Question about UG electrical service conduit to shop building

[TC65023]

955Lincoln: holy cow, that is some rock garden you have there....my condition is about the same but with the jagged flint rock added to the mix. I don"t see direct bury anything working for either of us. I intend to use waste limestone screenings to bed my conduit, it's basically quarter inch rock to powder stuff and compacts well. I also intend to use the same material as temporary hard stone pavement inside my building, its about half the material price of quarried crushed stone. After a couple of years when all the settling is over I will pour a 6 inch slab in the garage area which is over 4 to 8 foot of compacted fill.

 

[TC65023]

jlukem: I can agree with your comments since you obviously don't have tons of rocks to deal with. My situation is much different, rocks, rocks and more rock.....

 

[TC65023]

The electrical coop engineer says the new disconnect panel they installed at the pole is up to code, and the house panel which was installed before 2008 with a 3 wire service and driven ground system is okay.

He made it plain that any work beyond the new panel location is my responsibility, which I already knew. Also He stated that any future service extended from the new disconnect panel to a building such as a garage or shop must be a four wire service.

Since I will have a electrician installing the new service to my garage/shop, I will ask have him for a price to re-work the house service by pulling the incoming 3 wire service and re-installing same with a ground wire. At that time he can separate the ground and neutral in the same panel.

Does this make sense or should I do more?

 

[Kyle241]

GRS, just wanted to say, I appreciate your input on the wiring business even though this isn't my post! I'm about to run lines from my house panel to a sub in the garage and I keep questioning myself over and over on everything I need to do!

 

[grsthegreat]

For a practical answer...

you need to protect internal components from water and you need to protect the wire from overheating.

The NEC is about life safety and not necessarily a design guide. It has to protect the idiot from itself.

If I had a 250' run and it was just for power, there would be no plumbing to bridge water, air, rodents and fumes from one place to the other.
I could give a crap less about frost lines or crushing forces beyond 6" under cover.

My truck sits outside when it's 0 degrees and the headlights still work in the morning. Those wires aren't buried.

That's my two cents.
-Luke

thats cause you live in Texas. Here in pacific northwest the frost line can easily go down to 24" below ground level. The movement and heaving of the ground plays havoc with buried lines.

 

[grsthegreat]

The electrical coop engineer says the new disconnect panel they installed at the pole is up to code, and the house panel which was installed before 2008 with a 3 wire service and driven ground system is okay.

He made it plain that any work beyond the new panel location is my responsibility, which I already knew. Also He stated that any future service extended from the new disconnect panel to a building such as a garage or shop must be a four wire service.

Since I will have a electrician installing the new service to my garage/shop, I will ask have him for a price to re-work the house service by pulling the incoming 3 wire service and re-installing same with a ground wire. At that time he can separate the ground and neutral in the same panel.

Does this make sense or should I do more?

YOU dont need to work about the old service to the house. It was done before the code change. My house is done with 3 wires, as are millions of other homes.
All im saying is any new work done after 2008 needs 4 wires.
I really wouldnt worry about the house.

My 2 cents.

 

[grsthegreat]

GRS, just wanted to say, I appreciate your input on the wiring business even though this isn't my post! I'm about to run lines from my house panel to a sub in the garage and I keep questioning myself over and over on everything I need to do!

no problem. and good luck

 

[955Lincoln]

The electrical coop engineer says the new disconnect panel they installed at the pole is up to code, and the house panel which was installed before 2008 with a 3 wire service and driven ground system is okay.

Sounds a bit odd to me. When they installed the new panel did they seperate the neutral and ground at the house or has the house always been wired as a sub-panel? I wonder if you have the neutral and ground bonded at 2 locations?

 

[TC65023]

955Lincoln: when the house was built in 1980 the main panel was installed and directly wired to the meter. The neutral and ground were at that time bonded together. My point exactly, the newly installed main panel at the pole and the original house panel both have the neutral and ground bonded together which I think is a no, no!

 

[TC65023]

Update: yesterday I got both the 2 inch and 3/4 inch conduit in the 230 foot trench and backfilled. The work went about as expected, most of it is 2 foot deep or more. Avoided hitting the electric and telephone service to the house. Cut through a old brittle drain PVC pipe from my well pit which needed rerouting anyway. I will do that over the weekend. Ran into a ton of rocks, will be picking them up later today and hauling to a ditch. Hopefully will get the entire area dressed down and seeded early next week before it rains again.

Expect to install the 1 inch PEX water service line, shut-off valve and frostless hydrant next week with the 4 inch SDR35 sewer line work to follow. Will dress up the final grade at the outside building wall and begin concentrating on the inside work.