that goes into the house can be left loose. then when the wire is out at the end of the boat house. (again leave the last few feet where the sub panel is going to be off the assembled conduit run. and pull out more than enough wire to push through the last few feet of conduit by hand with a small fish tape pulling from inside where the sub panel goes.) you need extra room in the trench at these points to assemble the ends of the conduit after the wire is in but if you plan it ahead of time it makes it a bit easier. DON'T mount the sub panel untill the wire is pulled up and into it and the conduit is glued.!

after the wire is all pulled and pushed and glued then wire it up...

anyhow my vote is for a generator. the solar is OK too. the cost to build a locable box and mount the generator or solar setup would be easy enough. but with a small portable generator I would just take it there when needed if you are worried about theft.!

Mark M /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

 

[Egon]

Nahh- - It's the cold , Stops blood circulation.

Egon