Road and Driveway maintenance

[N80]

I think a BB with a TnT would be fine for maintaining a road but most people don't have a TnT. For moving gravel and light dirt around, crowning and such, a rear blade seems like the cheapest option.

For renovating a badly worn or very old road I think a BB would be very useful, but still hard to make a crown without a TnT.

The graders shown above look great for flat level roads, but I'm not sure how you'd make a crown and or ditches with them unless the crown was already there.

When I can afford new gravel for my cabin drive, I will dig the current drive up and level things out with the BB and then hope to get a rear blade to crown and ditch and spread gravel. But man is gravel ever expensive!

 

[schmism]

id agree with other posters about a BB blade being good for cutting new roads, and or rehabing old worn out roads that need pot hols cut out with scarafiers etc.

but when it comes to maintaining a half way decent road bed, a rear blade is going to SO much more quicker and usefull.

 

[Renze]

It might be an option to buy a box blade and add one or two extra lower link arm brackets, to mount the whole thing under an angle when needed. that would give you the versatility of both. Though limited, it might be a fair compromise between overall versatility of the box blade, and the crowning ability of the grader blade.

I have the moldboard ready for the grader i want to build. I was just thinking, i have stainless saw blades of an old silage block cutter, which i could weld on as a wear edge. If it was sharp enough to cut silage for 20 years with no visible wear, it must hold up as well when it is used to maintain farm roads every spring (before the manure spreading season) and late summer (before the rain season)

 

[Egon]

Box blade -- rear blade ??

Both work very well in their intended usage.

Box blades are terrific for small confined spaces. As soon as you get long distances the back blade with gauge wheels will shine. The significant thing is being able to roll a windrow of material back and forth on long distances. This action usually lays down a little material as each pass is made and also keeps segregation to a minimum. In the process of rolling the windrow back and forth the low spots are filled till you have an even surface. Box blades are not designed for this function.

Now for the final answer?? a grader will do the best job, especially if the operator is willing to talk back cause that means he's good and has a job in waiting.

 

[kcook]

I have got to ask, what is TnT?

KC

 

[patrick_g]

+++Can you explain how the box scraper will work spreading out a pile of limestone dumped in one place? Do you use the FEL first, THEN use the box scraper? +++

If the gravel is dumped by an end dump in one compact pile then the FEL is a good way to start spreading it.

If it is dumped by a belly dump (better for you and a load is larger and it is usually more economical. Then I drive along the elongated pile and can use FEL, box blade, or both to knock the top off the elongated pyramidal pile in one or more long passes. As soon as can be done with an acceptable degree of safety I drive on top of the long pile, again with FEL, box, or both. and remove the top of the pile. As soon as the gravel fills the box and or bucket it flows sideways (desired action) and begins to get wide instead of tall. Depending on the size of the gravel and % of fines etc. I may or may not have the HP or traction to use both the bucket and the box simultaneously. This works very quickly and does a good job. Once I have the gravel relatively well scattered I use the box mostly. After the job is well started I do some back dragging with the bucket. It is an experience thing, which end of the tractor to use when.

+++Does your Box scraper tilt by hydraulics to angle to create the crown in the middle? I know I can do this with the adjuster on my rear 3-point, just takes a few more minutes to get off and monkey with the arm.+++

Frankly I'd be hating life if I didn't have hydraulic Top and Tilt (TNT) I adjust the blade a lot while working and I can't imagine being able or willing to get on and off the tractor dozens if not hundreds of times to make adjustments. I'd have to find a different way of working and probably would be posting about how I don't like the box blade and don't find it so useful. I have three independent hydraulic adjustments of the blade: 1. left and right tilt, 2. "curl", i.e. angle of attack, and 3. raise and lower the whole thing. Having a blade on the back so I can back up and use it like a mini-dozer is also very nice.

+++ a back scraper blade would probably work best for snow removal.+++

I find that backing up to it with the Box Blade is nearly as good as a variable back blade and I don't have to change implements AGAIN! I have done some minor snow removal with the FEL and it works ok for me. If climate change brings south central Oklahoma lots more snow then I will likely look for a way to mount my adjustable angle back blade up front on the FEL which I feel would be a superior snow handling system.

+++ The box scraper with a little adjusting will do all the road maintenance well EXCEPT the snow removal.+++

Used while backing up, the box blade can do pretty good with snow. My angle blade can be reversed and used backing the tractor up too. Snow removal always works better if you don't have to drive through the snow with the tractor for the implement to get to the snow, i.e. better if the implement hits the snow first. This is why I recommend backing up with the box or the angle blade and why I think an angle blade mounted on the FEL wild be the best of all the stuff mentioned.

++Did I sum this up correctly?+++

Except for minor differences you did fine, Dave

Pat

(Gratuitous extra characters to please the post processor.)

