ROPS Welding

[thingy]

Hangfire,yeah,,guess I was just trying to say that there shouldn't be an issue with safety here so there shouldn't be a roll bar failure over this,,get what you was saying,and your right,its a shame though that people/companies act like that,and we all know they do,,It just wouldn't concern me,,,even if the sueing thing came up,,it should be real easy for about anybody to tell if the little light brackets caused the roll bar to give and break or bend and hurt somebody,,shouldn't need an expert really,,but thats just me,,thingy

 

[Harvey7]

Here's how I did mine.

Some pre-drilled angle iron from Lowes/HD and some square U-Bolts. Lots of mounting places for lots of lights.

No drilling or welding required.

Nice job, quick and easy.

tina's husband.

 

[thingy]

Roy,yes I do know,and I don't gotta do now test to prove it,,have been around this stuff for 30 years,,welding a little angle or bracket on a roll bar to mount a couple of lights,,if welded correctly,will not hurt the rollbars performance if you happen to roll your tractor,yes Roy,I happen to know this.Some things I don't know,somethings I'm not sure of,,but this is one thing I know.And it would be alot better to weld it than drill holes in it,this is another thing I know.

Now all the other stuff,legal,dealers,,etc,,thats another matter,don't care really,just answering the guys question.

But,you all did bring up a good point about if dealer would let you trade it in and not try and rip you off by saying something like,,uh,huh!,,see you got them lights welded on to your rollbar! We can't buy that,,gotta deduct new roll bar price off,,[than off course they don't put a new roll bar on it,,they tell the next guy looking at it that this ones got custom lights,,welded on solid too!],,,thingy

 

[MikePA]

...if welded correctly...

Anyone with a folding ROPS knows it's possible to weld on them. That's not the issue. The issue is doing it correctly and realizing doing so shifts the liability from the mfgr to the welder. This welding on ROPS thread has gone the same direction as every other similar thread in the past.

Mfgrs tell you not to. Some TBNers, who wont be assuming any risk, tell you it's OK to weld or drill them, while others point out alternatives.

It's your ROPS, bigboyskioti. Take your pick.

 

[thingy]

Mike,don't have a folding rops,but why would it be ok to weld on it and not on one that don't fold,,I'm sure it must be a simple answer but right now,I can't think of it.
And of course you are responsible for your own safety,goes without saying,,,thingy edit here[just the word folded was used is all,as opposed to one that won't,]

 

[thcri]

Murph,,of course you could clamp something on it,you could also drill a few small holes and screw or bolt something to it,,and you could weld something to it,the question was,listen now,can the man weld somekinda bracket to roll bar to put a light on it,,WELD IT.
Hangfire,,know nothing about sueing people,but again the question was can he weld a little bracket or angle to bar,,not some hypothetical dooms day event that may happen or not down the road to someone at sometime. Some people must think this rollbar is made outta some speical steel that is strong,but if you put a little weld on it it turns to glass or something and I'm here telling you that ain't the case. Yeah,the manufactors got all kinds of rules and regulations and some for a good reason,cause they gotta assume the worst case and cover their @##,and some just cause some lawyer said if you say this most people won't read it and we got them if the time comes and we save money,,its a sue happy country made so by lawyers more than normal peoples greed. I'm just assuming the guy owns the tractor,and is an adult,with common sense,,also suggested to not do it if he was going to make a nasty weld with holes and under cut,,also assume its just a few inches at most of weld he is going to do,[he did say lights,not cutting bar into and making it longer or wider or something],,and I'm saying,he can do this safely,without worrying about the rollbar shattering or something else strange.
Roy,of course thats the reason people asks questions,,,I ask some myself,,but its nice to get the right answer,,this has evolved into a legal issue with manufactor,not if the guy can weld a light bracket onto his roll bar,,there may be reasons he don't want to,,just saying from a welding point of view,they ain't one,,,and again,that was the question. thingy

Yes the question was "can I weld" and the answer is yes I guess you can. I and eveyone else here was only cautioning to not. I am sure the original poster knew he could weld to it some how.

