Rust on our new BX2660
- Thread starter Dunlapjc
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mrtfelton
Member
The owner does not need permission to void the contract. He can do it now if he wants. Sounds like he is making you do his job with the sales rep.. Get a lawyer.
Here the latest news:
The dealership called late this afternoon. They said my request for a new tractor was "denied"
They said they had been in converstations with Kubota and the president of the dealership and that they felt their repairs to the unit were sufficient and did not justify a new unit.
I calmly explained that I found this unacceptable and wanted the denial in writing. I also wanted the names and contact information for each individual responsible for the decision both at Kubota and the dealership.
I also took that moment to explain that I'm a materials science engineer who works in the automotive industry and am intimately familiar with the salt spray validation testing requirements for ground vehicles including the John Deere JDS 117 spec. which clearly outlines the requirements for no white or red corrosion.
I told him I did not think I was being unreasonable to want a tractor that did not suffer from both mechanical and corrosion issues in the first seven hours, and I was willing to escelate the issue.
After we hung up, I emailed back asking again for the decision in writing, along with the key decision makers and their contact information. I asked if it was still an option to cancel the sale. I referenced this thread on tractorbynet, and requested to setup a conference call (which I can facillitate) during the business day tomorrow.
I am more than willing to take this to litigation, but I'm still hoping it won't come to that.
I also don't think that Kubota or this dealership want's the bad press that this thread has created with over 2k views. Nothing would make more happy than to come back here and report that the dealership and Kubota have agreed to make the situation right with a new tractor.
So tomorrow I wait to hear back from the dealership with a time that works for a conf. call. I'm also going to independantly now seek out "Larry" the regional Kubota representative for central NH.
Wish me luck,
-Jonathan
The dealership called late this afternoon. They said my request for a new tractor was "denied"
They said they had been in converstations with Kubota and the president of the dealership and that they felt their repairs to the unit were sufficient and did not justify a new unit.
I calmly explained that I found this unacceptable and wanted the denial in writing. I also wanted the names and contact information for each individual responsible for the decision both at Kubota and the dealership.
I also took that moment to explain that I'm a materials science engineer who works in the automotive industry and am intimately familiar with the salt spray validation testing requirements for ground vehicles including the John Deere JDS 117 spec. which clearly outlines the requirements for no white or red corrosion.
I told him I did not think I was being unreasonable to want a tractor that did not suffer from both mechanical and corrosion issues in the first seven hours, and I was willing to escelate the issue.
After we hung up, I emailed back asking again for the decision in writing, along with the key decision makers and their contact information. I asked if it was still an option to cancel the sale. I referenced this thread on tractorbynet, and requested to setup a conference call (which I can facillitate) during the business day tomorrow.
I am more than willing to take this to litigation, but I'm still hoping it won't come to that.
I also don't think that Kubota or this dealership want's the bad press that this thread has created with over 2k views. Nothing would make more happy than to come back here and report that the dealership and Kubota have agreed to make the situation right with a new tractor.
So tomorrow I wait to hear back from the dealership with a time that works for a conf. call. I'm also going to independantly now seek out "Larry" the regional Kubota representative for central NH.
Wish me luck,
-Jonathan
newbury
Super Star Member
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2009
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- 14,842
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- From Vt, in Va, retiring to MS
- Tractor
- Kubota's - B7610, M4700
You started this thread with:
You are an "engineer... familar with the salt spray validation.." and corrosion, how did you miss it? Did they cover it up?
When you returned and
You posted in another thread that at first you were looking at paying a lot more than others were paying, then in this thread you posted you got a good deal.
Now you want a
It seems you did not pay full price, had ample opportunity to view the equipment, have not suggested that they switched equipment on you, have now compared it to actual new equipment and don't like the deal you received. The dealer came out and picked it up (around my area that would be a $150 truck roll) and repainted it to better condition than what is still sitting on his lot. What about the leak?
By all means take it to litigation, my wife's an attorney and all attorneys need work. It's part of the FEL Act (Full Employment for Lawyers). Litigation is the way of the country. But you should calculate how much litigation will cost in time, money, and dealership relationships versus what you will gain.
If your dealer leaves the equipment out in the weather and you can see it's rusted and faded, that's bad, but it's his equipment. If you buy it you bought it,
To answer your original questions:
1. A little
2. I'd expect him to maybe send someone out to touch it up.
good luck.
Then you discovered rust on delivery.
You are an "engineer... familar with the salt spray validation.." and corrosion, how did you miss it? Did they cover it up?
When you returned and
. Is the dealer not going to paint all of those?
You posted in another thread that at first you were looking at paying a lot more than others were paying, then in this thread you posted you got a good deal.
Now you want a
Have you offered to pay full price?
