Secrets to car buying anyone?

Av8r3400 · Apr 28, 2005

Advise from someone who was in the business: Do not be emotional about buying a vehicle, be scientific and logical. Emotional purchases will loose you money

Educate yourself on all manufacturer rebates, discounts and invoice pricing. Rebates etc. will be applicable on DELIVERY, not when you order, so if they expire before you get your car, you loose out.

Using this information, tell the dealer what you are willing to pay and stick to it. Blind bidding games will get you highballed and not treated seriously. Along with allot of excess BS.

Educate yourself on what your trade is REALLY worth. The NADA Guide is the industry standard  NOT KELLY BLUE BOOK  ! Do not mention trade-ins until the deal is made. Then be willing to sell your trade by yourself if you don't like the offer. Just because your trade is valuable to you, does not make it valuable in the car market, be realistic.

Dealers DO NOT make their money on new car sales. Their money is made on used cars, service department and the "back-end" products they sell you in the finance office. 3% return on new car sales is not enough to keep the doors open.

Know your credit status and get an offer from your bank before accepting anything from a dealer. Finance managers are BS artists and will steal you blind if you are not careful.

NEVER BUY ANYTHING IN THE FINANCE OFFICE! Markup on warranties, undercoating, paint/interior products is in the  THOUSANDS OF PERCENT! Also be leery of financing deals offered to you at the dealer by local banks, the local bank itself will usually beat the dealer's offer. Often the dealer negotiates "sweetheart" deals with the bank, then adds on a couple of points, passes it on to their customers and pockets the difference.

ByronBob · Apr 28, 2005

But doesn't the dealer have the right to say no? You say we shouldn't kill the dealer but doesn't he kill us if he can?

getut · Apr 28, 2005

I'm gonna say this with a poke in the rib and a wink-wink.

I'm hearing all these hardball negotiating tactics from some of the same people who advocate getting buddy-buddy with the tractor salesman. Both are out to eat you alive anywhere they can.

If a dealer, car, tractor, or florist chooses to give me his product for Christmas.. I'll be buddy-buddy all he wants.. otherwise its a business deal and I expect them to be honest about it. Try to eat me alive and I won't be back. Give me a good honest deal and I'll thank the dealer for it.

I typically refuse to haggle. I don't need the pressure in my life. I tell them what I want, when I'm gonna get it and that I have told x other dealers about it also. Call me at X phone number with the best deal if you want the sale.

rrsquid · Apr 28, 2005

I like this website: http://www.carsdirect.com/. They are probably not the absolute best price ever, but they do so a final price and you can get an idea of where the price should be. Last time I bought a new car I looked it up, printed it out and told the dealer if he couldn't match that price, I'd order it from there. From test drive to drive away was probably not much more than 1/2 hour.

Don't forget dealer make money on loan/warranties and all kinds of other places.

--
Mark

Dargo · Apr 28, 2005

( NEVER BUY ANYTHING IN THE FINANCE OFFICE! )

Hmm, I will have to respectfully disagree. As has been mentioned, it is true that most profit at a car dealership is made on used vehicles. This is almost always the case. That is a fair assessment. However, you cannot always say that is the case without exception. The same thing goes for the finance office.

The prudent buyer will research the frequency and severity of repairs on the vehicle they want to purchase. Then, based on those figures, weigh the negotiated price of the service contract on that vehicle with the average statistical ownership repair expense. To be accurate, that calculation would have to not only include the actuarial data of frequency, and severity, but also the average parts price, the most frequently needed replacement part, the average hourly labor rate, as well as a properly calculated algorithm that would, within reason, accurately predict the anticipated future parts and labor cost for the duration of the contemplated service contract. It is a fact that service contract companies frequently take a pretty heavy risk on several models. Several have gone under due to improperly reserving for risk. I will step out on a limb, and I will say to never purchase a service contract from a company that is not fully insured or that is "insured" by a RRG (risk retention group). Where, you may ask, can you find that information? The easiest place is on the internet, or a easily gotten publication such as Consumer's Reports. If you like a vehicle that they "predict" to be considerably below average on reliability, you may want to try to negotiate the price of a service contract into that purchase.

