Inspector507
Super Member
His next letter just MAY come from the State.
Sales Taxes...GOTCHA
- Thread starter drcollie
- Start date
- Views: 7258
I'll be the third to agree to sending the $ directly to the state. Be aware there could be penalties, check with someone to find out. If you know someone who can legally advise you reasonably, ask. It would seem to me that you took delivery for a taxable item in state, for use in state, with full knowledge of the item being invoiced to a ficticious address for the sole purpose of avoiding state sales tax. I'd have a hard time convincing anyone that the dealer is the only one swinging in the wind on this one. Good luck.
MadDog
Platinum Member
FWIW, I live in Massachusetts and recently bought my B7800 from a dealer in Vermont. He expressly disclosed at the outset that he would have to collect the Mass 5% sales tax even though the tractor was being delivered to me here in Mass. His honesty was one of the reasons I bought from him. Also, the fact that he is obligated to collect the sales tax for Mass suggests that some states, at least, have compacts with neighboring states to get mutual enforcement of their sales tax laws.
...somethin' to think about when buying out of state; I did because the price was far better, even though there was no saving on sales tax.
Incidentally, I basically agree w/Don that, while Duane has some potential exposure here, the dealer deserves to be in much deeper sh*t because he proposed and orchestrated the avoidance, should have known better, and should have "bitten the bullet" by either lowering his price or losing the sale. Poor ole Duane, after all, just succumbed to the temptation to close his eyes to what the dealer was doin' and go along with it. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
...somethin' to think about when buying out of state; I did because the price was far better, even though there was no saving on sales tax.
Incidentally, I basically agree w/Don that, while Duane has some potential exposure here, the dealer deserves to be in much deeper sh*t because he proposed and orchestrated the avoidance, should have known better, and should have "bitten the bullet" by either lowering his price or losing the sale. Poor ole Duane, after all, just succumbed to the temptation to close his eyes to what the dealer was doin' and go along with it. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
JDgreen227
Super Member
Thanks for sharing your experience, too frequently a new tractor owner will post and say "because I am buying out of state, I don't have to pay sales tax..."
I will agree with the other replies, DO NOT remit any type of payment to the dealer. If your version of the facts is true and you were told by the dealer "I'll take care of the sales tax", I hope you know who made that statement so you can report your version of the transaction. Sad to say, any fraud commited by the dealership doesn't excuse you from your legal obligation to pay sales and/or use tax.
If I were in your place, I would remit the sales tax directly to your state's taxing authority with a cover letter of explanation.
Good luck, and I hope you avoid any penalties.
I will agree with the other replies, DO NOT remit any type of payment to the dealer. If your version of the facts is true and you were told by the dealer "I'll take care of the sales tax", I hope you know who made that statement so you can report your version of the transaction. Sad to say, any fraud commited by the dealership doesn't excuse you from your legal obligation to pay sales and/or use tax.
If I were in your place, I would remit the sales tax directly to your state's taxing authority with a cover letter of explanation.
Good luck, and I hope you avoid any penalties.
755inNY
Platinum Member
- Joined
- Jul 4, 2003
- Messages
- 530
- Tractor
- JD 4310, ehydro, 4WD, R4s
Duane,
I agree with the other's. I would not sign anything the dealer sent you. Do the right thing and pay the tax. If nothing else it will be the cheapest way out; you don't want the State on your case for $742. I would not just turn over the money to the dealer. I'm no legal expert, but I would insist on a revised bill of sale listing the correct delivery location, the sales tax and marked paid. You need documented proof that you paid the sales tax to the dealer.
You could try making the dealer pay the tax but I think you will end up in a "he said/she said" situation. The dealer will say that the delivery information came from you and you accepted the invoice and delivery as written. Did you sign anything when the tractor was delivered acknowledging you received the goods? Most places have you sign something.
My great State of NY now has a line on the <font color="red"> Income Tax </font> form to list sales tax not paid on out of state purchases. They are going after internet sales. You can't just leave the line blank. If you want to claim zero, you have to enter zero and then sign the form. They do make it easy for us. If you did not keep track of receipts, you can enter an amount from a table based on annual income.
Good Luck!
Jeff
I agree with the other's. I would not sign anything the dealer sent you. Do the right thing and pay the tax. If nothing else it will be the cheapest way out; you don't want the State on your case for $742. I would not just turn over the money to the dealer. I'm no legal expert, but I would insist on a revised bill of sale listing the correct delivery location, the sales tax and marked paid. You need documented proof that you paid the sales tax to the dealer.
You could try making the dealer pay the tax but I think you will end up in a "he said/she said" situation. The dealer will say that the delivery information came from you and you accepted the invoice and delivery as written. Did you sign anything when the tractor was delivered acknowledging you received the goods? Most places have you sign something.
My great State of NY now has a line on the <font color="red"> Income Tax </font> form to list sales tax not paid on out of state purchases. They are going after internet sales. You can't just leave the line blank. If you want to claim zero, you have to enter zero and then sign the form. They do make it easy for us. If you did not keep track of receipts, you can enter an amount from a table based on annual income.