It seems you did not pay full price, had ample opportunity to view the equipment, have not suggested that they switched equipment on you, have now compared it to actual new equipment and don't like the deal you received. The dealer came out and picked it up (around my area that would be a $150 truck roll) and repainted it to better condition than what is still sitting on his lot. What about the leak?
By all means take it to litigation, my wife's an attorney and all attorneys need work. It's part of the FEL Act (Full Employment for Lawyers). Litigation is the way of the country. But you should calculate how much litigation will cost in time, money, and dealership relationships versus what you will gain.
If your dealer leaves the equipment out in the weather and you can see it's rusted and faded, that's bad, but it's his equipment. If you buy it you bought it,
To answer your original questions:
1. A little
2. I'd expect him to maybe send someone out to touch it up.
good luck.
Newbury,
You're entitled to your opinion, and I respect your input. I feel I got a fair deal. Not the best I've read on here, not the worst. I didn't pay "sticker" price, but I haven't found anyone on here who has.
I think one of the most frustrating aspects has been a lack of communiation. The dealership said, "She's all fixed" We used some new parts, and fixed others.
The engineer in me wants to know:
-Which parts were replaced
-Which parts were repaired
-Will they guarantee the corrosion repairs
-Why did the seal fail? Did sitting for 9 months have anytihng to do with it?
The lack of communication has been frustrating.
I would have been satisfied with repairing the rust until I started finding evidence of exposure everywhere. When you pull the nut off the radiator screen, there's white galvanic corrosion from the trivalent chromium plating deteriorating on multiple surfaces. More on the mower deck when you pull the plastic shroud off with the insert molded nut. That stud and washer are all white and crusty. When you pulled up the floor mat rubber you saw sand, fine dirt, and a lot of crud from sitting out.
To me, I do not see a difference between this purchase and a new car. Heck, this cost more than a lot of new cars. It's my opinion that whether or not I paid full sticker price for a new car, I'm still buying a new car. And if you got this car home and discovered these things, most would be sending it back as well.
We would be in a totally different situation if this dealership had said, we'll sell you this tractor for X, but you should know that it's been here since November and has some exposure on it...
But when they say "new" tractor, I expect new. To me, new means both 0 hours and 0 years of exposure to the elements.
-Jonathan
You're entitled to your opinion, and I respect your input. I feel I got a fair deal. Not the best I've read on here, not the worst. I didn't pay "sticker" price, but I haven't found anyone on here who has.
I think one of the most frustrating aspects has been a lack of communiation. The dealership said, "She's all fixed" We used some new parts, and fixed others.
The engineer in me wants to know:
-Which parts were replaced
-Which parts were repaired
-Will they guarantee the corrosion repairs
-Why did the seal fail? Did sitting for 9 months have anytihng to do with it?
The lack of communication has been frustrating.
I would have been satisfied with repairing the rust until I started finding evidence of exposure everywhere. When you pull the nut off the radiator screen, there's white galvanic corrosion from the trivalent chromium plating deteriorating on multiple surfaces. More on the mower deck when you pull the plastic shroud off with the insert molded nut. That stud and washer are all white and crusty. When you pulled up the floor mat rubber you saw sand, fine dirt, and a lot of crud from sitting out.
To me, I do not see a difference between this purchase and a new car. Heck, this cost more than a lot of new cars. It's my opinion that whether or not I paid full sticker price for a new car, I'm still buying a new car. And if you got this car home and discovered these things, most would be sending it back as well.
We would be in a totally different situation if this dealership had said, we'll sell you this tractor for X, but you should know that it's been here since November and has some exposure on it...
But when they say "new" tractor, I expect new. To me, new means both 0 hours and 0 years of exposure to the elements.
-Jonathan
BlacknTan
Platinum Member
Your dealer and Kubota should make this right!
Word of mouth is your best weapon in this type of situation.. I don't know how you feel about naming the dealer, but I for one would appreciate knowing so I know never to do business there if this is not rectified...
PM me if necessary..
Word of mouth is your best weapon in this type of situation.. I don't know how you feel about naming the dealer, but I for one would appreciate knowing so I know never to do business there if this is not rectified...
PM me if necessary..
dodge man
Super Star Member
This is a tough one. There seems to be a lot of people on this board that say a tractor get used as a tool and problems like yours should be ignored. Then there is another group who takes good care of their machine and won't tolerate that kind of condition on a new tractor. There was a really good thread a few months ago about someone who had a brand new BX and the welds on the loader were not very good. At first it looked like he was just being picky, but after he posted a few more pictures, it appeared the welds might be weak. A good number of people thought he was being to picky. He got a new loader out of the deal, but it took some time.
In your case, they have tried to fix it. The one photo shows what appears to be damage on the ROPS, if they fixed that fairly well, I would live with the way the tractor is. I might not be happy with it, but is it worth the hassle to get a different tractor?