Now, you may want to argue that you wouldn't want to buy a vehicle that doesn't have anything but the best repair history. Well, last year that was the Infinity Q45. If you were buying that vehicle or several others in a similar category on the actuarial charts, I'd advise against a service contract purchase.

However, anybody ever buy a Jeep, a Chevy Blazer, a Ford Windstar, or a Mitsubishi product? I can list several others as well that are historically have pretty nasty actuarial statistics on repairs. If you like one of those vehicles and want to buy one, it would could be a financially a prudent move to purchase a service contract on one of those if you can negotiate a reasonable price for the contract, and if the contract is from a reputable company who pays their claims and is honored nationally. And, this doesn't even take into consideration how hard you use your vehicle, how well you maintain your vehicle, and whether you intend to keep the vehicle long after the warranty and or service contract expires. These issues also could play a part in whether the purchase would be wise or not.

Although your comments about the finance office are well intended, and can even be accurate for the most part, you cannot reasonably say never buy anything from the finance manager. Although you would be correct most of the time, the statement cannot be exclusive of all variants. Since I have the actuarial statistics on most all vehicles, and a lot of tractors, I could give a fairly large list of vehicles and tractors that statistically would look like a poor decision to buy. Again, those are only statistics and averages. They would not hold true to every unit. One cannot use such a broad brush to paint a statement that would include the word "never".

DocHeb · Apr 28, 2005

You must read Confessions of a Car Salesman from Edmunds.com. They sent a writer in as an undercover car salesman for several months, and he tells a pretty graphic story of what really happens. It will take a while to read the whole article, but I think it would be well worth your time.

Darren · Apr 28, 2005

It doesn't look like anyone has mentioned timing. There's the obvious end of season deals but you may luck out by buying at the end of a month. If the dealership hasn't made quota in the last day or two, that's when you'll get the best deal.

Shop around and get the prices mid-month at several dealers. Then ask the salesman to call you if they can do better before the end of the month.

KENB · Apr 28, 2005

Okay, I'll chime in too here. Go to the motleyfool website and read about doing a "FAX-A-THON". I did it on my last car purchase and it worked great for me. Paid $500 under the so called "dealer invoice". I got the deal that has been said could not be gotten. With a fax-a-thon, you can be in and out of the dealership in about 15-20 minutes with your new car. Read about it. It can be fun, and save you some money. Never go in the dealership and try to work a good deal. You're playing their game with their rules and you will loose. Try the fax-a-thon. It works.

PineRidge · Apr 28, 2005

Letting the dealer talk to you about invoice is the best way to get ripped that I know of.

If you first find out which car that you want, and with the options that you want then purchase a report from Consumer Reports on-line for that particular make and model.

The report will tell you what the dealer actually pays for the vehicle and it will also spell out all the spiffs, hold-backs, and extra money that the dealer gets from the manufacturer.

It will give you a price range for that particular make equipped as you want it with a fair price range that you should be able to purchase the car for.

I used the report to get the best price that I could and it saved a LOT of the back and forth games that the dealerships like to play.

Most of the work was done over the phone since we already knew the bottom line.

We were in a position to offer the dealership a fair price for the vehicle based upon figures already supplied to us from Consumer Reports.

Granted a few dealerships balked at our offer but more than one were also willing to deal with us and we came away with the new car that we wanted at a price that we were willing to pay.

I believe that Consumer Reports said that they save roughly $1500.00 to $2000.00 per person who use the reports for their auto purchase. I think their saving estimate is right on the money. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

froggy · Apr 28, 2005

I read the article and found it interesting. Had heard or read about much of it before. The thing that got my interest was the part about using the intercom on the phone as a listening device.

My wife just picked up her new Audi A4 Quattro day before yesterday. We ordered it three months ago and you would think that the paperwork would be ready we showed up with the check, but no they still had to screw around and take an hour before we left. She said she cannot wait to fill the survey about her experience with the sales staff and the finance guy. They are getting "Fs" in all categories.

The service department is great, but sales is the pits.