Good Luck!
Jeff
lablovers
Silver Member
I believe there is a legitimate difference between an Internet Purchase, which I believe in most states does not require sales tax. This sales transaction was not handled via the internet but was a deliberate intent to use a bogus delivery address to avoid sales tax. If I purchase something in another state, then I expect to pay that states sales tax.
Lablovers
Lablovers
Tractors4u
Elite Member
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2002
- Messages
- 2,540
- Location
- Athens Alabama
- Tractor
- Deere 4310, Kubota L355, John Deere SST18 Spin Steer, 2006 Polaris Ranger
I kind of agree with OkeeDon on this one, but if it does come down to you having to pay tax wait until you get a letter from the state asking for it. Not to be dishonest but to insure that they know that the got the money. Being in the National Guard I heard of a Chaplain that was paid twice for an active duty school that he went to. Being the honest man that he was he mailed one of the checks back and thought all was well until the Army came asking for the money they over payed. Don't give them the money until they ask for it or you will only confuse the state.
Unless you receive a tax bill from the state, I would not send any money to anyone. The dealer is obligated to pay the taxes to the state as they are the ones who delivered the tractor to you and they knew where you lived. As you were told, "I'll take care of the tax" I'm sure you assumed he was reducing the price by that much to compete. Only upon examination of the delivery slip did you notice the address and just thought it was a mistake of no concern, right? Without a bill from the state, sending it in to them, even with a letter of explanation would not remove liability. I think it's better to just wait and see. The dealer is going to be made to pay that tax if you don't sign anything, or the state will send you a bill. Either way, no money to anyone now, and only to the state if you are billed. John
755inNY
Platinum Member
- Joined
- Jul 4, 2003
- Messages
- 530
- Tractor
- JD 4310, ehydro, 4WD, R4s
<font color="blue"> I believe there is a legitimate difference between an Internet Purchase, which I believe in most states does not require sales tax. </font>
To the contrary, Lablovers, most states place the burden on the buyer for paying sales taxes not collected by the seller. In NY, if I buy something from out of state, and no sales tax was charged, it is my responsibility to remit the sales tax to the state. If sales tax was charged but at a lower rate than levied in NY, I am responsible to remit the difference.
You can see in my previous post that we must now disclose this on our State Income Tax return. This is just the beginning. The State will start collecting information from major internet retailers and match it up with tax returns. With the age of electronic data (seller's records, shipper's records, credit card records), it is not impossible for the State to gather information. I recently bought an airplane kit from a dealer in Florida. I took delivery in Florida and transported it home myself. I registered the unfinished plane with the FAA to reserve my preferred registration number (unlike cars the airplane registration fee is a one time thing). A few months later I received a letter from my state taxation office looking for their sales tax. Apparently they scan the FAA registration records or get a direct dump. I had paid the sales tax in Florida, which was the same rate as NY. I sent in a copy of my invoice and that was the last I heard of it.
I would caution Duane from sending payment directly to the state without first having an iron clad method of linking your payment to the tractor sales tax obligaiton. Sending in a payment blindly to the state beauracracy could get it lost for a long time. Tax guys usually don't wait for errors to be worked out. As far as they are concerned, if they don't have proof you paid, you owe it NOW.
Jeff
To the contrary, Lablovers, most states place the burden on the buyer for paying sales taxes not collected by the seller. In NY, if I buy something from out of state, and no sales tax was charged, it is my responsibility to remit the sales tax to the state. If sales tax was charged but at a lower rate than levied in NY, I am responsible to remit the difference.
You can see in my previous post that we must now disclose this on our State Income Tax return. This is just the beginning. The State will start collecting information from major internet retailers and match it up with tax returns. With the age of electronic data (seller's records, shipper's records, credit card records), it is not impossible for the State to gather information. I recently bought an airplane kit from a dealer in Florida. I took delivery in Florida and transported it home myself. I registered the unfinished plane with the FAA to reserve my preferred registration number (unlike cars the airplane registration fee is a one time thing). A few months later I received a letter from my state taxation office looking for their sales tax. Apparently they scan the FAA registration records or get a direct dump. I had paid the sales tax in Florida, which was the same rate as NY. I sent in a copy of my invoice and that was the last I heard of it.
I would caution Duane from sending payment directly to the state without first having an iron clad method of linking your payment to the tractor sales tax obligaiton. Sending in a payment blindly to the state beauracracy could get it lost for a long time. Tax guys usually don't wait for errors to be worked out. As far as they are concerned, if they don't have proof you paid, you owe it NOW.
Jeff
frank_f15
Super Member, Rest in Peace
i would not sign that paper, u are then notorizing a false statment. i also would not send them a check, i also would not send a check to the state tax dept . even with a cover letter, all that is going to do is raise all kinds of flags. now if the STATE sent u that notice it would be different. and if the state does come after you, expailn what happened , pay the tax and the penaltys, and go from there.