Just wanting to know have you or would you weld brackets for lights on the roll bar? I'm wanting to put a couple lights up there but am not sure what it would do to the metal integrity

If you don't want to warn other people of dangers then that is your right.

 

[Bob_Skurka]

Seems to me there are plenty of GOOD ALTERNATIVES to welding that will not void a warrenty, that will not shift legal liability, and that will not reduce trade in value, so that it becomes a simple and logical choice NOT to weld or drill a ROPS.

Personally, I took a piece of angle iron, cut it to match the width of my ROPS, rounded the edges so it looked like it was designed at the factory, and used a waterproof 2-part marine epoxy to glue it to the ROPS. It has something like a 5000# shear strength, is UV stabilized, and has been holding firm for 3+ years. After the glue set up over night I painted over the whole thing so everything matched. The lights were simply mounted to the piece of angle iron! My dealer was so impressed with it that they now offer it as an option to their customers.

If you have an older, or a cheap no-name Chinese tractor, something that doesn't have trade in value or don't care about liability or warrenties, then weld on it. If you have a newer tractor then the choice is pretty simple given that there are plenty of alternatives to welding or drilling. Clamps, magnets, epoxy, etc. . .

 

[thingy]

Well good enough than murph,,I just don't see any dangers here,,and this sort of stuff is what I do,so while not an expert in anything,,not just saying it to be saying it,know a little bit about it,,but you all are right,,enoughs been said I guess,he can make up his own mind,,,thingy

 

[MikePA]

Mike,don't have a folding rops,but why would it be ok to weld on it and not on one that don't fold..

I should have explained more. Folding ROPS have hinges welded on them, therefore it's OK to weld on the material that makes up the ROPS since the factory (or their supplier) welds the hinges on.

 

[John_Mc]

Since just about everyone out there wants to add lights or some other type of brackets to their ROPS...does anyone on here have a contact in the business that can offer the suggestion?

Actually, I've already done that, at least with New Holland. A couple of years ago, my dealer asked if I would be willing to speak with a couple of NH engineers who were visiting the area and wanted to speak with owners about how they were using their tractors and what they liked or disliked about it. Of course I jumped at the chance. One of my suggestions was that it would be nice to have a nut plate or some sort of mounting tab to mount lights on the ROPS as it came from the factory. I pointed out that a lot of people were drilling or welding something to accomplish this (and to support cupholders and the like). In the interest of safety, having something already there for the purpose would make a lot of sense.

They did write down my suggestion, but I never did see it appear on any of their CUTs. I'm assuming that this is easier said than done. As soon as they drill or weld, they've got a more complicated system to do the safety tests on, and another area of quality control to keep an eye on. Any screw up in the manufacturing process, and they've opened themselves up to significant liability.

John Mc

 

[thingy]

Mike,that don't make much sense to me anyways. Number one,,it don't work that way in welding,,if you don't know what material it is and how they welded it,,[filler,preheat,interpass,postheat etc],you can't just assume you can get your mig out and weld it with whatever.Not really talking rops here,cause I know you can weld on them,,just your theory is all.
And number 2,don't all rops have a welded plate of somekind on bottoms to bolt to tractor,,mine does. thingy

 

[MikePA]

Number one,,it don't work that way in welding,,if you don't know what material it is and how they welded it,,[filler,preheat,interpass,postheat etc],you can't just assume you can get your mig out and weld it with whatever.

In other words, if someone doesn't know all this, they should not weld anything to the ROPS.

not really talking rops here,cause I know you can weld on them,,just your theory is all.

I didn't present any theory. I presented a fact. It is possible to safely weld on the ROPS because the factory welds hinges on the square stock that makes up the ROPS.

 

[thingy]

Of course you can weld on anything Mike,,its just you gotta know what your welding on,,it could be 9 percent chrome,[it looks just like steel],in a case like that you gotta know how to weld it,what to weld it with,etc. Some things gotta be stressed relieved,,after welding or you'll get cracks,,some things gotta be preheated to a high temp,and cooled at a very slow rate,,,the list goes on,,,so just cause you see a weld on something that looks like steel,don't mean you could just go ahead and weld on it,,thats what I was calling your theory.
Anyways,,way back on first page I think,the guy said he was going to bolt it on someway,,,so,,,,thingy

 

[MikePA]

I give up.