 

[Tig]

I have got to ask, what is TnT?

KC

Hydraulic top link and hydraulic side link on a three point hitch. Top and Tilt. T&T or TnT

 

[patrick_g]

Kcook, TNT is a terrific thing. It lets you easily make repetitive adjustments that you would never make with manual adjustments as it is too time consuming. With the box blade I can adjust the angle of attack and spill out gravel in a thin steady stream wth much better control than raising and lowering the 3PH. Likewise for scraping in the dirt. A back blade really works well with hydraulic tilt control which lets you react to varying conditions as they occur, sometimes gradually not all at once. There is just no way anyone is going to make fine continuous adjustments to a manually adjusted top or side link as they are moving along.

There is virtually no comparison to manually adjusting 3PH vs TNT. Of course, if you are row cropping in a well smoothed field or just mowing a "putting green" lawn and only make one set of adjustments per day then TNT is no big deal.

The difference between TNT and manual adjust is at least 1000 times the difference between a manual and an automatic tranny in a car. It would be more like the difference between hand cranking and electric start on a car that died every couple minutes.

Pat

 

[darkviper]

Hoelscher Commercial Products - GR Grader

this would be the best for roads both grading and touching up. However i have not priced it yet but looks very expensive. But would give you the most flexability I just like the expensive toys so i had to throw this in here

of course if you were real serious then go all the way with the one pass solution
Caterpillar: Products>Machines

go for the cat 24 M now you are playing with power)

 

[patrick_g]

I just like the expensive toys so i had to throw this in here

Be sure to post pix of you on your copy of any of these expensive toys you are using on a project. It is always good to see a concrete example of a tool in use.

Pat

 

[STORMTRQQPER]

No bigger than a 5' box grader for a 27 horse. Otherwise, it will add too much drag & all 4 wheels will start spinning.

 

[STORMTRQQPER]

As far as brands go, there is not a whole lot of difference between most, except price. Unless you go with on that has hydraulic operated teeth, they are $500-$700.

 

[kcook]

Hoelscher Commercial Products - GR Grader

this would be the best for roads both grading and touching up. However i have not priced it yet but looks very expensive. But would give you the most flexability I just like the expensive toys so i had to throw this in here

of course if you were real serious then go all the way with the one pass solution
Caterpillar: Products>Machines

go for the cat 24 M now you are playing with power)

It looks great but my guess its a little exspensive

KC

 

[kcook]

Kcook, TNT is a terrific thing. It lets you easily make repetitive adjustments that you would never make with manual adjustments as it is too time consuming. With the box blade I can adjust the angle of attack and spill out gravel in a thin steady stream wth much better control than raising and lowering the 3PH. Likewise for scraping in the dirt. A back blade really works well with hydraulic tilt control which lets you react to varying conditions as they occur, sometimes gradually not all at once. There is just no way anyone is going to make fine continuous adjustments to a manually adjusted top or side link as they are moving along.

There is virtually no comparison to manually adjusting 3PH vs TNT. Of course, if you are row cropping in a well smoothed field or just mowing a "putting green" lawn and only make one set of adjustments per day then TNT is no big deal.

The difference between TNT and manual adjust is at least 1000 times the difference between a manual and an automatic tranny in a car. It would be more like the difference between hand cranking and electric start on a car that died every couple minutes.

Pat

I was thinking of getting a remote cylinder added to what ever tractor I get. Should I look at 2?

KC

 

[Tig]

Yeah, get the top link and the side link. I just finished building a TnT on my B7100. I learned a lot from the folks here while doing it. Pics in this thread.
http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/customization/96304-need-hydraulic-advice-2.html
If you search the forums you'll find pics of some really profesional builds.

 

[daveinnh]

We have a Kubota L4310 (bought used) and use a 7' Tufline rear blade for plowing(or dragging snow?). The Tufline has reinforcement behind the blade to resist crimping/bending. Ag tires loaded w/ Rim-Guard but w/o chains seems to work well in the snow and mud. (BTW, a neighbor bought R-4 tires and doesn't have clearance for chains). The (M-F) dealer refused to sell any more Landpride because of crimping.

Our drive is 700' with a 200' circle at the house in central NH. The drive is about 4-5" of crushed gravel placed above a woven geotextile. A no-name 7' landscape rack dresses up the drive about 3 times in April when the frost comes out and again after several heavy rains the rest of year. We bush-hog a 7 acre pasture area.

A box blade may be nice, but our 2 manually controlled implements work well. If you're considering on becoming a professional landscaper, I'd get rear hydraulics and control equipment angles from the cab, but that's lots more $$$.

 

[patrick_g]

I was thinking of getting a remote cylinder added to what ever tractor I get. Should I look at 2?

