Question on tractor model

tillboy2001 · Sep 12, 2004

I've danced around this subject in other posts, but I'd like to get the scoop now. An in-law has what he says is a 1956 Ford model NAA. He bought a manual for it that the supply place recommended (they apparently told him this is the correct model). Based on the picture you see attached, is this the Model NAA? What's it's horsepower rating? The book says it makes 110 ft lbs of torque, but doesn't mention horsepower. Ironically, the new New Holland TC 35's and 40's we're looking at don't show a TORQUE rating! I'd like to know the horsepower of the old Ford tractor and I'd also like to know the torque rating of a New Holland (2004) TC35DA and TC40DA.
Thanks /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Bob_Skurka · Sep 12, 2004

It is hard to tell from the picture exactly what model that is, it might be a Jubilee or NAA. I am not sure, but I think the first generation 600 also looked like that. Headlamps are probably in the wrong location, I belive they should have been mounted on the rear fender, but again, I've only got limited knowledge of the mid-50's Fords. The HP range for the 8N thru NAA was from about 26 to about 31hp. Many people beleive the HP ratings were much higher, but they were very modest HP machines. I'm sure someone can give you more specific information.

I would say that a new 4wd 35hp tractor is not anything that you can really compare to an antique. The new machine will out maneuver, and out work the old machine in ways that you can't even comprehend until you work them side by side. I think a 24hp modern CUT, despite its small size, will do about as much work as the old Ford, provided you are not plowing a field or doing other ground engaging work.

Soundguy · Sep 13, 2004

That is indeed a hundred series tractor. Hard to tell without looking at the serial number exactly what it is.. but i"m guesisng 601 workmaster. The sn will be to the rear of the starter.. on the bellhousing, on an angled 1x4 flat boss.

You can tell it is a hundred series because it has no axle nut on the rear hub. NAA ( 1953 and 1954 ) had the rear axle nut. Starting in 1955, the hundred series went to that smooth inner hub.

The engine is probably the 134ci red tiger.. though the 172ci used the same block, so can't 'visually' tell from the picture.

The 134ci red tiger pumped out about 32pto hp, according to the I&T F0-19 manual. The NAA ( same engine ) and the 6xx hundred series were made to pull 3 bottoms 12 or 14" plow.. or a 6' brush mower. And I can assure you that you could hitch that up to a nh TC 30 and drag it around your yard with the tc 30 flappin...( mainly due to weight.. ) As far as i know.. the tc 30 isn't specced for a 6' brush mower.. nor does it have the weight of the naa-6xx. The Naa-6xx will also have both draft and position control live hyds.

Depending on what model that is.. eg.. 651 , 601, 641.. ( or 8xx series.. ) etc.. you may or may not have live pto.

If you need any more info.. let me know.. ford tractors are my pet project.. I've got three working ones from 46-54, as well as using a couple of the NH diesels.. though I love the other red and green antiques as well.

Soundguy

jinman · Sep 13, 2004

PZ..., the Jubilee had a 134 cu. in. engine and it's advertised 31 hp was rated at only 2,000 rpm. At 2,400 or above that hp is probably closer to 35. That's why many people say it was underrated. I've checked the Repair Manual on the Class III Boomers and I can't find engine torque specs on the Boomers. I can tell you that the engines are rated at 2600 rpm. The PTO speed is only 2400 rpm, so the NH tractors are not running at full hp when you run them at 540 rpm.

I think you'll find these little diesel engines with much lower cu. in. sizes produce plenty of torque to spin the tires. Consider this, the Jubilee weighed only about 2500 lb. The TC 35DA is about 3000 lb and the 40DA and 45DA about 200 lb more. With loaded R4 tires, you can add another 800 lb. Put a loader on and you are up over 5000 lb. Easily, that is double the weight of the Jubilee. With MFWD, that means you will get all the torque your engine can produce to the ground. I can guarantee you that the new TCs will outpull the Jubilee with either R4 or R1 tires. My Jubilee will spin the rear tires long before the engine runs out of torque. The new tractors get all your power to the ground much more effeciently because of MFWD and weight.

Your choice of gear or hydro transmissions is best determined by whether you intend to do a lot of tillage. The best tillage machine will be gear and the better loader, boxblade, and possibly mowing machine will be the hydrostatic transmission.

There are some who would say that the TC35 is underpowered for the weight of the tractor. Frankly, I don't know because I've been spoiled by my TC45D. I've never operated a TC35, so you'd have to talk to someone who owns one.