 

[thingy]

No,I wanna give up first,,,[you are all right mike],,thingy

 

[Soundguy]

Roy.. in case you don't know by now.. You are simply 'P' - ing in the wind if you try to have a rational debate with thingy.

For this scenerio.. he simply doesn't ( or refuses to ) understand that reguardless of whethere a persons weld does or doesn't actually weaken the structure.. the fact of the matter is that it will almost certaintly void the rops certification.. and with that gone.. that opens up an entire can of worms as you and many others point out.

I've argued the same on many threads in years past... It usually ends up with 2 factions... The people that feel it is fine to cut/weld/drill the rops.. and those that fell that you shouldn't.. reguardless of IF it does weaken them or not. Somewhere along the way there are usually hard feelings and the terms 'wussy' and safety police get thrown around.. and then that funny padlock symbol shows up on the thread after it hits about 5 pages in just a few hours.

FWIW.. I agree with you 100%.. there's simply no 'good' reason to modify the rops for a light bar when a clmap on one is SOOOOO easy to add, and doesn't violate the no cut/drill/weld certification on the rops...

Soundguy

"Roy,of course thats the reason people asks questions,,,I ask some myself,,but its nice to get the right answer,,this has evolved into a legal issue with manufactor,not if the guy can weld a light bracket onto his roll bar,,there may be reasons he don't want to,,just saying from a welding point of view,they ain't one,,,and again,that was the question."

The manufacturers state it, safety organizations state it...Don't modify the ROPS
Thingy, unless you've done testing per the SAE spec...you really can't state welding doesn't degrade the ROPS because you don't know.

Reckon that's all I say on this topic... It's going in circles now.

 

[thingy]

Soundman,is that you? Talk about 2 cents,,,,just kidding you soundman,your my favorite! THINGY

 

[AlanB]

Actually, I've already done that, at least with New Holland. A couple of years ago, my dealer asked if I would be willing to speak with a couple of NH engineers who were visiting the area and wanted to speak with owners about how they were using their tractors and what they liked or disliked about it. Of course I jumped at the chance. One of my suggestions was that it would be nice to have a nut plate or some sort of mounting tab to mount lights on the ROPS as it came from the factory. I pointed out that a lot of people were drilling or welding something to accomplish this (and to support cupholders and the like). In the interest of safety, having something already there for the purpose would make a lot of sense.

They did write down my suggestion, but I never did see it appear on any of their CUTs. I'm assuming that this is easier said than done. As soon as they drill or weld, they've got a more complicated system to do the safety tests on, and another area of quality control to keep an eye on. Any screw up in the manufacturing process, and they've opened themselves up to significant liability.

John Mc

I do not really know this as a fact, but more as an "informed guess"

I doubt they would want "extra" tabs etc on there for folks to mount their own stuff on, as they would then not have control over what got mounted. While most here would mount something logical, usefull and reasonable, there would end up being some court case where some guy mounted a boom pole off the rops attachment brackets and rendered his rops unuseable.

 

[schmism]

I dont know why im feeding the trolls but for some reason i find myself doing so.

Have you actually LOOKED at your ROPS? I know mine is welded on from the factory.

You think the factory goes to all the trouble of re-heat treating the ENTIRE structure after they have modified it themselves?

Ill be welding brackets on mine for various things. I have no worries about it affecting the structural intregraty of the ROPS.

 

[thingy]

schism,you must be talking to me,,if so we are on the same side here,you need to go back and read from the beginning my man.
And to answer your question,no they wouldn't post heat treat it after they welded on it if it needed post heat treatment,they would weld things on and postheat the whole thing than paint it and bolt it on.
You seem to have gotton in on the middle of the conversation,,my postion was it wasn't made out of anything really special and it wouldn't require post heat treatment, you buddy thingy