KC

KC, TNT is a wonderful thing and you don't find folks who have them and learn to use them saying anything bad about them, typically the exact opposite, rave reviews. Mostly the folks who are nay sayers don't have them or didn't learn to use them well.

You do want both a hydraulic topping lift and hydraulic tilt. Typically you would remove the non adjustable side and replace it with the manually adjusted one and replace the manual one with the hydraulic cylinder. This gives you the most flexibility. You will want self canceling control valves (spring loaded to the off position.)

With the two adjustable links (manual and hydraulic) controlling tilt, I can tilt the box blade so far that I can trench with it, dragging the "corner" in the dirt.

Hydraulic raise and lower on the scarifiers (ripper teeth) is another wonderful thing.

TNT is NOT RESTRICTED to making box blading easier and much more productive. You can use TNT with many implements. I find it useful when running the PHD by myself, especially if I am on uneven or hilly terrain. If I want to mow close with the brush hog but not plow a furrow with one side or the other I can touch up the side to side attitude with a flick of a finger while driving. Once you have TNT AND get used to it you will NEVER want to do without it.

Can you get by without it? Of course you can. You can eat soup or your breakfast bowl of cereal and milk with your fingers too but after you have tried a proper spoon for a while you sort of get to appreciate the technological advance.

Pat

 

[Diesel-ME]

Well KC, I guess you are getting just a few replies to this question

Before I bought my 96" landscape rake with flip down blade and guage wheels I spent lots of time reading all the road maintenance threads here in TBN. I found a TON of useful info - including reasons to start with a box scraper, a back blade, pull-behind road grader and a landscape rake - clear as mud....

In any case, I was just re-reading your original post in this thread and it occured to me that you may be in the same situation as I am whereby you need to maintain a nicely built road with a good top coat of gravel (I assume this is what was implied by a new road "built to county specs..."..).

I have found the rake with blade to be real easy to use. I can get a good crown (or re-crown as the case may be) by cranking down the right top link. I start by using the blade to cut in and drag gravel in from the sides (angled). Then I flip the balde up and make a few passes with the rake. The last pass is with the guage wheels down. I also find that it's easy to scrape gravel up and then back up and push material back into low spots with the rake. I also like the visibility of the rake - you can easily see the material you are working with.

The only problem with this setup is cost - but if your road is good enough you could skip the fancy models with the blade option and add wheels later. Also the rake and blade are not going to rip down into hard packed material like scarifiers on a box scraper do. So ultimately you'll want both I'm sure.

Let us know what you end up with.

~paul

 

[kcook]

Well KC, I guess you are getting just a few replies to this question

Before I bought my 96" landscape rake with flip down blade and guage wheels I spent lots of time reading all the road maintenance threads here in TBN. I found a TON of useful info - including reasons to start with a box scraper, a back blade, pull-behind road grader and a landscape rake - clear as mud....

In any case, I was just re-reading your original post in this thread and it occured to me that you may be in the same situation as I am whereby you need to maintain a nicely built road with a good top coat of gravel (I assume this is what was implied by a new road "built to county specs..."..).

I have found the rake with blade to be real easy to use. I can get a good crown (or re-crown as the case may be) by cranking down the right top link. I start by using the blade to cut in and drag gravel in from the sides (angled). Then I flip the balde up and make a few passes with the rake. The last pass is with the guage wheels down. I also find that it's easy to scrape gravel up and then back up and push material back into low spots with the rake. I also like the visibility of the rake - you can easily see the material you are working with.

The only problem with this setup is cost - but if your road is good enough you could skip the fancy models with the blade option and add wheels later. Also the rake and blade are not going to rip down into hard packed material like scarifiers on a box scraper do. So ultimately you'll want both I'm sure.

Let us know what you end up with.

~paul

Any brand name? What model?

KC

 

[Diesel-ME]

KC,

I went with a Woods LR108-2 with blade and wheels. Based on pricing on the 108 ($1700 out the door), I'd guess that a model 106 (the right size the the tractor size that you mentioned) would run you $1400-ish...??...just call a few dealers. They probably have $150-$200 to negotiate with on the final price BTW.

Land Pride also makes some very similar stuff. I checked a few local dealers and found that Land Pride seems to run a for more $$s for some reason. Looks like they make nice stuff though. You would probably want an LR15 Series rake.

The only real draw back of the rake/blade is that you are not going to be able to cut down through hard packed gravel to completely eliminate rough areas like you can with a box w/ scarifiers. But for a smallish tractor I would think that you could drag a much wider rake/blade, say 72" than you could a box. Folks who I know that have 20-something HP tractors usually have 48" box scrapers - but I'm no expert about sizing in this case. The dealers will usually give you an honest assessment of the right fit for your needs.

~paul