Let's find out what model Ford tractor you have. /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
Ford only built the 1953 Golden Jubilee and the 1954 Jubilee. Only the 1953 model was called "Golden." If your tractor is a Jubilee (NAA), it was probably a 1954 model sold to your GFIL in 1956. I'm attaching a partial blow-up of your picture of the tractor. I've placed a green arrow showing exactly where the tractor model and serial number are engraved into the transmission case. It's directly behind the starter motor. There is a flat area that has a curved lip about 1/2" high. On the front of that lip is where you look. Many tractors have been painted so many times it is hard to see. You might have to scrape off a little paint to see the numbers. Jubilee serial numbers started with "NAA" followed by the number (1953: 1 thru 77474, 1954 starts at 77475). Let us know what you find. /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Soundguy · Sep 13, 2004

( The TC 35DA is about 3000 lb and the 40DA and 45DA about 200 lb more. With loaded R4 tires, you can add another 800 lb. Put a loader on and you are up over 5000 lb. )

A real apples to apples comparison eh? You'll notice i specifically said tc 30. Also.. I was comparing tractor to tractor.. not tractor to loader- tractor-loaded tires-wheel, frame, 3pt weights.. etc.

( the Jubilee weighed only about 2500 lb )

The 8n weighed more than that from the factory.. dry.. The NAA weighted more.

( The new tractors get all your power to the ground much more effeciently because of MFWD and weight.
)

I compaired a 2wd tc30 with the hundred series.. In that case.. superior weight will determin better pull, considering both with agg tires, and 2wd. It's a given that both tractors can spin their wheels.. that is.. they run out of traction long before they run out of HP.

The weight of a 6xx series was 3321 according to my book... and that's dry.

( numbers started with "NAA" followed by the number )

Notice the rear axle hub.. it has no axle nut.. It CAN't be a NAA/jubilee. The hundred series used the smooth hub. The hundred series rear end will not bolt up to a NAA/jubilee tranny casting.. so It's not a hybred rear end.

The 134 engine however could have been transplanted from an NAA.. etc.. but you wouldn't know unles sit was an early 53, as the sn on the early 53 was on the head just above the exhaust manifold.
Still .. the sn will tell him what hundred series it is.. lots of choices in the 6xx / 8xx range.

Soundguy

tillboy2001 · Sep 13, 2004

Thanks for the replies. I did some more checking on the net and found a list of serial numbers and more. Ways to check the year. I'm sure it's not the NAA now. I'll go get some pictures of it and also the serial number, this evening.

I will tell ya, this old thing has plenty of torque. Grandpa is old fashioned and doesn't believe in reving the engine. I swear he has that thing just above idle when we pull full grown black locust trees around the field (with rootball attached)...about a 50' long/tall tree, maybe around 18" in diameter at the base. Recently had some pushed over and dug out by a backhoe. We pull them over to the burn pile, trim them up and then drag the 'good' wood back to another site to be cut up for firewood. I keep thinking to myself "you better rev it up a little"...but then he pops the clutch, the chain tightens and off it goes.

I'll get the details on the serial number and so on later today. I'm curious to see exactly what it is. I think he has the wrong manual.

sweettractors · Sep 13, 2004

Soundguy, Where would you start looking for solution to my problem? We bought this 960 Ford and had to rebuild the P/S and Hydraulic pump and have got everything going , except, Position Control on the 3 point. Where would you look first? I have already changed lever positions under the seat and the easy stuff.--Ken Sweet

Soundguy · Sep 13, 2004

I havn't specifically worked on a 960, however i do believe i have a master parts catalog at home that covers the hundred series, I'll take a look.

That said.. the top cover for the hyds on a NAA is going to be very close to the hundred series. You have the engine mounted hyd pump, and either a manifold or pipes back to the rear chamber, and up to the top cover.

Did you get the 4gpm vane pump rebuilt.. or have the piston pump installed. Not that it makes alot of difference.. but the vane pump has a hard time self priming.

Remove your right side inspection cover and peer in there with a flashlight. Fluid spraying from the top or bottom cover, inside right front is the high pressure feed, and means a gasket is blown, or a casting is bad.. etc. A spray from the top above the cylinder is the 3 gaskets mounting the cyl to the top cover, and high pressure feed, and of course.. you could have a hole in the piston and letting oil exhaust out the mouth of the cylinder.

Also.. that system uses an unloading valve I believe.. that could be bad.. not to mention the system relief could be bad.

All of those options except the pump prime will require the top cover to come off.

I read and post over at ytmag.com.. they have a decent amount of parts. The NH dealer still stocks many as well.

Lets see.. 960.. is that a trike model? I seem to remember some of the 7xx and 9xx were trikes or offsets.

I'll post back if I get more info.

Soundguy

Soundguy · Sep 13, 2004

I found these repair kits so far..

Soundguy

Hydraulic Lift Cover Repair Kit - For tractors 500 thru 4000, 1955-64. Lift cover repair gasket kit. (Part No: LCRK55\64) $14.95

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Hydraulic Pump Parts - Wobble Shaft For 4 Cylinder Models (1953-1964) Using NAAG00D Or NCAG00F Pump Assemblies (Part No: NCA966E) $45.84

tillboy2001 · Sep 13, 2004

Ok guys - pictures later, but here's what I found stamped in the area you told me to look:

b40

(diamond) 5I354 (diamond)

I understand the diamonds before and after means the it has cast iron piston sleeves and the I is actually a 1. According to a web site I looked at.

What model is it???!!!