Resolving self leveling dislike

[LD1]

I agree with this 100%, the biggest problem for me is handling large squares - I can't tilt the bale forks back far enough to stack large squares 4 high. I can pick up two at a time and do it that way, which is fine most of the time, but not when I need to handle them one at a time, like picking the top bale off, or for very large/heavy bales.

I was thinking of replacing the top tie rail with a rail that has short stroke hydraulic cylinders. That way when fully extended, the self leveling function will still work, but when the bucket is raised and the cylinders are retracted, that would allow the bucket to curl back a little more. It would have to be controlled separately, but perhaps I could use the 3rd function control for this.

Hmm...

The cylinder would have to be rigidly attached to the top rail. Sorta how the curl cylinders have the extension at the base.

You need to make the top tie rail one with the cylinder. If you plan on just a pivot pin ...now you have 3 pivots on that function. End of tie rail, tie rail to cylinder, then cylinder back to loader post. That will be bad news if you do that

 

[Oz_Kioti]

Interesting on the last pic where the links from the bellcranks going to the back are a different color. It looks like the design lets the bellcrank rotate a little farther for more curl. Are these the original links?

Yes - stock standard:

 

[Realtornz]

Great discussion, I for one have learnt a lot in understanding self leveling in practical terms. Thanks new tractor owner.

 

[npalen]

Could the "tie rail" be made so that it slips over and clamps to the cylinder rod so it becomes integral and eliminating the 3rd joint you mention?

The cylinder would have to be rigidly attached to the top rail. Sorta how the curl cylinders have the extension at the base.

You need to make the top tie rail one with the cylinder. If you plan on just a pivot pin ...now you have 3 pivots on that function. End of tie rail, tie rail to cylinder, then cylinder back to loader post. That will be bad news if you do th

Yes - stock standard:

View attachment 727479

That is an interesting design and it clearly would tend to give more curl on the bucket.

 

[ptsg]

Great discussion, I for one have learnt a lot in understanding self leveling in practical terms. Thanks new tractor owner.

The function of a self leveling loader is easier to understand if you think you're moving a pallet with the forks.

You start on the ground with the pallet leveled. Once you start lifting, the self leveling mechanism will keep the pallet leveled during the entire time you're lifting. On a non self leveling loader, you need to do two functions at once with the joystick in order to keep the pallet level while lifting, otherwise that pallet would fall on the top of the tractor.

 

[ptsg]

Another possible solution for the curl issue, could be getting a piece of thick wall square tube that would slide over the factory square tube. Cut the factory one wherever it was needed and weld the bigger piece of tube to the other end. Then drill a couple holes and put a pin to lock in place. Make it like the telescopic stabilizers.

However, doesn't look like they left much room to play on that area, so it may be better just cut the base of the cylinder whatever length is needed.

 

[npalen]

This spec sheet on a new Kioti loader shows a rollback angle of 54 degrees which would be 10 degrees more than on the OP's (Boss 302) loader.

 

[Boss 302]

Thanks Oz, for the paint tip that does look like a good match, I have also been told that the Chevrolet (bad word) orange engine paint is a close match, but man that would be hard for me to put chevy paint on anything I own. Just kidding.

 

[SwingOak]

The cylinder would have to be rigidly attached to the top rail. Sorta how the curl cylinders have the extension at the base.

You need to make the top tie rail one with the cylinder. If you plan on just a pivot pin ...now you have 3 pivots on that function. End of tie rail, tie rail to cylinder, then cylinder back to loader post. That will be bad news if you do that

Yes, I know. It would have to be a sliding rail/telescoping tube or something so that the cylinder only extended and retracted the leveling tube. The only pivots would be the same ones it has now - on each end.

Basically, I'm talking about changing the tube length hydraulically.

 

[Boss 302]

Happy New Year everyone, thanks for all of the feedback from everyone. I took a couple of pics with the bucket full curl and dump cylinders fully extended. I looked at a bunch of pics trying to see if it is more of a Kioti thing and I'm beginning to think it may be.

 

[LD1]

That is pretty pathetic rollback. But that don't look like a OEM bucket. Wonder if the OEM bucket is better.

I'd explore doing what I suggested earlier though if you want to keep that bucket

 

[Boss 302]

It isn't an OEM bucket but the OEM one isn't any better.

 

[LouNY]

Interesting pics, is that a stock bucket?
One option would be to redo the qa, put a spacer in the lower section to increase the bucket roll back.
Also those look like very short stroke cylinders on the curl function.
A person could get longer stoke cylinders and shorten the fixed spacer length to get more hydraulic movement,
for the curl back, keeping the overall length the same. The only drawback would be the possibility of spilling over
the back of the bucket at full lift and full curl.
That way the level function would still work the same for pallet forks and such.

 

[Boss 302]

I have a set of pallet forks that I probably use a couple times a year so to me it's no big deal using the curl function to keep the pallet level. We use the pallet fork on my buddy's McCormick with a non-self-leveling loader and it works just fine.

 

[Lemo]

Duplicolor DE1620 Chevrolet Orange is a pretty good rattle can match. Actually a nice paint for a rattle can. There are two Chevrolet Oranges and the other one is a poor match. Available at O'Reillys.

Rustoleum Deep Slate 312818 works fairly well for the grey.

 

[Boss 302]

Thanks Lemo, I'll give them a try.

 

[ovrszd]

Those last two pics tell it all. The Rollback sucks. You can't even get your bucket full of material unless pushing into a large pile.

Curious to see the solution. Thanks for the pics.

 

[ruffdog]

Those last two pics tell it all. The Rollback sucks. You can't even get your bucket full of material unless pushing into a large pile.

Curious to see the solution. Thanks for the pics.

^^Agree, the rollback is not good. Why on earth do they think they need that much dump angle while compromising rollback?

 

[RoyJackson]

^^Agree, the rollback is not good. Why on earth do they think they need that much dump angle while compromising rollback?

Is yourself leveling mechanical or built in to the hydraulics?

The Deere version is controlled by the strut above the lift cylinder as shown in the picture.
Took me a while, but I really like it, especially for pallet forks

 

[holeycow]

My dk90 OEM bucket rolls back way further and still hangs vertical to past vertical when dumping/shaking. My HLA double tine bale fork will roll back adequately to go down pretty steep hills. When the bale is picked up near the very bottom and the loader kept as low as possible, I could go nearly straight down....well not really but you get the idea..

anyway, couldn't the attachment points for the bucket (perhaps even the same for the spear) be modified for a little more rollback without losing the whole self leveling thing (which is pretty handy at times and can also prevent dropping a load on yourself)?Perhaps the spear receiver tapered tubes could be re-oriented to fit them more up-angled.

I didn't like the self levelling for some time, nor did I use the level indicator rod. After a time, I realized that both features are desirable for me. I harvest and feed about a thousand bales a year and do a wee bit of dirt work, as well as general lifting and moving.

Roy, his is mechanical like yours...btw.