In your case, they have tried to fix it. The one photo shows what appears to be damage on the ROPS, if they fixed that fairly well, I would live with the way the tractor is. I might not be happy with it, but is it worth the hassle to get a different tractor?
mrtfelton
Member
newbury.... do you work for that dealer or something?
Ken45101
Elite Member
- Joined
- Feb 14, 2009
- Messages
- 3,679
- Location
- southern Ohio
- Tractor
- Kubota M5040, M9540, B21 TLB, B2710, RTV900, JD 325 Skid steer, KX-121-3 mini excavator
FWIW, I was looking at a M7040 demo unit (2006) with 30 hours on it. It had a few spots of rust. I mentioned this to the salesman and he said they would take care of that under warranty before it was delivered.
shownuff
Gold Member
possiby this unit was damaged ,or left out in a major storm -ie katrina- already claimed on insurance or some kind of payment was paid out and they are trying to pass it on as new? just my 0.02
Good Morning all,
After my request was denied, I called Kubota's Northeast Regional office directly, and spoke with some friendly people.
24 hours later, I got a call from the dealership saying that Kubota had talked with them, and that the dealership was going to cancel my contract and take back the tractor. The dealerships position was that this was still a good tractor, and since they repaired it, it ws "better than new." They also told me I was free to do business with other dealerships.
So, it's not exactly the outcome of a "new tractor," but it will allow me to do that with a different dealership. I got the sense that the dealership had had it with me, so this is probably a good outcome overall. I'll start a relationship with a different dealer, all of 10 miles away further from my house...
Thank you everyone for your comments, support and insight. I'm a tad wiser now, and I guess you can teach old dogs new tricks...
-Jonathan
After my request was denied, I called Kubota's Northeast Regional office directly, and spoke with some friendly people.
24 hours later, I got a call from the dealership saying that Kubota had talked with them, and that the dealership was going to cancel my contract and take back the tractor. The dealerships position was that this was still a good tractor, and since they repaired it, it ws "better than new." They also told me I was free to do business with other dealerships.
So, it's not exactly the outcome of a "new tractor," but it will allow me to do that with a different dealership. I got the sense that the dealership had had it with me, so this is probably a good outcome overall. I'll start a relationship with a different dealer, all of 10 miles away further from my house...
Thank you everyone for your comments, support and insight. I'm a tad wiser now, and I guess you can teach old dogs new tricks...
-Jonathan
harpoonalt
Gold Member
So this tractor has had the obvious corrosion covered over and will now be sold to someone else who may not look underneath and inside things? If they try and pass that tractor off as brand new condition, they should be ashamed. Once rust starts, it continues on and hiding it doesn't make it as good as new, let alone better. I wouldn't touch that tractor due to the unknowns of how far the rust has penetrated critical parts. Good news your contract was canceled, better news would be that Kubota was concerned enough to find out how the tractor came to be in that shape and aknowledge that a tractor in that condition should not be sold as new and the condition should be disclosed to all potential buyers.
Toyota just recalled a bunch of trucks with rusty frames. My brother got way more money than his truck was worth and some good incentives to buy a new one. I'm impressed with how it was handled and Toyota tops my list when we buy a new car. Any company will treat you well when you're buying. The true measure of a company in my mind is how you're treated when you have a problem.
Toyota just recalled a bunch of trucks with rusty frames. My brother got way more money than his truck was worth and some good incentives to buy a new one. I'm impressed with how it was handled and Toyota tops my list when we buy a new car. Any company will treat you well when you're buying. The true measure of a company in my mind is how you're treated when you have a problem.
BlacknTan
Platinum Member
Good for you!
Great job staying with the problem and making both parties do the right thing.. Good for Kubota for hearing your problems and making it right!
The dealer seems to have taken a silly position... Cutting off his nose to spite his face. Better you find it out now and take your business elsewhere, rather than be saddled with a poor dealer for as long as you owned your tractor..
Sounds like a win for you, and a win for Kubota... As for your dealer, a big goose egg!
dodge man
Super Star Member
Good deal, I'm glad it worked out for you and I hope you work out another deal for a BX.
mrtfelton
Member
When a business loses sight of their customer and only sees $$$$, they want be there long. Just look at how many people have viewed this thread about rust on a new tractor vs other threads. Customers don't like problems from the get go and this dealer needs their name brought up for the fine service you got...
mcd176
Gold Member
Dunlapjc,
I am happy for you, I feel that you were more than patient with the dealer! Good luck with the new dealer.
-Mike
I am happy for you, I feel that you were more than patient with the dealer! Good luck with the new dealer.
-Mike
whitedogone
Gold Member
whitedogone
Gold Member
One of the reasons I sold my Kubota machine was the rust and the $hitty fading paint. No such problems with our 5 year old Deere.
